Group Chat!!!!

I'd just like to know if there are official 'moderators' in group chat, or is everyone a sort of 'self-appointed' moderator. I've just been observing group chat over the last few days and I actually fee sorry for anyone who might need to ask a question..lol None of us like spam....myself included, but surely the number of people who immediately jump in with 'please don't spam this channel'... or 'please take this to mentals' ....etc. are clogging up the channel just as much as the so-called 'spammers'... I actually had to 'sit on my hands' to stop myself from joining in group chat when people had gotten annoyed about some group IM or other and 'spammed' the channel to complain about the group chat not being used properly.

I think that when the occasion arises that I need assistance, I'll try to use my power of thought to get through to all the mentors as opposed to posting it in chat...

Having said all that......I still think you're all wonderful people.

I'm with you on this. I said once "This chat should be in a scripting related group" or so... and got bad responses.

People ask about scripts, about building, or they just use it as a chatroom. Luckily we can see a "I need help in OI7" in the middle of all that.

When I went to the Volunteer welcome they spoke about lot of rules...that seems that are not beeing respected and no one does anything about it.

It's apparent even though it was mentioned in the Mentor course that the SLM group is not for dumb stuff and lul...woot!, that people still don't get it.

I was actually a little disappointed with the Mentor Class to be honest, basically it just encompassed a video, razzing up mentorship, 'Hey! Mentors are Helpful! and loyal! and they do your laundry!', they did mention the thing about group chat though.

Anyway, I got the impression of someone trying to sell me a timeshare. I'm not trying to knock the people who were giving the class, they're good people no doubt but, I don't think this is enough for Orientation for Mentors. Is there an unified-same briefing for every orientation class, or is it per whoever is doing it?

Anyway, I say this because I've had this av. since Jan. of 2004, in fact I had 2 years on the next oldest person in the orientation or teaching it.

I would be willing to lend my experience to help produce or add to a possibly more constructive orientation course.

If you can make it, stop by Amber Linden during her office hours (Monday 9-10am, Tuesday 1-2pm) or possibly Blue's (Wednesday 4-5pm) as well although he usually does have a topic set where Amber's tend to be more open discussion .

(Mia, George and Lexie have office hours as well, but I'm not sure how involved they are with the whole training thing)

Oh, this is funny: They just started talking in SL Mentor Group about ....SL Marriage.... so i said: ...."this conversation shouldn't be taken in this group".

And a mentor coach sent me an IM asking me if a were a Mentor Coach...I said no. So he told me that I shouldn't do that, that was very rude and Amber will warn me. They say that they talk with new mentors every day so they stop sending IM's....ok but guys/girls:


1 - "this conversation shouldn't be taken in this group". Is not a rude message.
2 - They can't warn me for respecting the rules... THAT is very rude.
3 - If they talk with everyone in private about not sending off-topic im's and they say it in the volunteer welcome and it doesn't work....well think of a better solution. Don't blame me for your managment.
4 - We are talking about mature people, so if they are behaving like kids they shouldn't be volunteers at all.

when you need assistance from a fellow mentor.....

think realllly hard, then hit the search button, go to the people tab, type in my name and give me a shout. I will help you however I can



(sorry lame attempt at being silly)

but seriously if you need help, give me a shout, I will do what I can to help



PS I used to be guilty of being one of those that would say please take this out of this channel.... etc

then I realized how self righteous and pompous I was being, and stopped doing it.
We are all adults and should all be able to carry ourselves as adults.
I was wrong in my hand slapping, it was very high handed of me, and I had no right to do it. I am not full of myself nor do I think I am better than any other mentor. I am sorry I ever did it, and if anyone reading this has ever been on the recieving end, please forgive me (you will notice I no longer do it)
I just simply click the x button if there is too much chatter going on.

(I have come to this realization via watching other mentors hand slap in the channel, and realize just how much it makes them look like they think they are better than the rest, reminds me of the kid in school that always felt they were better and always tried to tell the others what to do)

@Rhaorth - thanks for that....I'll definitely make a note and If I'm stuck with anything that I can't handle, I'll be sure to give you a shout....


On the whole 'group chat' thing....I think it's actually funny when a half a dozen people start to IM to complain about spam....thus creating even more!!


By the way, if someone would send me an invite for 'mentals' I'd appreciate it...I'm dying to see what it's like there!!!!

This topic comes up again and again and again...

Unfortunately, people love their little titles (Mentor Coach, for example) and they love to assume a little power and authority. This is simply human nature.

I posted a further discussion on the topic of SL Mentor Group Chat here (third item down the page):

https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/User:Don_Misfit/Mentor_Musings

which, without trying to "toot my own horn," I think points out what the real issues are.

Yes, there are a few people who have "self-appointed" themselves as chat monitors... that's fine, in a way, as the Lindens have been pushing for Volunteers to become self-organized and self-run. In my opinion, however, NOBODY should ever comment about any chatting in the SL Mentor Group Chat *IN* the group chat window. If one has an issue with chat that is taking place, and one really feels the need to comment, it should be done in PRIVATE IM directly with the person(s) involved. The "clear the channel" and "take it elsewhere" type of comments bug me far more than the inappropriate chat.

Don

P.S. The "you're not a Mentor Coach, you're not allowed to make that comment" nonsense was WAY out-of-line. I'd venture to say *that* person should be relieved of his/her "Coach" title.

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------ Very Important Disclaimer ------

The comments and opinions expressed in this post are mine and mine alone. I am NOT an employee of LL, nor do I speak on their behalf. You are free to disagree with anything I have said. In fact, if you feel you have better ideas or more accurate information, I *encourage* you to speak your piece.

------ Very Important Disclaimer ------

Isn't there a Q&A group for mentors somewhere? At any rate, who actually made/makes the rules on group chat for SLM? Because, honestly I don't know who to listen to, and likewise although some stupid chat may pop up from time to time, it doesn't really bother me.

I didn't see anyone mention it:

Group chat moderation planned for 1.19 viewer

Good points Pocket, im with you on this issue,, there appears to be more spam from those asking not to spam the channel,,kinda funny actually,,
smiles

Tormented... the only "official rules" for Volunteers/Mentors, written by the Lindens, are found here:

Volunteer Group IM Guidelines
http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Volunteer_Group_IM_Guidelines

Tao of Volunteers
http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Tao_of_Volunteers

Volunteer Title Activation / Conditions
http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Volunteer_Title_Activation_/_Conditions

You correctly pointed out that the Mentor Orientation Class is little more than a "Welcome to the elite, exclusive Mentor club ... Volunteers RAWK! ... Woo Hoo! ... Let's have fun!" session. These classes originally were led by Lindens, but the task has been handed off to volunteers in order to handle the many hundreds of new Mentor applicants. These volunteer class leaders are free to conduct the session as they see fit, provided they cover the (few) "essential" topics.

Way back when, the Mentors consisted of a core group of dedicated, knowledgeable individuals who enjoyed helping and educating others - particularly new residents. This has evolved into an approach of: "If we accept thousands of people as Mentors, we'll get some who are knowledgeable, and the rest will (hopefully) learn as they go."

There *has* been discussion on additional requirements for acceptance to the Mentor group - something along the lines of a "test of knowledge." There has also been a push for Mentor-to-Mentor class offerings.

As I mentioned in my previous post, the Lindens have been moving toward a more hands-off system... encouraging the Mentors to become their own independent, self-run group. So any changes to the way the Mentor group operates are likely to come *only* if instituted by the Mentors themselves.

The unfortunate side-effect of this is that, without an acknowledged leadership hierarchy, it becomes chaotic as many people assert themselves into positions of claimed authority.

These are just my observations... I have no wish to offer a judgment on whether this approach is good or bad.

But, hey... Welcome to the Wonderful World of Second Life Volunteers! ;)

- Don

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------ Very Important Disclaimer ------

The comments and opinions expressed in this post are mine and mine alone. I am NOT an employee of LL, nor do I speak on their behalf. You are free to disagree with anything I have said. In fact, if you feel you have better ideas or more accurate information, I *encourage* you to speak your piece.

------ Very Important Disclaimer ------

I propose we restructure ourselves as an anarco-sydicalist commune. We take it in turns to be a sort of executive officer for the week...but all the decisions of that officer have to be ratified at a special bi-weekly meeting...y a simple majority in the case of purely internal affairs...but by a two thirds majority in the case of...

^ _ ^

It was interesting to find this thread, since last night there was another instance of people telling others to "take it elsewhere" and "stop spamming the channel" in the SL Mentor chat. In this case, a mentor - a young lady - put out a help request for herself to the mentor group about a problem she was having with an in-world stalker. She sounded like she was about at her wit's end and was asking the other mentors for advice on how to handle dealing with the person harassing her. This prompted a flurry of responses from several other mentors online, some asking questions on the steps she had already taken and others offering opinions/advice on what she could do.

Invariably, someone made the comment that the discussion didn't belong in group chat, for it to be taken elsewhere, that they were all spamming, etc. I finally spoke up along with a few others and told the mentor making the comments to relax and that the discussion was relevant since it provided a good opportunity to see how others advocated handling the situation, and that it could be used as a resource should any of us encounter a similar problem in the future. I then suggested that the mentor having the issue take the conversation to IM once it had settled into a dialogue between her and 1-2 others (as opposed to over a dozen trying to respond.) Things quieted down after several more minutes of conversation, and all went back to normal.

My take is that if the conversation revolves around questions, issues, concerns, advice, education, resource-sharing, etc., then it is appropriate for the group chat. If it's just social chatter, then yes Mental Mentors or Chatty Mentors would be a better place for it. My experience also is that the chat has bursts of activity, then goes quiet, and that rather than complain and ask people to "take it elsewhere" when they are discussing a particular issue, it might be more prudent to just wait it out.

As for the Orientation, mine was rather chaotic, mainly due to a potential mentor chatting in voice the entire time. I ended up turning off my voice and reading the chat, then browsing through the notecards and website. We did have an impromptu quiz at the end that was helpful, but for the most part it felt like I got more information out of my reading than I did actually listening to the Orientation.

Anyway, my L$2

You absolutely have just 'read my mind'.... believe it or not, that was the exact thing that came into my mind.... gotta love Python!

Sign up here for the Tst grou p for the Mentor Q&A

http://vteamblog.com/2008/01/14/test-group-second-life-mentor-qa/

That would imply questions from "How do I edit my appearance?" to "How do I script an Helicopter?"

And when you go to the "Volunteer Welcome" they tell you the rules very clearly and you have the rules in the wiki as well... so the use of that group is just for saying "I need a german speaker for OI 4" ... just for management and I think it's right if you have questions about scripting, building, etc there are other groups for it. Putting all in one would be a mess.

There is a new group for mentor discussion called Second Life Mentor Q & A for those with a free group slot and a desire to ask or answer questions.I imagine someone's mentioned that above.

Also, one could do Help / In-World Help, and put the url for this mentors forum in the white box, click Go, , and ask the question in this forum.

Also, one could do Help / In-World Help, and put the url of their web based email client there, and send their question to the SLVOL mailing list.

Someone in the Q&A group was implying we should not be asking questions but instead read through the support portal. I agree we should all be clued up on the support portal, but implying we should not be asking questions of each other in a Q&A group is kinda ironic!

Could someone tell me.. are there mentors who are "in charge" of other mentors? Like as a simple plain mentor..would a "coach" be my boss technically?

Seems to be a lot of politics going on..

All mentors are equal and no mentor holds any "power" whatsoever no matter what silly title they have.

However, the VTeam's mindless drive to divide all the mentors into little subgroups is creating a sense of entitlement where some do believe they (or some silly "committee" they spinned off) carry more weight than others.

Hopefully the Lindens will wake up soon and realize that instead of pulling back and letting anyone random "take charge" they do need to step in and lay things down. Large groups of residents simply can not govern themselves, and mentors are no better in that regard.

Meanwhile, if another mentor implies they're "in charge" (or otherwise tries to tell you what you can and can not do) just ignore him/her and IM one of the VTeam Lindens.

Thank you Kitty as I genuinely was not sure. I have seen a few times in certain channels where people are told "thats enough everyone...thank you all" e.t.c and sometimes this is being said in the middle of someone having a question answered. I just find that rude and patronizing and wondered if there was some sort of "hierarchy" and they were just regulating the group.

I have also seen particular people jump in mid advice giving the completely wrong advice as they had not seen the question or read it properly saying "oh no we don't do that.." then again telling everyone thats enough... Its quite frustrating when you have to sit on your hands wary of "jumping in" with help in case you get "told off"

Other than that..I am loving being a mentor! lol

Speaking of Q&A, has anyone else been able to get the Chat function working - using the address on the Wiki?

I have used the mentor channel in the past, prior to leaving the mentor program in disgust.

I could simply go to the NCI channel and ask a question and get answers from people, like myself, with years of experience. The mentor group has degraded over the years, sadly.

Before my departure from being a mentor I found it sad, not only the hand slapping but the general overlying fact that a large percentage of mentors lacked basic knowledge of SL.

No there are no mentors in charge of other mentors no matter how they like to act so in the group chat

It is very patronizing and self servicing if you ask me.