Contradictory messages one week apart

Breakfast and Stock Markets in Virtual Worlds Panel at approximately 1:13:00

in response to a question asking an imaginable realworld loss in the game economy:
"well for us it's explicit, i mean that it's the total value of the currency in second life held between all the people who are in secondlife is in the order now of ... millions of dollars US" - Philip Rosedale, AKA Philip Linden, CEO of Linden Lab


Terms of Service

"4.3 All Data On Linden's Servers Are Subject to Deletion, Alteration or Transfer. When using the Service, you may accumulate ... measures of virtual wealth. THESE DATA... MAY BE DELETED, ALTERED, MOVED OR TRANSFERRED AT ANY TIME FOR ANY REASON IN LINDEN'S SOLE DISCRETION. ... LINDEN DOES NOT ADMIT, PROVIDE OR GUARANTEE, AND EXPRESSLY DISCLAIMS ... ANY VALUE, CASH OR OTHERWISE, ATTRIBUTED TO CONTENT OR ACCUMULATED STATUS OR OTHER DATA." - Terms of Service for Second Life

unedited passage:
4.3 All Data On Linden's Servers Are Subject to Deletion, Alteration or Transfer. When using the Service, you may accumulate objects, items, measures of virtual wealth or experience, scripts, equipment, or other value or status indicators ("Accumulated Status". THESE DATA, AND ANY OTHER DATA INCLUDING CONTENT (AS DEFINED IN SECTION 6.1 BELOW), ACCOUNT HISTORY AND AVATAR NAMES RESIDING ON LINDEN'S SERVERS, MAY BE DELETED, ALTERED, MOVED OR TRANSFERRED AT ANY TIME FOR ANY REASON IN LINDEN'S SOLE DISCRETION. YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THAT, NOTWITHSTANDING ANY COPYRIGHT OR OTHER RIGHTS YOU MAY HAVE WITH RESPECT TO ITEMS YOU CREATE USING THE SERVICE, AND NOTWITHSTANDING ANY VALUE ATTRIBUTED TO SUCH CONTENT OR OTHER DATA BY YOU OR ANY THIRD PARTY, LINDEN DOES NOT ADMIT, PROVIDE OR GUARANTEE, AND EXPRESSLY DISCLAIMS (SUBJECT TO ANY UNDERLYING RIGHTS IN THE CONTENT), ANY VALUE, CASH OR OTHERWISE, ATTRIBUTED TO CONTENT OR ACCUMULATED STATUS OR OTHER DATA.

That doesn't seem contradictory to me. The first statement is about the value of potential losses, while the second pertains to the liability for any losses.

Actually I'd say it's more than contradictory, Philip is specifically breaking/ignoring his own TOS.


TOS says that L$ has no value. Philip is refering to the ingame currency value in terms of millions of US$.. so which is it? Millions of US$ or ZERO?

That depends if you're a resident trying to claim for a loss of money through their service or a member of the press looking to spin an article on how you can earn $$$ in Second Life. It's not contradictory... it's marketing!

ok, what if you're a member of the press looking to spin an article on how you can earn $$$ in Second Life and you loose money due to an error in the service and try to claim a loss?

LL is in America during the Bush administration. There are no contradictions or lies. Instead it is a version of reality reinterpreted for a specific target audience.

Somehow these discussions about the value of L$ consistently intertwine two viewpoints as though they were one in the same, when in fact, they are not. They cannot be and never will be, so long as there are litigious inclinations on the part of members/players.

The first viewpoint is that between the Lindenlab service provision system and the member/player. In this case, Lindenlab must say, for their own protection, that L$ have no value. Things can happen in a game, or even in the history of a game existence, that impacts upon the balance of L$ in a member/player's account. Lindenlab just can't cover any/all contingencies in that case. Ergo, the value of the L$ between Lindenlab and the member/player directly is... ZERO.

The second viewpoint is between members/players themselves. Here is where perceived values among these individuals comes into play and some relationship between L$ and US$ is established. This perceived value is external to the first case relationship and is a real one.... but only among the members/players.

Lindex, it seems to me, is actually just a mechanism that supports the second viewpoint, not the first. So, they charge fees to cover that effort on our behalf. So, those who point to Lindex and purport that it crosses the line into the first viewpoint appear to be mistaken.

Philip Linden, or anyone else for that matter, can accurately and without contradiction comment upon the state of the game from either viewpoint. Philip has a vested interest in seeing that the conduct of the game is healthy for its continuation and therefor has interest in both of the viewpoints.

Buck,

Excellent description, your right on the mark. So many SL'ers miss this point. It is also because of this distinction that LL will never 'manufacture' L$ for sale directly to a user, or sell L$ directly thru the LindeX (or any other exchange) as that WOULD break their TOS and set precident that LL recognizes real world value for L$.

So, we can be assured that (unless they want their RL business in the proverbial toilet overnight) LL will monitor and manage the economy thru sinks and sources, to allow the SL economy to grow. They will leave the 'value' of the L$ to be set by the users based upon our collective valuation of the goods and services which are available to us in SL which can be bought or accessed with L$.

Mickey