Camping pads that kill sim performance

I have never posted in the forums but I have an issue that I wanted opinions from the SL community on. I own over 30,000sq m of a sim and am unable to even get to my property sometimes, the sim is so laggy, that it takes 10 min for textures to res and so I cannot even build on my own land, and it crashes several times a day.
The issue is camping pads; I feel that people should only be allowed to have the percentage of pads that reflect their land ownership in the sim. As an example; 42 camping pads in a sim that holds 40 people, Is irresponsable. They have less land in the sim than I do, yet are allowed to use up all the processing power. To me this is a violation of rule #6 of the community standards, but they are allowed to just continue.
I don't begrudge the new people from trying to get money, but they are not playing they are just standing there and don't contribute to SL while camping, there should be some limits to this in my opinion, how about some responses to hear what you all think?

I sympathise with your predicament Tigey but the issue of linking scripts to land has been debated to death, voted on and sadly beaten to death as a non-starter. Meanwhile some people use that as a green light to suck up resources that other players such as yourself pay a pretty penny for. Up to now the standard response has been to tell people to pack up and move, something which I feel is heartless and a shallow way of ducking responsibility. You have invested in half a sim and are paying at least $125 / month. So you should be entitled to your share of the sim's resources, yet you are clearly being robbed.

I'm not sure what to suggest. There are some who would fight fire with fire and retaliate by running even laggier scripts to ruin the club. Not an ideal solution and too prone to backfire. Inasmuch as the venue is impairing your experience in Second Life and, I presume, the other residents of the sim, their actions could and should be considered griefing. I would describe it more as parasitism though parasitism is not a violation of the TOS whereas definable griefing activites are. Getting LL to acknowledge that such behaviour is griefing is another matter altogether.

The amount of money people are pouring into SL is astronomical, especially considering some of the issues, both minor and major, each of us as residents are faced with on a daily basis. Some of these issues are acceptable to many of us simply because we do so enjoy the format that has been provided to us, as so we play on despite the little inconveniences from time to time, patiently awaiting the bugs to be worked out of the system.
What is happening in bedrock right now is not what can be considered an acceptable disruption. The money that has been poured into creating it, and the money being poured into maintaining it is quite substantial considering the blind eye being turned on the abuse being sustained by the owner (Tigey Honey) of the land.
As stated in the community standards guide on the site (http://secondlife.com/corporate/cs.php) 'Objects, scripts, or actions which broadly interfere with or disrupt the Second Life community, the Second Life servers or other systems related to Second Life will not be tolerated in any form.' The blind eye being turned on this situation at this time is, from my point of view, a direct contradiction to these rules.
Obviously, many of us have come to SL to make money, and that is fair. Each should be well entitled to his acquisition of wealth in whatever manner they so do choose, barring that a) it is legal, b) moral, and c) not painfully disruptive to others. This being said, I don't think that the fault of this matter lay so much in the owner of the mall is it does in the management of SL overall. Because multiple landowners in a sim share servers, there should be a mandatory division of the server usage, just as there are with the prims being used. What's happening in Bedrock at this time is not a unique problem, nor is it a new problem, but it is definitely something that needs more attention immediately. 42 dance pads in a sim that only holds 40 people is beyond unacceptable no matter what angle you are looking at it from.

WElcome to mainland

This issue is becoming more and more prevolent as camping pads have become more and more popular. Not being able to rez in your own home position bites the big one!
Many people make bedrock their home, and to be one of the co-owners has been the greatest, most fullfilling and satifying positions a person can come by. Standing by the creator Tigey has been a joy since the beginning.

Shall we discuss the issue of a individual becoming a griefer?
When does human morality end in our second lives?

I sure believe the making everyone's time in the sim unbearable is qualifed for griefing.

<3,
rylee
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Not looking to ignite flames, just discuss ~

We have a few camping chairs scattered around, they dont pay alot, just enuff to give newbs some spending money..we tried money trees what a nitemare, anyway...we have maybe 2 to 3 campers a night...but i have to tell you, im standing in a mainland sim that has 5 ppl in it rite now including myself, and the rezzing is awful!! Prims dissapear and reappear as i move around. So dont blame camping chairs for all the lag in SL. Now as for not getting in your sim, that is unexcusable, and id call a live helper every time it happens, till they get sick of you doing it, and do something about the 42 camping spaces in a 40 person sim.

What i dont understand, is how anyone can make bucks off camping chairs, they no longer get traffic money, oh ya the casino ppls...well i told the Lindens, stopping traffic money would not cut out the camping chairs, but they didnt listen.

I don't object to camping chairs, but for that mall with 42 in a 40 person sim, it makes no sense. The campers don't shop, and if valid shoppers wanted to go there, even thay couldn't get in. I would rather have a newB camping than begging, SL has few opportunities for them to get cash, and as far as casino's go, isn't online gambling Illeagle in the US now?

I haven't read the TOS in a long time, but I think it has provisions that apply to situations like this: "disturbing the peace" for example.

Some things that you can do:

1) Use Live Help when it is especially laggy and ask for a Linden to come take a look at it. You wouldn't have to name the camping chairs as the cause. Just tell them that the sim is consistently laggy and unusable.
2) File a bug report for lag in your sim saying that the sim is laggy and unusable.
3) talk to the owner of the camping chairs to see if they are willing to do something.
4) abuse report the owner of the camping chairs.

I would hope that one or more of these would get some results, but don't have any recent experience.

I always find a report to Live Help of excessive lag and asking for a sim reset gets rid of campers for a while.

*whistles*

Lewis

One possible solution might be for LL to tie a fixed minimum of CPU resources to land. Here goes: out of 100% of CPU time, let's assume allocate 50% of that to the land. So that if one owns 1,024 SQ M of land one is guaranteed a continuous minimum of 1/64 (your portion of the sim) * 50% = 0.0078125 of the cpu resources at any time. Similarly if one owned 32,768 SQ M of land in a sim one would be guaranteed a minimum of 1/2 * 50% = 25% of the CPU resources. Any surplus CPU capacity would be freely assigned on a first-come first served on-demand basis across the sim. That would put the brakes on the present wave of CPU-thieves setting up shop all over the mainland.

There you go. Any takers? Any possible flaws with such an idea? Anything I might have missed? Let's thrash it out and see what we come up with.

It's a good plan but I can see one problem... legitimate uses of more than your share.

Back when the SLCC was running, I set up a video feed to the little theatre above my disco, and had 28 avatars for most of the day on a 700 sq m plot. Everyone was there all the time, we were active and chatting, not zombies. But we were using well over the 'allocated resources' of the sim based on the plot, or even the 8000 sq m in Rosieri I own.

However, most of the sim is owned by me and another resident, and the rest of the region contains mostly residential properties and the Linden road.

I actually don't know what the point of being popular is anyway, because we all know that traffic in no way reflects the quality of what the land contains. An area that is flat, plain, unlandscaped, containing an out of the box Tringo set is classed as more popular than the same size plot of land that a user has spent hundreds of hours building an exquisitely detailed landscaped property.

Lewis

IMHO I think that is a very logical solution, after all, Prim usage is directly tied to the land too, and we all understand that, Why the formula like that hasn't been implemented long ago amazes me. There may have been a time when people had common courtesy, and manners in SL, but with the recent Spait of grid wide attacks I would say that those days are long gone. the implimentation of such a scheme would allow the lindens to keep a better handle on scripted attacks too. The way the system is set up now they expect me to pay to let someone else destroy the best aspects of SL. My freedom of expression and ability to create cost me real dollars. If the CPU hoggers ale allowed to stop me from even getting into the land that I pay for it should be considered theft. That is what it would be called RL.
Excelent Idea

Legit uses? No probs, Lewis. After all, in the plan I proposed there would always be the other 50% resources which could be freely allocated so that clubs, events, etc., would have CPU cycles available. The only caveat being that if every other resident in the sim decided to log on and play with their poseball beds at the same time as your prime-time event, you'd be stuffed. Though the likelihood of that hapening would be rather low.

I think the thing would be to recognise that people are bound to use up more than their share of resources at times, but that there's also bound to be times when they're quite likely to use up no or very few resources such as when they're not logged in. No solution is ever 100% perfect. The best anyone can hope for is a compromise that's acceptable to as many people as possible.

I wonder whether this might be a way to slow down grid wide replicating attacks too.

Lewis

I think it might be better for LL to figure out an effective way of identifying avatars that are really idle, even if they run macro programs to mimic activity.

If not, some land owners might be tempted to attempt to crash their own sims periodically to boot the campers off.

I've been online for about half an hour this morning. When I first logged on, I was in Bedrock where i struggled for a few minutes to force my clothes to res and then crashed. Upon relogging, I was informed via message box that I could not access the region and was transported elsewhere. For another ten minutes I tried to go home... FINALLY, I got where I wanted to go and am now stuck in a realm or perpetual grey. Sitting there, staring around at the blob of virtual nothingness as it tries to force itself into something substantial, I found myself wondering again what it is exactly I am paying for.
There are other sims where the lag makes great builds go mostly ignored by me simply because trying to view them is far too frustrating. I tend to avoid the huge events because the lag makes me a little nutty. But Bedrock is to me, as it is to many others, home, and thus not a sim to be avoided no matter how frustrating it gets. Were the build and land mine, were it my money that has been poured into it, I'd be tempted to tear it all down and walk away, cutting my losses. If that ever does happen in Bedrock, it would be a great loss to SL. One of my first stops in SL as a newbie not so very long ago, was Bedrock. One of my first friends in SL was Tigey Honey. I am far from being alone in this. It is amongst the first stops and first friendly faces for many newbies. It is because of this place that I even bothered to sign up for a pay account, and it is because of this place that many I know have fallen so deeply in love with the world of sl.
What Alazarin Mondrian, suggests seems to me to be a great approach. In a perfect world, we'd simply need to speak with our neighbour and inform them of the problems we're having as a result of their actions and said neighbour would be apologetic and make alterations to their conduct. This is not a perfect world, and we are not a perfect race. That attempt has been tried and failed. Obviously it is time for the powers that be to step in and do something about this situation. I can only hope that they do amend it before it’s too late and we end up loosing many great people from the community.
And now I must go again and file another abuse report.

If you can manage to get into the sim and see the camping pads at all, start abuse reporting the camping pads owner AND the campers for a Denial of Service attack on your sim. After all, by stuffing so many users onto camping pads, they are preventing you from even using your own land.