account information?

Although the message won't be any benefit to hackers, I feel they are still not right. Saying Payment Info on File, or No Payment Info on File sound abit 'revealing' to me, even though it not actually do.

What about changing that words to something like... Unidentified Account, Identified Account, Verified Account, or somethings similar? That will make the same meaning but less people will mentally hurt by the wording.

What do you think?

does Info on File mean the credit card or Paypal info given was tested for existence of the account, or could it just be made up numbers and expiration date?

if an attempt to bill an account is made and fails because the account does not exist or is over limit or has some other problem does the verification status remain "Payment Info on File"?

it's possible to run a "verify account" transaction without billing someone for something, can people get this done in order to have an account verified?

OK, Linden Labs are breaking their own TOS.

From the new 6.1:

Linden Lab will not give any of your personal information to any third party without your express approval except: as reasonably necessary to fulfill your service request,

My billing status is personal information. Putting a status tag in my profile is giving information to a third party, and I have not given express approval. Furthermore, it is not 'reasonably necessary' to divulge that information under any circumstances except as required by law enforcement agencies.

Lewis

While reading another thread a thought occurred to me. The new TOS allow for divulging a person's billing status, but the old does not, AFAIK. I haven't currently agreed to the new TOS -- what if I don't and what if I specificially decline to agree to it? What does my profile say about my account type then? Right now, if it says anything about my billing information, then LL is divulging personal information without my consent.

So what does it say in profiles where people haven't agree to the new TOS? Are you divulging personal information without consent?

the new feature does not give out any personal information it only allows other to know if they can be sure you are really you and then the thing about wether you paid or not gives them an idea as to wether you are likely to pay them for a service or whatever. This feature is *NOT* a breach of contract. Read the damn TOS line you like to quote and look closely.

I'm going to paste from another thread as I am in total agreement and I do not wish to have my personal info shared with strangers. It is no ones business how I pay for SL except to those at LL billing. If you want to put this type of verification in profiles then it needs to be done a different way such as: Verified-Yes Verified-No. How hard is that?



Copied from another:

From the new 6.1:

Linden Lab will not give any of your personal information to any third party without your express approval except: as reasonably necessary to fulfill your service request,
My billing status is personal information. Putting a status tag in my profile is giving information to a third party, and I have not given express approval. Furthermore, it is not 'reasonably necessary' to divulge that information under any circumstances except as required by law enforcement agencies.

Ok I'm now sure how to put all this info floating in my head down into this post and get my point across but here goes.

Ok this whole open registration was done without a proper vote on it (which in my opinion is what we should of had with something so serious)

So the reasons LL gives to the whole open registration thing is BS in my opinion.
A) Your precious US to overseas ratio is going to go right back to normal once you weed through all the newbies for the kids that squeaked in, not to mention the loyal customers/players who are going to quit or have already because of this crap.
B) If the majority of people are signing out of registration before finishing it's up to you LL to make the advertising more appealing not to mention the notices of security to help them with their decisions. It's not up to us to pay you thousands of dollars a year and also be your babysitter, as far as I recall we should be paid to babysit, not pay and babysit.
C) If we are letting them in for free to dip their toes out as Torley once mentioned, and it's because they don't have a CC what do you think is going to happen they are gonna miraculously LOVE SL so much that they will go out and kill someone for a CC to play?
I mean come on give me a break this is ridiculous.


As for this new update, I could care less who knows what I pay I could care less who pays what in this game but having a thousand jerks in game who have no CC isn't gonna help us one damn bit. Your abuse reports are jokes, I tried to have someone come down cause I couldn't get someone off my land who was being rude. Well no Linden showed up (which I was sent to abuse reports after live help told me to file an abuse report not a linden there either) not to mention I got a blank email from LL about the abuse report
GOOD JOB.
NOW the whole "spyware" type system LL wants to run on new accounts I def. don't agree with. Its like saying OH OPEN BORDERS ALL OVER THE UNITED STATES YOU CAN GET IN WITH NO PERSONAL INFORMATION REVEALED OR GIVEN. ALL WE'RE GONNA DO IS SCAN YOU WITH A METAL DETECTOR ONCE DURING YOUR CROSSING AND WE'LL NEVER BUG YA AGAIN. Pffttttt if someone hacked these forums they'll hack that process eventually and UM I'm sorry I'm a little leary about that. Oh not to mention there's ways around it already provided you own your pc or at least have the recovery software.
What in the world do you think would happen. Not only would you have chaos overwhelming at all the borders you'd have a lot of unhappy PREVIOUS residents. HMMMM sounds like LL's current situation rising.

Anyway I suppose all in all unless someone can explain to me what the hell you are all thinking doing this with money we pay not to mention your investors I mean I'm no business professional but pissing off extremely loyal customers in order to give a chance to a bunch of people who are not obviously appreciating it seems like horrible business practice to me and I for one will not be contributing my 75 a month to your mad cause anymore.

ALSO terminating accounts with NO liability to the account holder...and with NO reason.

Yes. SL is ahead of its time.

Makes ya think twice before renting bandwidth in the form of a sim? Or using a credit card with a doable limit on it.

Uh..need an 'SL' answer...or a lame prevarication. Whichever one you SL answerline folks are up to today.


Signed,
Purchased My Bandwidth Before This Latest TOS


BTW, PS, etc....is the grid status option accurate..or just semi-accurate...or just a delaying tactic so folks don't ask you about grid status HERE? You know...the 'wrong' place to ask. Cause the grid status data is...forgive the word...lagging.

What is this mockery of those who don't feel confident sharing account information or any other privacy information? Can anyone tell me what relevance this has to another player?



"in your willingness to provide us with payment information" - I mean "willingness". What the heck...

why are they limiting access to people that dont have some kind of verified payment thing? Are you going to possibly reinstate that verified basic accounts get some sort of L payment or what because frankly that doesnt seem fair to cut that out then expect them to give up their info just to access area's. Arnt you just technically back tracking as to why you made the accounts unverified in the first place and making the pinch on "broadening your player base" worse in fact instead of better.

Essentially your tightening your grip even more then it used to be and this is getting pretty out of hand. People are going to complain about griefers and kids no matter what you do and i think you gave into that pressure without fully thinking the update thru thouroughly. I think this went a bit to far and your plans for future updates for this are taking it way to far. Its funny to read that blog post that robin posted yesterday turn around and see you guys just totally tighten up.

When i joined a basic account was 10 dollars. It then moved up to needing a cell phone or credit card (first account being free). Now it was moved to all accounts being free which in light of everything else stripped from the basic accounts makes sense. They are penniless now when they start. Will LL be compensating some form of a "bonus" to encourage them to provide their payment information because right now there really is no reasoning behind them providing it except to buy L.

I am a new member, I did not provide my payment information because I see no need to. It doesn't get me anything new. Now however people take one look at my profile and ban me from their land just because they will assume that because i did not provide my payment info that I must be either a child or a griefer. How is this fair? I am here with the best of intentions, I may provide payment info if I need to buy $L's or if I find that there is actually a good reason to become a premium member.

Why even bother with the "provided payment information" stuff, why not just identify the fields as Premium, paid basic, free basic? That is how people read it anyway.

I went to a popular club today and accidentally bumped into someone because of the lag and apparently someone reported the bump "yes I said sorry" to the club owner and I was immediately banned from the club. I IM'd the owner to find out why and they said because I griefed a guest and because they thought I was a griefing alt. because of my "no payment info" label in my profile.

This is a VERY bad message to new members and I'm sure you'll find an increase in these kinds of behaviors because of these labels. Personally I think my status in SL is nobody's business but mine and LL's. I resent having that info made public and will give LL a week to remove that info from my profile then I will leave SL for good. I do not need to deal with discrimination in SL.

BAD MOVE LL!!!

This is stupid, and am not so happy with it either, since this update my account says : No Pyament Info On File, i mean what the ....??? i got into second life on luck, because i 1. do not own a stupid creditcard. 2. am NOT a US resident with a cellphone i can use to identify myself.

however, in the time i have been in second life i supported alot of people get on aswell (they do own CC's), I have spent over 200.000 lindens already in the grid, hows that for commitment?

the new update is a complete waste of time if you ask me, and also puts a tag on the front of my head, alot will have the same feeling, us free players will now be seen as griefers, multi accounts for camp zones, people who mess about to annoy others, no thanks, i created a running SL company and i know from the experience with my customers that i dont deserve the tag : No Payment Info On File, this is stupid, plain simple stupid. i was going to get verified and get a premium account, but the way this goes, no way, my commitment to SL just became alot less

i may seem griefing here, but you better believe it that i am very ........ off

sideedit, How nice it is indeed to edit and mess with the agreements to fit LL's needs when its handy, i have not received any notification, knowing you can change it at any time without me knowing it, still i could be interrested in it, you dont buy items either with the warranty to the doorstep, thats what SL is going towards now.

i may just aswell close the doors to my services in second life, because there is no way i will be able to attract customers with an account like this, thanks alot LL's.

I'd like to point out this thread

/108/5f/116689/1.html

and more directly this post



I'd like some assurances that hackers won't use the new field that shows whether or not we have provided and/or used our credit card info that is in our profile to know exactly who to target. Furthermore I'd like assurances that any RL money that ends up stolen due to this new info. in our profiles will be replaced by LL since they made it known to everyone out there that LL has a record of our credit card.

My paid or un-paid status in my opinion is my business and LL's business and nobody else's. I LOVE my land, I love SL, I LOVE getting my stipend but I agree, if this info isn't removed from my profile I am strongly considering leaving SL as a paid member and will demand that all record of my CC# be removed from LL's databases unless the above can be assured. I Love SL, but my finances are MUCH more important.

I've merged these.

Some of these concerns are already addressed in Robin's blog, Be The Change:

http://secondlife.blogs.com/change/

Particularly this post:

http://secondlife.blogs.com/change/2006/06/update_open_reg.html

Please bookmark and keep checking it for regular updates, and feel free to leave comments there, where we can easier track them. As Second Life has grown so much, we're scaling towards more effective means of communication and clarifying policies.

Re: the wording, a number of things were suggested internally. If there's a popular thread shared by the community--for example, a Vote Proposal in the Feature Voting Tool, please feel free to email that my way (torley@lindenlab.com). It's always beautiful when a lot of Residents agree on something and reach out to us about it.

I'll be sure to forward this for any other insights!