Do you think that cheating at poker is a TOS violation

When playing poker, I have frequently become suspicious that some people were cheating. Don't ask me how I think they are managing to cheat, or why I supect certain players of doing it, and certain casinos are turning a blind eye to it. If you want to inquire by email (gianniarossini@yahoo.com) as to which casino I no longer go to, I would answer that.

My question is: if people use outside communication tools to coordinate their efforts towards a common goal in a roleplaying sim - that is probably not even considered cheating by most people. But, if the roleplaying game they are playing is poker for cash stakes - does that change the issue?

Is it really cheating? Is it even immoral? Would it be a TOS violation?

So you are saying they were using MSN or Skype or even SL's own IM to compare hands and set one another up for the win?

That's been done the moment gambling was introduced.

Mandy C

OMG That's a great thought. I was thinking of checking out a poker establishment or two, but this gives me second thoughts.

Oh c'mon Brenda, let's play poker tonight and keep in touch on MSN...it'll be fun!

Mandy C

Yeah and we can get caught , and wind up wearing Cement Prim Pumps and Sleeping with the Virtual Fishes.....

never play poker in sl unless you want to loose all your money


it WAY WAY WAY to easy to cheat


Ever see a REAL LIFE poker room that allowed you to whisper to other players?

ever see a REAL ONLINE poker room that had Instant Messaging?

LOL


Poker in sl = Empty poketbook = 4 alts playin at same table vs you = you broke


on REAL online poker sites you CAN NOT choose what table to sit at, and sit with your friends, its randomlly assigned to prevent ppl from using SKYPE or YAHOO or whatever

No real poker player would ever THINK for a moment to be able to play on SL

unless your the cheater

then you would play all the time

and win every hand

Ok, those coffee stains on my monitor are getting annoying...

Mandy C

I told you to stop drinking Coffee

You have two entirely different issues here. Yes, there is less chance you are going to be cheated at a real online casino. But, most of the people playing there are good. Too good for me to want to play against. On SL, I started hanging around casinos to generate escort work, until I noticed how many bad players there are here. I think there is so much pigeon money in the pots, it's hard not to win. To me, no "real real poker player" can easily turn her back on a table full of pigeons with cash. You just have to be vigilent against cheaters and willing to get up and walk away when you have justified suspiscions. In fact, I find watching out for cheaters to make the game a little more interesting.

*sighs* Ok, ok....

*makes tea*

Mandy C

i doubt linden would involve themselves in any kind of poker dispute. i dont think the tos would come into play. i dont even think linden would get involved if a major vendor creator decided to steal every $ from every vendor owner and then cash out. linden would cut them a cheque without a second thought.

It is cheating, it is severely unethical, but it is not insurmountable. If you are at a table with 8 people and two of them are cheaters, this does mean that they have a slightly better idea of the odds, yes, but it doesn't guarantee either of them the winning hand. Really obvious cheating like going all-in against each other often means pouring a lot of their own chips into the rake. More subtle cheating gives them an edge, but no guarantee and it does mean on big hands they can really shoot themselves in the foot.

(Flop 7 K K ... cheater-1 has K 4 cheater-2 has K Q ... they know you don't have a K and 'force' you all in, with your pocket 7s, secure in their knowledge that they have 'won' already. Oops. Worse yet for K4 to fold and cut in half their chances of rivering you because they already 'know' who has the higher kicker and want to save the rake... )

In games without a rake, such cheating is more worrisome because they don't have anything to discourage them from going in heavy against each other often.

Because of SL poker games allow unlimited buy-ins at the tables, the most common form of partners cheating, 'chip-dumping' to make a large stack, can't happen at a regular rake table, but again, is a concern at tourney style tables with fixed buyins.

Cheating is a risk, but I believe the vast majority of cheaters are poor to mediocre players who think the extra edge will make them invincible. If two really good poker players teamed up they could be nearly invincible at their own table, but I think they'd make more playing honestly at two different tables. Also, consider, what's to stop a partner from catching a big all-in and then refusing to split the ill-gotten gains later? Dangerous business forming a cheat-team, you already know your partner is dishonest...

Anyway. Don't be naive enough to think it won't happen at all, but I think the majority of players are honest. I'd be a little wary of tournament style games, though, and watch for chip-dumping. If the same two go all-in against each other early in successive tournament games, put them on your watch-out list and if they do it too much to be coincidence, put them on your 'do not play with EV-AR!' list.

well i've seen a few movies and read many books about

just 2 people cheating in real life with 'hand signels' or someway to 'collud' will own ANY table

imagine how easy it is with 4 alts playing at the same table at once........

Give it time, and even PLAYING poker will be against the ToS and your problem will be resolved.

Flop 7, rivering, kicker, rake... ???

Now I know why I don't play poker!

This pigeon doesn't gamble, and not about to start. Someone's been studying these games for a zillion years...

Real casino's blow too, but at least you think you got a chance. Here there is no casino regulatory commision looking over their shoulder to keep them in order. Gamble for the fun of it, realise you can get easily scammed, and lose a few pennies. Discover you've been scammed? Write a note to yourself which says,
" Dont do that anymore".

TOS section 5.1:
Linden labs won't get involved in disputes between players.

If your Gambling in SL You Really are accepting on Pure faith the game is not Rigged. Even more so than in RL. In RL there are things to look out for. Extra people hanging about the table, Bottom of the deck dealing, Dealers who drink only Black coffee, But in SL, you cannot see your Opposing players At all. There is absolutely No way to see if any collusion is going on between players.
Maybe the game is being honestly Played, maybe the only thing being played is you. There's gambling, then there are the fools Bets. gambling in SL looks to me like a Fools Bet.

Angel.

Who said one of the players at the table is not a ringer from the casino who knows what all the cards are because it is the casino's machine that is "dealing" them and somebody knows how to write a script and insert it into Contents?

And even that would be a "dispute between residents," wouldn't it?

That's why sex is so much better a vice to cultivate in SL. At least you absolutely know for certain right from the start who's getting screwed...

Not if you use the swap button on the sexgen menu.

[/me develops new ree-spect for the ESC key...]