How to handle indecency?

So I had a couple incidents over the past week that prompted this poll.
One took place at the Ahern welcome area where I was helping a new resident who in voice asked how she could fix it to not hear the endless stream of cussing and swearing going on there. As I proceeded to explain to her in voice how to mute people a few of the offending residents went ape shit crazy throwing insults at both of us and insisting we leave the “welcome” area. I sent the now utterly shocked newbie to Help Island and stuck around until a Linden showed up.
The second incident took place at Orientation Island Public where there were 4 residents on top of the big sign going at it with sex animations. They were clothed but I asked them if they could find someplace else to do that. They stopped but then wanted to debate whether what they were doing was indecent since they were clothed.
I didn’t AR anyone in either situation for a number of reasons including I knew some of the residents in both incidents and ultimately I disrupted their activity anyway.
Regardless of whether you think I handled these situations well or not; I would like to know what level of tolerance should be expected from SL residents when exposed to these types of situations in a PG area, especially when newbies are around.

And here are some excerpts from the Community Standards, TOS and the Knowledge Base concerning indecency.

Unfortunately, the 'welcome' area has been on a downward spiral for years now. It is far too easy a place to target for people with nothing better to do that target new residents; I guess it makes them feel tough!

I don't think there's an easy solution other than complete decentralization of the new user experience, which has started, and if done right could be a great thing. I believe retention rates will be much higher if the sign up process allows new users to find a group with similar interest to their own.

Now that I've read that, it really isn't an answer; just commentary on the problem.

Regards,

-Flip

I usually ignore stuff like that, since those types thrive on attention. However, I do feel bad for a newbie who is given the impression that cursing like a sailor and verbal abuse are standard procedure in Second Life. In fact, abuse isn't acceptable anywhere, PG or not. It's pretty quick and easy to AR the offenders.

I am going to tease you a little bit for using the word "shit" in a thread complaining about indecency. Oh no, you just made me say "shit." I said it again!

I could edit it to say ape poo but that’s not as funny and you’ve already quoted me.
Besides even PG allows for some language and brief nudity (yeah I was surprised).
It’s the constant F-bomb and worse that’s truly offensive.

Hey what happened to my poll?

The unfortunate reality is that you are helpless. The only thing you can do is get the new resident away from the area when it gets bad. This was the number one reason I stopped Mentoring - too many days of hanging out in the Welcome Area with downright offensive behavior going on and no Linden support. I finally decided that if they didn't care about their new registrations then why should I?

Grrrr. I must have hit Submit New Thread before I had the Poll part finished.
Please post to the Poll “Public areas and Community Standards”

It would be great of the point of entry to SL were a more insular environment, and only absolute newbies and helpers were allowed. Perhaps at some point LL will rise to the challenge here and create a better neutral area..... perhaps it would just be a simple matter of not allowing folks to re-log in the brand spankin newbie zone once they have completed the tutorials. I don't know.....but I imagine it could be worked out.

Until that happens....I choose to remain tolorent on the issue......abandoning my mentorship would seem to only give those that disrupt and offend, even more power. I wont do that....folks who are new deserve to have a positive expereince with mentors.

I will make one observation tho.....whether or not this matters, I don't know. But, this is sort of an example of basic human nature. I love SL....I joined because the creativity fascinated and I just wanted to SEE......after almost a year, I'm still fascinated and I love exploring.
My fiance.....who is truly a decent and wonderful man, thinks SL is a riot.....he would not, could not, take a thing like SL seriously. He loves gaming....but more the organized first person shooter types. He has no interest in the social elements of SL.....and is really not that impressed with the graphics or creative side. It's just not what he's about. If he were to go in SL....he'd be a terror..... LOL He'd be the first person to grab some funky weapons and gear and start wrecking havoc.....because he just doesn't take anything that seriously. IRL, he has a wonderful sense of humor and loves to laugh....and loves people. but that's just it....some folks are just 'realists' They simply do not se a place like SL as anything to take seriously. When faced with personalities like that, who do venture in.....we are always going to have a huge challenge on our hands. (When I told him he'd get banned if he became a griefer.....he laughed....he didn't care....it was purely a child like source of entertainment to him......incidentally, he never signed up....LOL) IRL he would never ever do anything to terrorize others...and as he so simply put it....well just get off the computer then, what's the big deal? There's no easy answer to that kind of thinking in SL.

Milla, they already do that for Orientation Island and Help Island. Roping off the Welcome Area would just add another layer to that. At some point, the newbie has to be shoved out of the nest and into the chaotic world of the Main Grid.

I thought your comments about your RL husband and his approach to computer gaming was very insightful. I guess some of the people that we think of as griefers may not be such bad folks after all...just operating with a wildly different mindset.

The very first time I logged in, I looked around me and saw the chat ... and I thought OMG what the hell is this? I am not at ALL interested in this.

Frankly I was on the point of uninstalling except that I went to get a drink for us from the kitchen and when I came back I'd been magically moved (by the other drink recipient) to a much more conducive place.

The only thing you can do is patiently and with humour (or faking humour) explain that the behaviour is not appropriate. Then get abused. Then AR. Then hope assistance is available

And keep telling the newbies ... this ain't the way it is, honest.

DaQbet,

In my opinion, your first quote from Community Standards says it all. In both instances, the individuals you describe should not have been behaving so in a PG sim. In your second case, clothed or not, the individuals should have taken it to an M rated sim. I hate having to act like a policeman (or policewoman!), but the best way we as residents have of cleaning up the welcome areas is to ask for inappropriate behavior to be stopped. If our requests are ignored and serve to incite irate or violent behavior the best tool we have at our disposal is an AR. The rules are clearly spelled out. And perhaps if more people were AR'ed in the welcome areas it might get cleaned up a little, and SL would have many more productive residents.

Just my two cents worth.

Kloacen

In my opinion, I think there should be an "undercover" Linden there at random points.
Perhaps not called "X Linden" but called something else.

There doesn't need to be a member of staff there 24/7, but I agree that when a Linden has some spare time they should go to the welcome area and see who appears, and severely punish those who fail to follow the ToS.

Same goes for me. I still help a lot of new residents (oh, I can say noobs now ) but not on OI or HI's, and not with my mentor tag. I like helping people, but I'm not an underpaid LL employer, I did it because I liked it. But I don't feel like dealing with griefers and cursers without any LL help, when I asked for it.

Same goes for me. I got tired of playing police but not having any backup. SL is supposed to be fun for us too. I still help newbies when I meet them, but rarely wear the tag anymore, or go to any of the mass newbie areas. As for ARing, that rarely helps the immediate situation. Most responses I've had to any of my ARs usually take 2-3 days. We don't even get the satisfaction of knowing if something constructive was done to the perpetrator.

I admit the system is far from perfect, but it is what it is. It's the only system we as Mentors have to address these issues. I can think of a number of solutions that would make mentors happy, but that might cause problems for LL. So, until a better resolution pathway is found I say don't give up on what we have. Use it, and keep making constructive suggestions to the VTeam members at office hours and meetings. It might feel like we are banging our heads against the wall most of the time, but if we keep at it we might make a dent (however small).

When I go to a mall or store in RL and there are people dressed inappropriately or saying things that are inappropriate I ignore them. If there are rules there I would notify security or the manager if it *really* is disruptive and interferes with my shopping or dining or whatever experience. If the staff there does not take care of the problem, I can do one of two things. (1) Complain to a higher manager, the Better Business Bureau or other mediating agency that can assist hoping for a resolution or (2) Don't go there anymore.

In RL it's usually isolated incidents that cause people to feel uncomfortable in public places and the problem is usually addressed fairly easily. So you can go back to that location knowing that inappropriate behavior is not tolerated. But if it isn't? Then what? I wouldn't go there anymore and I would not recommend that anyone else do so either.

The same rule applies in SL for me. If I can go somewhere and have an enjoyable experience I will most likely go back there. If there are people shouting obscenities, harassing me and others, and running a-muck where no one is able to or willing to control the situation, I don't go back.

I simply stay away from places that allow such inappropriate behavior. When the people who like to harass others realize that it is a place where they can go to do their dirt, word gets around and others like them will follow and will do so as long as it is allowed.

Just my 99 cents

~Maddy

DaQbet, I really believe you handled these events as well as you could have. Having reported a couple incidents myself, I think it is very important to have a low-to-zero tolerance for the behavior you described. There are appropriate places to do that, even if the person(s) enjoy public activity. Help Island, Orientation Island, and the public areas are not included in that.

And you are absolutely correct that the ToS are specific on what is acceptable.

Brianna Messmer.

Since the thread had been necroed when I came across it....


But.... the guy would be a griefer and would be a "bad" person.

"When I told him he'd get banned if he became a griefer.....he laughed....he didn't care....it was purely a child like source of entertainment to him......incidentally, he never signed up....LOL)"

His 'wildly different mindset' does not appear to include respect for others.
His instinct is to treat other real people like purely digital pieces in a first-person shoot-em-up game.
When someone like that comes into SL there are really only two steps:
1) Point out to him that he is annoying real people
2) Ban his ass if he doesn't get the message

The guy might well be a wonderful loving husband and father, active in his community, a volunteer and fund-raiser for worthy charities, etc....
However, if he comes into SL with a lack of respect for others, then he's just another a**hole griefer.

just ignore it. people like that LOVE attention and most everything you'd possible say would be funny to them/ They needle you fro the er lulz as they say. just explain to the noobs your'e tryin to help that sl has its share or tards and move on.

Oh, I agree. I just thought it was an interesting insight into how the minds of some of these people work. Just because I now understand them a little better, though, doesn't mean I won't still AR their sorry asses if they keep up the childish behavior.