SL for Fun and Serious Business????

Hello,
I would just like to get some opinions in regards to people ( Like myself ) who are trying to run sucessful businesses in SL.
I realize that most business can almost run on there own, for example rental bots, and not needing to re-stock shop items. And of course you can hire staff to help your business along.But when your business starts to grow you become more dependent on other things like, Servers not going down, Bugs and errors almost like SL is still in early beta, Broadband internet requirements, Each update is a full 20MB + download.
All these things dont really effect my playability of SL, I can put up with it. What I am saying is that its our new customers for our businesses as well as people thinking about joining that must be very discouraged from becoming a SL citizen!
Us business owners from the small vendor space renters up the entrepreneurs rely on new people joining Sl everday and from my experience trying to help friends download,install and navigate around it seems not very user friendly.
Sure, I see the population is growing very fast but I get the feeling that for every 10 that join up and last a couple weeks just on basic accounts, a couple hundred dont get that far...let alone become subscribers!
I am not complaining, just stateing how I feel because I also feel sorry for those that have issues I read about in the forums, and wish more people could get so much greatness that the SecondLife experience has to offer.

I agree that SL isn't very user friendly for the not-so-techie average user.

I think what compounds this, is the help areas are constantly griefed instead of monitored drowning out the legitmate requests for help.

If SL were to force new accounts to stay in the newbie area for say.. 1 week, then you'd have to learn and also if that was contained on it's own server, would reduce alt griefing. And maybe even restrict that area to newbs, mentors, Live Help and Lindens. Move into PG areas the second week and then free reign. As of right now, it's so hard to get any help in the help areas of the new world, even going to offer is opening yourself up to attack.

However, generally, people don't find this game on their own. 98% of the people I've spoken with, signed up through a friend (don't let the number fool you, membership shot up 300,000 when verification went away, and LL doesn't remove permabanned accounts from that number). Hopefully, those that bring their friends are nice enough to bring their friends are also nice enough to help them out a little bit in terms of getting going. Which also means that you need to cater to the 'old' guys as much as the 'new' because word of mouth is strong.

The question is not as simple as business versus fun. Virtual world marketing requires a virtual world to do it in. Who would buy an avatar if she had no place to wear it? Thus, the more successfull merchant must also sponsor some kind of chatroom, theme park, or playground. If you want to sell dance bracelets, the buyers must have some virtual location where they can get together and dance. Most of these areas, at the moment, are failing. Shops can be almost totally animated, but a successfull chatroom (or theme park, playground, etc. ) cannot be animated. Without a human host, social director, or babysitter, they never survive. So what i see in SL is many cleverly designed, fully automated ghost towns. A landscape of shops surrounded by empty palaces. Somehow the SL community has done a fabulous job of creating 'things', but is failing to provide enough living breathing humans to keep teh customers entertained.

This already exists - Help Island. Unfortunately, it isn't possible for every newbie to spend a week there at the moment, simply because there are so many newbies that if they all did, it would be overwhelmed. Also, some newbies want to do some stuff that's considered "advanced", while still learning. For example, they might want to go shopping for clothes (which relates to a large area of the grid) while still able to get help wearing them.

I think this is a bit of an odd complaint considering the rapid growth in the 'online now' figure recently. It has almost double in two months I have been here. It seems an odd time to be complaining about lack of new residents to me. SL must be going through its most rapid increase in traffic since it started. Could it cope if it was more popular?

Last time I talked to my family in Aus most ISPs charged a rate for downloading anything (which is just surfing) - is that still the way it is there? In many or most places you DON'T get charged that way. It would be annoying to have to pay over and over for SL if that's the case.

Yes Osprey, some internet providers do that, mine has a "cap" which mean I have a download limit of 10GB a month, if I go over that limit I get my connection speed slowed for the rest of the month to 56k on my cable internet
There are plans that go to 20Gb and more but it costs a lot more per month or they charge you about 15 cents per 1MB if you go over your limit.
This is just my provider( Australia's biggest), there are other probably better deals around with other providers but most lock you in a 24mth plan (Like I am )

Well, most games have a feature that requires certain taskes to be performed before they can leave the newb area. Maybe something like that and as far as learning, that's up to the Lindens to take it as far as they want. They could have a virutal newb island, that has things to sell for 0L that could teach buying and such. Frankly, if someone doesn't want to spend time learning the game, then it's gonna cause trouble later. Also, to add to that, if a griefer can't grief when he wants, then he has to go around making alts, which this would slow down some of them making alts, cause most cbf, and don't care to remember or note pw's to save for a week.

It's a small price to pay to have people actually learning about things and weeding out griefers (and downtimes) to lose a few accounts which are more likely gonna be basic and make LL no money anyways.

4 sims on 1 server could randomize where new people are placed. That's 400 newbs at 1 time. And chances are if they are alts, they will log off right away and wait. Somehow, you HAVE to go to a newb island anyways, regardless of how many newbs are there, so handling the server load is a moot point. It's not like there is 1 sim and if it's full, they throw you into a random sim. The resources are already there.



This is misleading. Don't believe the numbers anymore. LL does not remove numbers for inactive accounts, banned accounts, etc. and up til the beginning of the summer (US) you had to be verified to have an account. Most people don't have many means, so they had 1 account or maybe 2. When open season began on unverifieds, many people made TONS of alts. The griefers made even more. At this time a friend of mine, has 8 alts. All for different things they wish to do during the day. Several to work different jobs, and other reasons. I know of a griefer, who makes a new alt a day to do some griefing til he gets banned. Not only this, he LAUGHS about it out loud and makes fun of LL for not banning people by any other modes than name.

With unverified, there is no cost to make as many alts as you want, to grief as much as you want.

The problem is, there are fewer of these fun places now that people don't get dwell bonuses, or developer's incentive bonus, or even ratings bonuses.

I'm not much for clubs, but I certainly don't rail against them. Clubs, games - all that kind of thing, gives people something to do. The all-dressed-up-and-no-place-to-go syndrome is something I've been worried about for ages, and I think a lot of fun has disappeared because of the things taken away that supported these in the past.

There's the psychological thing going - people tend to be willing to pay for "things" that they keep forever, but not for "experiences" in games or online environments.

coco

I am aware of this argument. That's why I referred to the 'online now' figure. The fact is far more people are online at one time than they were a couple of months ago, it's not all alts. The recent press coverage has brought many more people to SL. Including the security breach story. Heard the one about there being no such thing as bad publicity?

Offline venues do not rely on volunteers or roleplayers to do the hosting, bouncing, dancing, and such. Do you know many singers, dancers, comedians, bouncers, shopclerks, or even bussboys who are both (1 good at what they do, and (2 wiling to work for 'tips only." Or even for 1000L$ per night, which is the equivalent of about four US dollars? The staff at an offline venue are not paid by visitiing customers, nor do they receive "dwell" susbsidies. They are hired and managed by the owners of the establishment. So far, in Sl, that isnt happening.

The SL ciommunity appears to believe technology is all that matters, that machines, if made intelligent enough, could somehow do all the maintenance, policing, conflict resolution, and even politicking that make up a modern city. Even if that proves to be correct, the result will be a 'clockwork society," untouched by human hands.

Or we could wise up in time, and admit that humans have value, and are worth paying for. Yes, it will make everything cost a little more, but will also provide newcomers with funds, and "things to do." Then it will be for the market to decide whether or not a subscription is worth buying.

I won't deny press had brought some, but don't be too sure about alts and the online now figure. I personally have 5 home computers which I could access SL at the same time. Majority of people nowdays have a laptop and a desktop and many of my friends in game, are running both. Usually running camping bots on one (usually the lesser quality of those machines) and playing on another, and then again, when the leave home, they'll run all computers possible to camp. Most of them didn't do that pre-no verify age.

Again, Help Island is a "virtual newb island", and it does have things on sale for L$0 to help people learn to shop. It doesn't have a "list of certain tasks" you have to complete in order to advance, but that's because any such list for SL beyond the basic skills from Orientation would inevitably have parts that wouldn't interest some users or might even put them off. Some people don't want to shop, some people don't want to build, some people don't want to dance, etc.



Um, no. Unfortunately, the griefers just grief the newbie island too.



There are indeed 4 help islands. But you can't just say that "handling the server load is a moot point" - that's like saying, that if you HAVE to get some papers photocopied, then the photocopier can't run out of ink because it's a "moot point".



You could have up to 3 accounts via a single means of verification. I think you can still have 2 or 3, too - there's various good reasons for it, such as having a "creator" alt and a "socialiser" alt (so that friends don't get offended if you don't talk to them because you're making things), or people who, for role-playing or some other reason, need a male and female alt (yes, you can switch gender anytime but you can't change your name to match).

The owners of the establishment have to get the money from somewhere, though, and that usually means charging guests. But it isn't a "tech" thing at all - it's just that these jobs in SL are easier to get and do, and therefore logically have less value.

If you want to be a dancer in SL you don't have to actually learn to dance, and keep fit etc., you just have to get hold of some animations or even use free ones or ones the club provides. If you want to be a bouncer in SL you don't have to work out, learn to restrain people without hurting them and take the real risk of meeting a psycho and ending up in hospital; you just have to watch an area, possibly buy some tracking equipment, and click "More, Eject". It isn't some evil conspiracy to not pay these people, it's simply that if anyone asks for money to do these things then in a few days there will be someone else willing to do it just as well for less.

Singers, if they sing live, are an exception to this of course, but their problem is that they have to compete with existing audio streams, which although they are probably illegal, still exist and therefore provide competition.



But vice versa, if a human is willing to dance or model for free because they have always wanted to be a dancer or model and "realising" that fantasy is enough for them, should they be told that they cannot do that, becuase they have to ask for money too? Should they be told that if it turns out no money is available for them, they have to do without that fantasy, even though everything necessary for it is available except for the money?

Hmmmm, well, uhhh. I don't know. But SL's future, or lack of, might depend on this. Shall we make it a county fair, where residents are serious but visitors only playing? Is there some compromise between the two? And what if some of them want to 'run away and join the circus?"
Hmmm ... Punt!

But everyone shops eventually, unless they are a camper or a griefer and in either case, it would hurt to wait a week to move onto the mainland. I'm not saying a list to build, script, etc. I'm saying a BASIC force of learning how to WALK, fly, chat, IM's, etc.



With scripts off, the most griefing that can be done would be rambling which means that with only a single Linden or maybe 2 to staff it, then bans could happen before it gets to mainland.



It IS a moot point. Think about logistics instead of an obscure metaphor. You have to log into the newbie area when you make a new account. No matter what. Which means SL has quite a bit of resources in handling these areas. It takes no more than what they've already done. Name me 1 person who created an account and couldn't log on because 'newb sim is full'. You can't because it doesn't happen. Because... LL carries enough resources to handle a barrage of new accounts. Which makes it a moot point on the resources to do this. They already have them and they are in place.



Now there is a debate on whether alt accounts costs whomever, but at this point, since they wanted to charge me, I will assume they charge per account. Not many anymore are doing it the legal way and letting (or taking the chance) LL charge them. In any event, I'm sure those who already have a main account, and are making alts already understand if they were to do this. So they have to wait a week, to help weed out griefers. Most business owners I know, including me wouldn't mind having an alt wait a week if it cuts down on downtime for the grid.

In any event, if we were to do this to verification only, then make it so unverified accounts have to stay for 1 week.

Walking and Flying are already covered, on Orientation Island. Chatting and IMing are on Help Island because they can't be automated - there need to be other people around to Chat or IM to.



You're talking about Orientation Island? It doesn't have the same logistics. According to Dwell On It there are (or recently were) around 5471 new users a day. That's about 37 every 10 minutes. It usually takes less than 10 minutes to go through Orientation, and there are something like 14 Orientation Islands so each one will have 2-3 avatars on it at any given moment. No problem.

However, if you want users to stay on Help Island for a week, then on any given day there will be 5471 * 7 = 38297 users split between the Help Islands. Even if we had 14 Help Islands (we in fact have 4) that would still be 2735 avatars per island. If we assume that they all only actually log in for one hour a day (probably far too little) and that these hours are evenly spread out, that still requires 113 avatars active on the island at any given time, which is already beyond the top limit SL can support. And don't forget that Help Islands also need volunteer staff (it's difficult to learn social skillls without live people around to learn from)..



Would they have to log in during that time?

But making it a task including etiquette could help out greatly.



113 avs is perfectably capable and within SL's realm of capability. Sim loads (2 sims on 1 server) can handle 200, so even running that would be perfectly sufficient. However, I'm wondering where you are getting the 5471 new accounts. Is this number during right after verification loss when people where alting en masse? Even with your current set up, you would have to also take into account that many people would be turning off to alting. How many would NOT be there if this were put in place? 40,000 new users a week seems a bit prestigous for new accounts. And if you put in the stipulation that VERIFIED accounts do not have to go through this waiting period, chances are the real people will get verified. Which would cut down on that number as well.




I would say a mandatory log in of at least once per day for at least 5 minutes. It creates enough hassles to weed out a lot of no reason new accounts. And for anyone who's coming in, a short page describing the policy is sufficient.

How would you design an automated task to include etiquette?



1 sim can handle about 30 or 40 avatars normally. An island can be increased to 100, but usually, by that point, the world is too laggy to do anything other than sit. Remember that the introduction areas aren't just to teach new users - they're potential customers' first experience. If the newbie help area they have to stay in for a week is laggy and jerky, they're going to think that about all of SL.



That was from Tateru Nino's blog, and it's based on the last 30 days.



Verified people wouldn't have to wait on the Help Island? I think that would be dreadful, it would make the introduction island become equivalent to a "ghetto" for "second-class citizens".

Quite easily, it's a simple engine to do those sorts of things. Mostly a read through, mostly a quick answer.



You are considering lag from other sims. Without high textured clothing, tons of scripts, lots of 'pretty fluff prims' the lag is quite a bit less. I've been on a natural sim with 50 other people before with medium lag, and that comes from bling and prims and all that. Try to expand the thinking from a normal place.



I don't know who that is, so I can't even check the guesswork, so there's nothing I can respond to this with.



Not at all, you are taking it to extremes. Most people when told a simple few words, don't care how it's done and frankly wouldn't know anything different because once they sign up, that's how it's always been for them.

That's like people saying they'd die without the TV, cell, computer... can't miss what you don't have. The new accounts wouldn't know any different unless a constant griefer yelled at them 'YOU GOT JIPPED!'. And frankly, if someone can't understand the simple idea that is put in place to cut down on griefers and second life downtime, then why would they care about the lil stuff? Because they can? Not a good enough excuse to risk a few accounts if you ask me. LL will always lose people for something they did. Why not take a chance and lose some people over safeguards rather than holes?

Lord Coalcliff, from my observation when there are constant attacks on the grid and users are unable to enter the system it is not so good for business either SL to SL or RL to SL. I have thought about setting up a virtual presence in SL for my RL agency but it is a bit scary for me to have to tell my prospective customers our meeting had to be canceled because self replicating objects and nameless avatar alts' attacking the system that I am trying to sell and introduce them to. Perhaps next year but for now any RL business into SL is most likely best stated as 'prototype' in my opinion. SL to SL business seems doable if one wishes to place real time and work into their project and so as long as their return is high enough vs. the time spent developing.

I wish you well on your business adventure and hope that I was able to offer some of my insight to your post.