Pythons, Holy Grail, Gender and Ethics

I've been enjoying books from a series entitled Popular Culture and Philosophy by Open Court for a couple of years now. The lastest in the series is "Monty Python and Philosophy: Nudge Nudge, Think Think!"

http://www.opencourtbooks.com/books_n/monty.htm

One particular chapter is titled "Philosophy, Gender, and Society", with the author taking a look at the Holy Grail movie, and finding the Pythons (supposed) commentary on old-style patriarchial systems and the more modern (during the times that were the 70s) feminism.

All that to say, the chapter author claims there is a difference in male and female ethics. Traditional masculine ethics are based on morality from abstract ideas, not inclusive of relationships or emotions, leaving no room for negotiation. Feminine or care ethics more commonly negotiates, holds that
relationships are motivating factors in moral development, not abstract principles.

Example scenes from the Holy Grail movie are King Arthur and the Black Knight ("You're a looney!", Bedevere and the "witch" ("She turned you into a newt?", Sir Galahad the Chaste @ Castle Anthrax ("Oh, let me go and have a bit of peril!", and Launcelot rescuing Prince Herbert ("You've come to rescue me?". Sadly, the author states at the end of having ran out of time to cover the killer rabbit; brave, brave Sir Robin and his minstrels; and the uncompromising Knights Who Say "Ni!" B^) Then again, if you're not a Monty Python fan or have not seen the movie at least once, I just wasted a paragraph of your time, so my apologies.

So, this chapter made me think of the SL Talking Ethics sessions; they start with a topic of some ethical aspect, there is much chatting for a bit, then we have the dilemma, which comes (as it seems to me, a male) from a feminine perspective. The dilemmas I often find, from my male perspective, to be rather challenging to my initial thoughts of the ethical topic and my opinions on it, based on (what may well be) my male abstract ideas-based ethics.

To wrap up this post, how about this as a topic of debate for the forum:

Gender and Ethics, is there a male/female difference? Male Ethics are emotionaless and based on Abstract Ideas, Female based on Emotions and Relationships? Agree, disagree, indifferent, the topic is silly, and therefor, is right out, and some one should pull the pin on the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch and count to three?

http://www.clubi.ie/exalted/holyhand.htm
http://www.mwscomp.com/movies/grail/grail-21.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Hand_Grenade_of_Antioch
(Google search on holy hand grenade of antioch)

Thinking and Nudging,
Sorcs Nolan

P.S. Feel free to consider the Gender and Ethics question for the Monty Pyton Holy Grail movie, RL, and/or SL as you wish/see fit!

I second the motion. This is a great topic for discussion. I don’t think we realize how often our differences spring from gender based assumptions and perspectives. Should generate some fascinating discussion, maybe even a few sequels.

Kronos, thanks for the reply. If I read you correctly, you agree there is influence on ethics via gender? If so, how much influence? In what way is our ethics influenced by gender?

And these questions are not just for Kronos, by any means. We've had many readers, but not many posters so far. I am looking forward to seeing more comments from any and all of you out there.

Spam Spam Eggs and Spam,
Sorcs Nolan

I've actually tried to answer this post twice before and given up. Let's see if the third try pays for all.

Before I'd agree to this topic, Sorcs, I would insist we look at what is being defined as emotions. I suspect the unspoken assumption here is that the emotions being associated with women are the ones we've been trained by our male-dominated society to see as "weak", automatically putting women in a one-down position in your hypothesis. (Remember the truism that the winners get to write the history books? They also get to write the dictionaries.) Take the word emotion out of there and I would discuss the topic.

BTW, I do believe there is a difference between generalized male perceptions of ethics and generalized female perceptions of ethics. And you're not the first to have thought about this issue. Check out feminist writings from mmmm, late 70s on...start with Carol Gilligan's In A Different Voice (1982).

Also, for a general overview of feminist ethics, see the entry in the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy, http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/feminism-ethics/.

Best,
anya

I think the problem is that people see the issue in black or white, male or female in this case, whereas in reality, that doesn't really work. Sure, there's some of that going into the mix, but its coming down to a nature vs nurture mix and in the end, everything is in shades of grey. There is no correct answer, so anyone really trying to answer it will fail. Good luck to you though, and er... fetch me a shrubbery or I will say "Ni" to you, well maybe, I'm open to negotiation on that one.

Well, thank you for some more replies on this Genders and Ethics thread.

First, about what I mean by "Emotions". Anya, thank you for your persistence in making your post. First, it's not really my hypothesis, it is that of the article writer. I remain uncommitted as to whether or not this hypothesis can hold water. Hence, my wanting to have a forum discussion about it.

From my perspective, Emotions are that... emotions. Male and/or Female, Happy is Happy, Sad is Sad, Mad is Mad. But, if removal of the word "emotion" is required, then how should we refer to this?

And, I'll be sure to read up on at least the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy (great site, wink wink, nudge nudge) for feminist ethics, Anya; thank you for sharing that.

Siobhan, you've brought up a good point, and one my RL spouse brought up as soon as I read aloud the article. That is the problem with making sweeping generalizations, and we should guard against sterotyping each other into boxes. Or in other words, black and white mixes to make all shades of grey, perhaps?

Nobody Expects the Spanish Inqusition,
Sorcs