LL says we need to police SL ourselves, so let's do it

The message I got from Cory's blog entry was that LL has washed it's hands of any responsibility in protecting content in SL and is leaving it up to residents themselves. Their suggestion is getting a lawyer and suing violators in your local court. This seems a bit disingenuous to me since you'd be suing for maybe USD 100 and you wouldn't know the name of the defendent. I have no idea if any of this would even be possible outside the US or California for that matter.

So, forget that. However, perhaps there are other ways to have some impact.

The first, which several people are doing, is to essentially quit SL. If enough people do it that would have a real impact on LL, but it would take a lot of people and would cost them a lot individually.

How about a different tactic?

Ban everyone in the libsecondlife group from all your land and shops, at least all the officers and vocal apologists.

This costs you nothing and would send a message to the libsecondlife group that their actions were not appreciated. If this were widespread, it might even get LL's attention, they seem to be pretty heavily involved in libsecondlife.

If anyone has any other suggestions for how residents can have an impact on LL's policies, please post them.

The problem is, banning the libsecondlife members merely fills up your ban list with people who are guilty of creating the monster, but who are NOT the ones likely to USE CopyBot to cause economic harm to SL. The Ones who need to be banned are all going to be anonymous, unverified alts, robbing us blind and when you ban one, they just create a new alt and come back 5 minutes later.

LL can stop this by banning a CopyBot user AND all their alts. We can't.

Well, that's a little extreme. I understand the frustration to be more or less helpless in this case, but most of the LibSL members didn't have anything to do with the CopyBot development.

I'm sure they're all nice individuals who didn't mean any harm, but we have seen that one can't trust hobbyists to act responsibly when it comes to reverse engineering and pointing out security holes. I can't see any good for existing residents coming out of open sourcing. It will perhaps accomplish Philip's dream a little faster, but at the cost of our security.

I can't believe LL has no means to provide a better DRM system. It's rather the fact that LL has a certain time schedule for accomplishing their goals (which are not always all that compatible with the paying resident's goal) and don't want to spend time and ressources on more security. We should be vocal about the fact that we need a better system or at least some quick changes in the client software to stop existing CopyBot clones from working, and that any LL affiliation with or open support of LibSL has to stop immediately. But there's no need to attack anyone personally.

Yes, I support content creators, I don't support the madness, I want everything open again so I can shop , but will help nag at LL to do something (or at least show that they are) other than "come back in Q1 2007, then wait another 3-6 months".

Hope that counts for something .

Yes I have banned Lib but I'm sure they could care less.

But what I have done this morning, is I have sent detailed emails to many companies and newspapers and such that have at one time or another done articles about Second life.

We always read this postivie stories on second life and LL always comes out looking like they so support their customers.

I might disappear I know from the game, but so be it. I fell in love with second life but it's going downhill. Linden Lab needs to protect us from thiefs. There are steps they could do and refuse.

Hey Phillip would you like someone to steal your paycheck from you and be told you have no recourse, well basically that is what is happening to many creators in this game. Think about it!!!! and then do something about it.

So you're going to ban Lindens from your property? Several of them are involved in the LibSecondLife project. Who's going to be the first person to try to ban a Linden? And what do you think you're going to accomplish by trying it?

Seriously, there are perhaps a dozen or so CopyBots loose in SL - the code for them has been removed from the repository, and the CopyBot compiled form is no longer available on SLExchange. The threat has been not eliminated, but at this point is dramatically diminished. This will give Linden Labs time to implement a technical response to the danger to the SL economy things like this can represent.

LsLib isn't the problem...they are good people doing good work. LL needs to make sure their protocols can't be exploited. There is a big difference between utilizing and exploiting.

So, IMHO, this poll is a bit miss directed.

Another "Voted 5" on a smaller scale?

Banning week old no payment info accounts will do far more to protect you than banning a group where a lot of people have probably joined up just to see what's going on in the group chat.

YES I have banned lindens ... they are not above the moral implications of Stealing ... even if they didnt write it .. they allowed it inworld and so far.. all we get from LL is that copying is OK.

The Ban on copybot is only till they come up with a 'watermark' of sorts ... then the ban will be lifted. So some lazy person can copy your work in a couple mins then you have to spend HOURS trying to prove it. Even IF you can get LL to assist (which they dont now) you will have HOURS of your time STOLEN from you. The Lindens allowed it to be in world, and now they are protecting themselves by saying its a tool ... and we should be grateful.

Tha Ban on Lindens ... LIFE!

They wrote it , they released it, they need to accept responsiblity ... look at their chat room .. they are BRAGGING and having a party about CopyBot. That doesnt sound like 'good people doing good work' to me

LibSL aborted my alien lover's child inside me.

MM

That's truly hilarious. Do you really think the Lindens can't come and go as they please? Hello, they wrote the game!!

Wow. I have to say that, after reading quite a few posts and following quite a few links, I'm more educated on the whole suject. But the only comments I've seen from actual LibSecondLife members are a few angry posts from Dr Tardis and this above very humorous comment from Marcus Moreau. How about we hear something constructive from them? If you helped to create it, do you know the means or have any suggestions to uncreate, combat, or reverse it? How about a cool powerful script to deny its use on a plot of land? That would be more helpful than what I've seen so far, and an awesome absolution for ya.

Yay for ridiculously one-sided poll options! I am a content creator myself, and I'm definitely not one of the "everything in SL should be free" nutjobs. However, as someone who enjoys tinkering with programs, cars, and electronics to get them to do things they weren't intended to do, and find out more about how they work, I fully support LibSL. Yes, they did write the program, and they're partially at fault, but only as much as gun makers are at fault for gun deaths.

Fact is, the capability to pull textures and object models from the computer's memory has existed long before SL was created, and will continue to exist as long as there are computers. The only thing CopyBot did was to make it easier to use this technology in an SL-specific manner.

Heh. The only way I am affiliated with LibSL is that they have land on one of my islands. Other than that, I am posting silly comments in all the "LibSL raped my life" threads. Maybe how they approached it was bad, I do not wish to debate that fact. But the reaction of everyone is quite typical and so I feel I must be as silly as I feel all these threads are.

MM

EDIT: My group membership with them is left over from the land deeding and I stayed just for updates on their projects.

The point to this poll/thread is not to ban Lindens from your land, it is to do something with at least a little tangible in-world effect to protest LL's policy towards its customers.

There are almost no actions that residents can take that have any consequences for LL, so this is proposing that people use whatever is available, weak as it may be. Tiering down is the other option, but it's kind of final.

Screw diplomacy, since being in a bad mood seems to be justification for being rude... let me just ask the OP:


Have you stopped beating your wife yet? YES or NO


What? That's not a fair question?


WELL, NEITHER IS YOUR POLL.

--
Be serious if you want to be taken seriously.

What isn't fair about the poll - Yes, No, Pie. What else is there?

Ok, answer Jopsy's question then.

I voted "I use CopyBot so I can have my Pie and eat it too", though not because I use CopyBot, but because it was a stupid poll..

..and I like Pie.

That isn't precisely what the poll options say, is it?

I think this Isn't a Fix, HOWEVER i feel it IS a Good Punitive measure, and if someone makes a complete list of libsecondlife members Public, i would be more than Pleased to Ban them from my lands, AND passing the list about to all the Sim, and Land owners i know asking them to Follow suit. I would also be Happy to add the names of any Lindens i Knew for a Fact were part of that group and therefore Complicit in the creation of Copybot. Now, I know Lindens havd Godmode abilities that no doubt allow them to go pretty much where they please despite the Bans lists, But for me at least, it's the Principle of the thing. I would be VERY willing to tell one of them to their face they are Not welcome, and why, AND AR them to make the point.

Bottom Line, they created a Method to make easy the Theft of materials people have spent many hours working on. I won't have them on my Property. Linden or Not, they are Thieves.

Angel.

I thought it was Nigel Linden! Being all colored and all

This thread fails to meet the criteria for this forum. It's topic names a group as a target for discrimination. It discusses possible action that LL may take against user(s), which is best done by email with LL, aka a private discussion/dispute.

This thread will be locked pending Linden Review.