remove payment info

i think the payment info in the profile should be removed to me that is a privaciy issue. i think only the lindens should know if a person has used their credit card or payment info to sign up or not.

it is none of the buisness of other users and to me would be totally unessary for other users.

i think it should be removed. its no one elses buisness but yours if you used your credit card or not to pay for the account.

I agree that it shouldn't be necessary at all, because all SL users should have to pay something for their membership. Unfortunately, LL has made it necessary by allowing players to join anonymously.

What it does is separate users into two groups. Those who are willing to spend money on SL, and those who aren't. If you're in the group who is willing, then it's not really a privacy issue. Otherwise, all you have to do is spend a couple bucks.

There is a purpose to it.

The main grid has mature material that under law must be restricted from minors. That is, the residents who are providing and selling mature content become legally liable if they sell to a minor.

The generally accepted method of age verification is the credit card.

It is the responsibility of the mature content provider to verify the buyer's age by at least the accepted method, otherwise, if such mature material is found in the hands of a minor who has no account verification, the provider is liable. Linden Lab, who provides that info to us is free from liability.

While I was reading this I thought "why not hide the verification status and just keep the functions that detect it?" then I realized that not all mature transactions take place at vendors, direct trade is possible.

The feature is not necessarily an invasion of privacy but it is a means to legally protect mature content providers from prosecution.

Perhaps something that will work for you is if Linden Lab will provide the option to hide your payment status. However this means that to all detectors that you will have a status of unverified for as long as the info is hidden. So for as long as your status is hidden, you may not participate in any mature activities or enter into any establishment designated as mature.

I don't think this is actually a disgreement with the previous poster. The point is that this feature is only necessary because of unverified accounts. This means that unverified accounts create a situation where LL is revealing RL information about people... and my immediate reaction is not "we need this information", it's "this is a good reason not to have unverified accounts".

We don't need them, we didn't used to have them, so why not get rid of them?

For that last question you will have to ask Linden Lab. I don't want to argue the point of unverified accounts because this is one of those issues where I don't feel confident second-guessing LL's purposes.

But for now the unverified accounts are here. Since Linden Lab seems to have no intentions of getting rid of them and it seems to be part of their current strategy, we definitely need that verification info visible, or rather, the mature content providers do (I don't).

I'm not bothered by it at all really. All it indicates is that someone has info or used info. The security level is no different from before.

So they know I have payment info. Heck anyone who has a rez day earlier than June 2006 or owns land has payment info, you don't need the payment status flag to know that.

There are some however who are new and have no land that have payment info. Would you want to shut them out from things that are for verified people only?

You may not be happy with the presence of the unverified, but to change that you have to take that up with Linden Lab.

You don't need to second guess their purposes. The unverified accounts aren't necessary to allow people to preview SL, but they make it necessary (according to your reasonable argument) to create two "castes" of people in SL: "honest citizens" versus "griefers and deadbeats".

I just went in and created an alt with no payment info (and I noticed that LL is still advertising a L$500 stipend in the welcome email) and I'll go see what it's like from that side. From my side, I've had several people ask me if I was (or why I wasn't (!)) banning unverified accounts (or "griefer alts" from my lands, which seems like a pretty bad sign to me.
This forum is "current version feature feedback", is it not?

Yes it is. But you stated your issue with unverifieds in a quote post so at that moment it becomes addressed to me.

So I will now assume that it wasn't.

I would like to point out that everyone that griefed me in my entire stay in SL was a verified account. This includes the time after 6/6/6. I have never associated griefing with unverified. The majority of unverifieds are not griefers. I also don't equate verified with honest citizens. Verified to me means nothing more than info on file or paid something. There are serious SL criminals among the verifieds too. For example how can you be a land swooper if you're not verified?

I would ban griefers, not unverifieds, and there is nothing to say the two are equivalent.

What I can agree with is that majority of griefers are unverified. However this does not imply the converse is true, that is, you can't assume most unverified are griefers.

So while it was a good stopgap measure to ban unverifieds from your property, the conclusion that unverified = griefer is unfounded.

UPDATE: I verified my acct after the whole copybot incident back in September I think. It was mainly so that I could buy land. Not mainland just private island land where i live on azure islands.



TY TY TY TY I've been "unverified" since i joined SL and still am... part of the reason is that SL has been down so much since I have joined in May 06'. And it saddens me to pay for something that is down as much as it is esp lately. I often talk w/my friends on SL who are also "unverified" or just "payment info on file" for the same reasons and we do agree that we would be even more upset if we had to pay...

And also I find that you still can do a lot while u have no pymt info on file, for instance I rent the land that I call my home I like being able to do that bc i think its tough to have to pay LL for the monthly fees and then pay for land and then pay "X" amount per month to own and keep that land!!!! Fees Fees Fees... can never escape the bills whether its RL or SL

You don't have to pay for membership -- just spend $3.50 to buy 1000L, and you're set for life.


You're completely right, except that LL has left us with no other way to determine *beforehand* who may or may not be a worthwhile resident.

It's a bad situation, yes, but the problem is not making the payment info public. The problem is LL not wanting to verify members.

So than why not verify when you sign up, that makes more sense does it not?

Not with the way I shop

Aodhan: I think we're talking at cross purposes.

I didn't say you had. And I didn't say I was going to ban unverifieds.

Look: I wrote "I've had several people ask me if I was (or why I wasn't (!)) banning unverified accounts (or "griefer alts" from my lands, which seems like a pretty bad sign to me."

That's because the sequence was, typically:

Someone: "Are you banning people with no payment info on file."
Me: "No."
Them: "Why aren't you banning griefer alts?"
Me: (!)

Whatever the reality, there's a perception that unverifieds are (and should be treated as) "second class citizens". I really don't like the idea of having anyone treated as a second class citizen in SL, no matter what their situation. I want to see Linden Labs come up with some other way of pumping up their population numbers that doesn't involve branding people as "not like us".

Skky: What he means by "set for life" is "your payment info will be 'on file' and 'used', once and for all". You wouldn't need to buy anything else to make that work.

I'm in favor of removing the payment info from profiles.

Let someone's behavior speak to their maturity.

Exactly, hehe. But based on your post you didn't seem to have any trouble coming up with L$ on your own.


Why yes, it does, and that's the whole point.


I don't buy that. I think LL is still legally liable. They are the ones distributing the content to end users via their servers.


*sigh*, I'm going to stop talking now, because it's getting me nowhere.

I'm not opposed to people being able to ban all 'unverified' avatars from their parcel or estate.

I just don't want people to have to walk around with a badge of shame or golden star on their forehead for all to see and judge them by.

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Teleport Failed: That destination is only available to premium members.

Ok, that is a very good distinction.