Ways of getting around this gambling ban

Since SL has banned games of chance, someone should make a game like Pachinko (without the slot machine video reels in the middle), or Battleship.

SL has deemed gambling only to be game of chance (with use of random number generators) and wagering. It hasn't, however, labeled games of skill as gambling.

Someone should code skill games like battleship, where the computer (with a strong AI system) guesses where your ship is, and vice-versa. If you win against the AI, you win the 2x money you put into the machine. It doesn't involve random number generators of any sort. Someone could also encode arcade games, so that if you reach a certain high score, at the end of the day, you win the total pot accumulated.

My favorite is Pachinko. It involves slinging balls up, into a machine (the user controls the power of the balls, with the amount of force varying to keep the balls from flying up into one spot), then the balls drop down, through pins, and hopefully, into certain holes in the machine. If a ball falls into that hole, the user would gain 3 to 5 more balls. If the ball falls into the middle hole, they'd gain 10 or so balls. If the balls fall through the bottom, they lose the balls. I think someone could program the game, in such a way, that it only involves pure physics, and not random number generators. Each ball would cost, say, 1L. For the total amount of balls the user wants to exit with, that's the amount of linden the machine would pay out.

If the admins decide to ban all games that pay out any kind of money, I think a coder could also program the games so they distribute encoded "tickets," with the value they've earned on it. They'd then "sell" the tickets to a machine to get their money.

If SL decided to ban that, then they've essentially banned ALL business in their game. Think they'd have fun with that one.

Well there is a makeshift pachinko game out there in secondlife.. unfortunatly physics in secondlife kinda suck.. they arent good enough for a good game of pachinko. but still even so its still a random outcome whether it be random numbers or posibility of going left or right by random.

I do have somewhat of a solution to the gambling ban .. its called Ticketek and it is a legal way of gambling that allows people to play games like slot machines and such and be paid back in tickets which are used in vendors for items. its pretty cool.. look it up on www.slexchange.com

/me pictures playing battleship in SL, complete with moving (and exploding) ships and such.

That might be cool..

Yeah...the outcome is random, but someone can't really classify gambling as being a game with a random outcome. If that were the case, the US would put a ban on all arcade parlor games, like ski-ball, or that machine where the hand drops down and you win a prize. Sure, there's a chance you can win, but there's an element of skill there, too. The same thing with Pachinko, since you'd be controlling the speed of the ball and where it lands.

I don't know why gumball machines aren't banned in the US, since the outcome of what you win is purely luck. In my honest opinion, I define gambling as playing games of PURE luck or chance, with no skill factor involved in the game. (slot machines, craps, dice, etc) I don't know why some card games, like poker are considered gambling, though, since there's a skill factor in actually playing your cards, bluffing, etc. Anyways, I think SL's attempt at actually classifying gambling to certain games was a very very bad move on their part, since they're banning things that aren't even considered illegal in the US, such as gumball machines, and their "definition" is very broad.

The law that forced LL to change policy is specific to the Internet. The definition is pretty tight, saying any random factor along with a wager and a prize is "gambling".

LL won't be willing to let folks experiment with "getting around" the restriction, since it's thier business that will tank should the FBI feel the need to come sniffing around, and find something.

Gambling is dead. Get a new business model.

I don't care about LL complying with US laws. What I do care about is LL putting bans on all things that US law allows, such as lottery tickets. I feel that LL is really compromising their own business in SL by setting these standards up. It seems as though business is only limited to shops for virtual dress-up items, surveys for cash scams, and advertising now. Of course there's great potential for internet sites, such as e-bay or online music retailers to set up on SL to sell real life items, through usage of Lindex currency, but, unfortunately, I don't see anything of that nature happening.

You can buy lottery tickets over the internet with a credit card?

"Battleship" does require random number generation to implement, if the computer is the opponent. For avatars playing against each other, it does not. However, even then it does involve chance. Note that LL did not say that random number generators were invalid.

Poker is a game of skill, yet it's still banned because of the strong element of chance. It's different from Battleship because players *could* use a strategy that doesn't involve chance. Of course, in the long run, Battleship players who don't use random elements would get creamed by sophisticated opponents.

Consider a simpler game, rock-paper-scissors, between players (not player versus computer). No random number generators required, but entirely a game of chance. (More correctly, anyone who uses a strategy that is not purely chance gives their opponent an advantage, unless that strategy exploits any non-randomness in the other player's strategy.)

Part of the problem is that LL's rules don't agree with their list of banned games. In other words, they don't say what they mean, and mean what they say. Furthermore, the people enforcing the policy aren't consistent. Sploders do NOT seem to be banned, which is a complete mystery to me.

It would be interesting to see whether a duplicate bridge tournament (where all tables are dealt the same hands) would be considered gambling. Random numbers are used in this case, but there is no strong element of chance: the best teams make the best plays and tend to win the tournaments.

In general, only states are allowed to create lotteries. Note that it's the states that pass the laws regulating gambling -- there is no US law banning it).

LL is merely covering their assets (with or without the 't'). They are worried that if they allow gambling, credit card companies will stop working with LL. The credit card companies might have done just that, due to US laws about funding of illegal internet gambling sites. Lack of credit-card support for LL would have been an even bigger blow to the SL economy.

I'm sure they hated to do it, and they chose what they thought was the lesser of two evils.

BTW, I doubt we'll ever see much sales of RL items via SL. It's inefficient because the funds get hit with a commission on both ends, converting between $L and real currencies. Marketing, yes, but sales, no.

I think the difference is actually defined in the LL Gambling policy. The winning of items that ultimately have little to no value is allowed. It is the same with ski-ball and gumball machines. No one is going to attempt to dirive an income based upon play ski-ball prizes.

Now the use of "Tickets" redeemable at a later time or place is a long time tried plow around RL and now SL gambling restrictions. They have never worked for anykind of long time before authorities laying down the smack down in RL and we will just have to see in SL with the new ticket based systems that have been popping up.

There are off shore sites that will sell them, but most, if not all States forbid it. They may not honor a winning ticket purchased this way.

I think the bigger question is whether or not the credit card company will grow angry about it..

I would distrust playing for more than honor in an online duplicate bridge tournament since that's so readily cheatable via IM. The original duplicate tournaments were held for Whist to demonstrate that it wasn't merely a game of chance as many asserted. I performed the same tests for my Zyngo games and was able to demonstrate that players controlled the outcome, and that some were definitely better than others at the game.

Look at my TickeTek system its a great way of bringing back the old gaming ways without going into illegal teritory.

So can we get battleship to work playing for free somehow?