Being A Consultant In SL: Big Mistake...

Hey, I brought these 2 Island Owners from being n00bs w/ thier heads showing through thier hair, to folks w/ 3 teams of builders in one week. (The head of one team Tessa ****somethin, said she made the first income generating Mall in SL). I bring a lotta folks into SL & make em look like Alts instead of n00bs in under an hour and teach em all the basics so they can get to "the fun part" (to me all of it was fun startin out)

Since I don't know of any way to make a contract in SL business, I don't know how ta make sure I get paid. After meetin with the 2 "Owners" in RL, having a 3 hr meeting that day w/ graph paper, database & everything...going over numbers in-world every day, and visiting more than 10 sims to inspect builders work...talking to about 5 builder teams more than once each with the Owners, I finally "popped the question":

Can I be "put on the payroll"? Now mind you I have physical graphs, databases on paper, intricate layout sketches, etc, in a binder behind me to prove my work...plus a huge Folder in my SL Inventory, full of interviews w/ builders and LMs to thier work. The "Owners" said I can get a % once the L$ starts to generate. One is an ex-CEO and the other is a cop. Huh??? I'm not asking for even $50 here...I said I'm open. It sounds like they don't want to pay any L$ at all. After all of this work I figured maybe I should ask:

Anybody have any advice besides "quit helping people?", smartalecks please pick a "bot post" or something.

Anybody with experience doing RL/SL crossover business had a similar problem??

This seems like a difficult problem.

Perhaps you could set yourself up where you only offer a teaser for free. Outline your package of services.

Then require half up front before really rolling up your sleeves and getting to work.

You'd probably need a pretty professional looking proposal package to make it work.

That's not a bad idea. I don't have a big "Portfolio" yet, but some pre-determined pricing and a list of what I can do is a real good idea.

Half of the L$ up-front , or at least in bigger projects SOME kind of deposit also sounds like a good idea. I was too naive with this deal. I got too used to just helping out "regular Residents". Thanks for the advice!

Treat these jobs as reputation boosters. Treat these guys well, and continue to do so, and you'll be able to take future prospects to meet them and see what you contributed. Don't ever p** anyone off, you never know who they know.

Consultancy is a very slow upward road!

Thanks Ed...true. I'm glad that all this time on SL has really helped me improve my RL temper, or I might have blown the "deal" (if it is a deal). I'm gonna see what happens...meanwhile I told em to let me know what the builders say. I'll have ta "play it by ear" from that point fwd

I wouldn't say I pay extravagantly, but I have tens of thousands of $L on the table regularly for sim development.

These 'micro-contracts' are generally solicited among those both willing to be involved and those whom I personally consider talented.

Bringing a creative vision to the metaverse without handholding, and ability to finish a job are major factors.

Now, at the end of the day, some tens of thousands of $L are chickenfeed compared to the hours involved. I'm well aware of it, and call it a 'thank you' - essentially a portfolio building excercise.

Some of the people involved in my sim development have gone on to work for significant first life companies, for first life cash.

* * * * *

So... what am I saying here is this: I think your best bet is to find a sim developer that is looking for your talents, and continue with '100% trust' deals until you have finished, income-generating projects to show off.

After that, you can start charging a bit; and in fact you can list yourself as a metaverse developer to first life companies here:

http://secondlife.com/developers/listings.php?category=Consultant

I'd offer to help, but I've got the next 4-5 sims in the development pipeline already pretty much figured out in terms of who is involved.

Good luck and don't stop helping people. It's all the difference, even if there is no immediate payoff.

I too have experienced this myself. I've even talked about it here:
http://www.talksecondlife.com/second-life-business/424-how-do-you-charge-consultant.html

I posted that thread before I knew the answer though.

Here's what I do.... people ask me things.. and I'm always happy to talk and happy to give advice. Once it comes to the point where they're asking me to do work for them, I continue the conversation by saying something like "All this is right in my field of expertise, and what you're looking for is going to be a lot of work. How about I draft up a proposal for you."
You write up your ideas on a notecard, be very specific on various options and what can be done, but be vague on the steps to do it. Write out all the possibilties and the prices that go with them.

You don't need a contract, but you do need to know where the line is between free advice and doing work for someone.

And, I take 100% fee up front unless I know them or they have a reputable reputation.
Just getting a 50% deposit from a newbie doesn't mean you'll get the other 50%... newbies don't understand the value of a reputation in SL yet so they won't have a problem screwing you

Yes I'd second that keep them as references, the bigger they do get the better if they are willing to say to a newer person who much help you were

To play devils advocate here...

you kept helping when they kept asking for help.
Why would they expect you should be paid before you ask?

This is business... if you wanted to do it for experience and reputation then go for it. But if you wanted to get paid, you should lay that out before you do the work.
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But it does sound like you've done a lot of proposal work for them, but if you bail, what would they have? It sounds like you still have the upper hand here. You've done a lot of nice things for them here, and it sounds like youre trying to lock in the contract with em...
but what do they have if you leave their project? Did you give them enough to do it themselves?
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I dont think asking to get paid should be something to tip-toe around. It's not something where you have to "finally pop the question" once the advice and freebie help gets to the point where you think you should be getting paid, state that.
.... however, I dont think an employee rate, or 'on the payroll' works in SL... I think it's better to lay out prices for each and every project.

Also, if you're going to be building or creating content for people... don't give it to them. Just make it, and set it to sell at your price.... if they still dont want to pay you "until they start making money" derez it and move to the next project.....

Settle your terms upfront, before you do anything. Be prepared to say no, and let it go if the terms aren't agreed to. There will be other projects. It's also the fairest on the other party, doing something for someone, and then asking for money unexpected, or for more than expected, puts them in an awkward situtation.

Yes, a deposit - I always get half upfront, or a quarter on really large projects with payments in regular intervals, determined by progress ( a quarter because trust is two ways, and they should only have to expose themselves to risk so much themselves). Don't start without one.

Know your worth. New at it? Price accordingly, reputation building is worth something to you. Once you get experienced, have a body of work you can point to, raise your price. Your time and skills have a value, don't be afraid of it.

Anyone worth doing work for (read as, someone you will have a positive experience working with/for), will have no problem with renumeration or paying a deposit in my experience. Things work out best when everyone has a clear understanding of terms and expectations. Make sure it's understood by all exactly what is to be delivered. Set it up right, and it will be a positive experience for all involved.

Know your responsibilities! Be as professional and as conscientious about deadlines and deliverables as you can be. Be reliable!

I loathe negotiating, I wish I could just build things and never think about it, but doing these things makes for a lot less stress and creates a framework where I can enjoy the work I do, and enjoy the relationship with the client.

Yeah, I'm %100 new at the business aspect of "Consultation", before now it was always just helpin folks out. Thanks for all the responses folks, I learned a lot!

The info you've gotten here about the specific development projects you're doing is from people with far more experience than I have.

I can, however, offer my approach to RL consulting gigs. The development of a "scope of work" document is what I do for free. That includes preliminary conversations, finding out clearly what their desires and expectations are, presenting two or three general options to see if I'm on the same page, making sure the right talent mix is "at the table", sketching out the stages of the project, a reasonable timeline, etc. Then we develop a staged timetable and payment arrangement right up front. (I find it helpful to be clear at the beginning about how long I expect that this scoping stage will take us, not only for my own protection but also as a reality check for the client.)

The actual legwork that goes into the project, such as proof-of-concept designing, talking to other stakeholders, preliminary sketches, benchmarking other similar projects, etc., all get written into the timetable and consciously either billed for or given pro bono as appropriate. But that way, it is clear from the beginning that this is a business partnership with clear expectations of all parties.

The project can be easily staged this way -- you can say, if we get to the point of preliminary sketches by X date and you decide you don't want to go ahead with it, fine. You'll only have invested a minimal amount to find out some important things about what you want and how well our partnership will work.

Perhaps there's something in all that that can be applied to the kind of situation you're describing.