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So What's Stopping Pirating In SL?

Jared Somme
Registered User
Join date: 23 Nov 2005
Posts: 3
11-24-2005 00:42
I just learned about this game and found it quite interesting and even thought of creating my own product however I don't see what's stopping people from pirating any of the products out there.

For example if a clothing store came out with a hip new shirt that everyone wanted. What's stopping one person from buying it and then distributing it for free or at a cheaper cost to other players?

Hopefully there are some type of measures in place to keep pirating from happening otherwise it appears that any and all product owners would simply just be getting ripped off left and right.

By the way I posted this is this thread because if piracy was rampant it'd have to be having a negative effect on the economy just like it does in real life.
Seifert Surface
Mathematician
Join date: 14 Jun 2005
Posts: 912
11-24-2005 01:01
The permissions system. Every object has 3 tick boxes, for what the next owner can do to it. They are modify, copy and transfer. If an object is copy and transfer (i.e. give or sell to someone else), then it could be pirated, and such things do sometimes happen.

As a result, most anything you buy in SL is either copy (good if you somehow screw up a copy) or transfer (good for selling or giving away stuff you no longer use, or giving as presents), but not both.
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Michael Seraph
Second Life Resident
Join date: 9 Nov 2004
Posts: 849
11-24-2005 01:02
From: Jared Somme
I just learned about this game and found it quite interesting and even thought of creating my own product however I don't see what's stopping people from pirating any of the products out there.

For example if a clothing store came out with a hip new shirt that everyone wanted. What's stopping one person from buying it and then distributing it for free or at a cheaper cost to other players?

Hopefully there are some type of measures in place to keep pirating from happening otherwise it appears that any and all product owners would simply just be getting ripped off left and right.

By the way I posted this is this thread because if piracy was rampant it'd have to be having a negative effect on the economy just like it does in real life.



When you make an item you can set various permissions for it. You can make items non-transferable, so no one can resell or give them away. You can make them non-copyable. You can make them non-modifiable. All three of these options can be turned on, or off or a mixture. You can allow some one, for example, to copy your object many times, but not to modify it or transfer it.
Adam Zaius
Deus
Join date: 9 Jan 2004
Posts: 1,483
11-24-2005 01:42
I'll add to the above posts; for consumer rights, or something like that, you must have either copy or transfer ticked. One or the other, or both. It's impossible to give a no-copy/no-transfer object to someone without relying on things like scripted trickery.
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Jared Somme
Registered User
Join date: 23 Nov 2005
Posts: 3
11-24-2005 22:31
Thanks for the responses. This is definitely encouraging that they have taken these measures.
Frank Lardner
Cultural Explorer
Join date: 30 Sep 2005
Posts: 409
How to do this with a writing?
11-25-2005 05:00
If a player created a written document (not an object), and wanted to share it, but not allow copying or modification, how is that done?

Frank
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Seifert Surface
Mathematician
Join date: 14 Jun 2005
Posts: 912
11-25-2005 05:16
From: Frank Lardner
If a player created a written document (not an object), and wanted to share it, but not allow copying or modification, how is that done?

Frank


I think you can set a notecard to be no copy no mod... but I would assume that it would still be possible to copy and paste to an external program? Not sure.
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Frank Lardner
Cultural Explorer
Join date: 30 Sep 2005
Posts: 409
Notecard as a unique object.
11-25-2005 05:22
The contents of the notecard could be cut-n-pasted or even manually transcribed, true.

I'm mostly interested in the notecard as an object of exchange in world. For example, an "admit one" ticket, or a coat check ticket, or a promissory note or contract memorandum that would have to be presented for verification and then either returned or destroyed as appropriate.

Copying it to an out-world file would enable one to create a duplicate copy, but would the dupe not show a creator different from that shown on the original?

So, it might include a warning: "Accept no substitutes ... beware of forgeries ... check the creator of this document against the signature at the bottom! Make sure they match before accepting!"

Frank
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Kris Ritter
paradoxical embolism
Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
11-25-2005 05:25
From: Frank Lardner
The contents of the notecard could be cut-n-pasted or even manually transcribed, true.

I'm mostly interested in the notecard as an object of exchange in world. For example, an "admit one" ticket, or a coat check ticket, or a promissory note or contract memorandum that would have to be presented for verification and then either returned or destroyed as appropriate.

Copying it to an out-world file would enable one to create a duplicate copy, but would the dupe not show a creator different from that shown on the original?

So, it might include a warning: "Accept no substitutes ... beware of forgeries ... check the creator of this document against the signature at the bottom! Make sure they match before accepting!"

Frank


I think you're more likely to get something like this as a scripted object in itself with some kind of verification built in. Certainly I wouldn't give a promisory note, ticket or voucher in the form of a notecard.
Frank Lardner
Cultural Explorer
Join date: 30 Sep 2005
Posts: 409
Creating Scripted Objects Containing Writing
11-25-2005 06:32
Where can one find how to create such scripted objects possibly suitable for use as tickets, receipts or promissory notes? Or are "blank" objects like that available now somewhere in SL, that one could acquire and add writing to, then "seal"?

Is that where Nota Bena comes in?

Frank
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Noel Marlowe
Victim of Occam's Razor
Join date: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 275
11-25-2005 06:46
From: Jared Somme
I just learned about this game and found it quite interesting and even thought of creating my own product however I don't see what's stopping people from pirating any of the products out there...


The real reason? Do you know how hard it is to make a decent pirate ship with only 31 prims? ;)
Eggy Lippmann
Wiktator
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 7,939
11-25-2005 06:54
I won't go into details so as not to encourage copyright infringement, but if you have something that you truly do not wish copied, dont put it in SL. The permissions system assumes that people will work within the system. If you have something, like a "spicy" picture of yourself or your girlfriend or something, and you dont want it leaked to the public at large, you should know that there's many different ways of stealing that data, it has been done many times before, and its very easy to do.
Rule of thumb, if you can see something, you can copy it.
Kris Ritter
paradoxical embolism
Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
11-25-2005 06:56
From: Eggy Lippmann
I won't go into details so as not to encourage copyright infringement, but if you have something that you truly do not wish copied, dont put it in SL. The permissions system assumes that people will work within the system. If you have something, like a "spicy" picture of yourself or your girlfriend or something, and you dont want it leaked to the public at large, you should know that there's many different ways of stealing that data, it has been done many times before, and its very easy to do.
Rule of thumb, if you can see something, you can copy it.


I was gonna say something like that, but figured people would just say it was me being a negative grumpy bitch as usual. So I'll let you take the rap for being a negative grumpy bastard this time ;)
Frank Lardner
Cultural Explorer
Join date: 30 Sep 2005
Posts: 409
Following up on "tickets"
11-25-2005 08:18
Eggy, I understand your caution for content one *really* wants to protect. Let's assume that risk for sake of argument.

What I'm trying to explore is a different realm ... the potential for in-world negotiable instruments.

For example, let us say I want to open a new hot club in game, and allow admission free to 100 people to whom I give an "admit the bearer on 1/1/06" ticket that is impracticable to copy. I want to make 100 such tickets that I can transfer in world. I want everyone else to pay 100 Lindens to get in on opening night. I'm willing to accept the possibility that someone may hack it.

The promissory note would be comparable: "I promise to pay 500 Lindens to the order of XYZ on demand. Signed, ABC"

Is there an existing tool or protocol to create that ticket or that note, or does it need to be done as a "one off" by someone who knows scripting well?

Frank
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Stephane Zugzwang
Brat
Join date: 26 Jun 2004
Posts: 192
11-25-2005 08:50
Franck,

Every avatar in SL has a "key" thta youy can obtain via script easily.

So, you could just keep track of the keys of the people you want to admit, or have them present a notecard with content initially encrypted with both their "key" and some other that only you know. Much more sophisticated protocols are actually used in world for some of the poker and game tables.
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