Alt+Enter Defaults to Channel 1

Ok, here's something that'd be useful... You know how Ctrl+Enter shouts? Well what if Alt+Enter defaulted to saying something on Channel 1? Sure, no one could hear it, but then you could have commands sent to objects that are listening without it coming across in the chat window. (Channel 0 IS chat, right?)

Problem is, you would still do the typing animation, because the system wouldn't know until you hit Enter or Alt-Enter whether the text was intended for channel 0 or channel 1.

My suggestion: a leading backslash suppresses the typing animation just like a forward slash does, and sends the text to channel 1. (And to extend it a bit, starting a line with \2 sends it to channel 2, \3 to channel 3, and so on.)

A non-visible chat channel would be handy, but alt-Enter is the fullscreen toggle. We'd probably not want it to be both.

Just curious...

Why backslash?

Nearly every other game in existance that takes typed commands uses a forward slash.

I don't get why the standard "issue a command" marker should be reserved for the function of "I don't want to dispaly the typing animation as I type this", but meanwhile we wind up with some other awkward non-standard marker for something that will be used much more fequently: silently issuing script commands.

Admittedly, I'll take whatever I can get just so I don't have to spam everyone, but I'm wondering why every time this comes up someone shoots the idea down or suggests doing it with something other than slash.

Am I the only one that thinks a forward slash should be the standard marker to issue a command, while the ability to type something without doing the typing animation should have lower priority?

Thanks for reading...

I'm with you kex

I was under the impression that any slash commands would show up in chat...

If that's not the case, then by all means, make / the default leading character to channel 1. (It really supresses typing?)

Because we're already using slash for another purpose, and I was always taught to avoid breaking backwards compatibility. If you're willing to deal with hundreds users all complaining about how their gesture commands no longer work the way they used to, you're a braver man than I...

Isnt the more obvious problem with the original suggestion that ALT-Enter is already in use? It switches between Windowed & full screen mode. I think I will stick to my favorite Alt-key combo. Any SL Problem's Press ALT-F4.. Not THAT is the best troubleshooter in the game.

I don't know anyone who uses "/" on a regularly basis in SL (for the purpose of not doing the typing animation). So I doubt there would be many who would complain about its functionality being changed.

I always thought it would be better to have an option in the Preferences for "Don't Play Animation When Typing", that way anyone who doesn't want to do it doesn't have to keep typing / before things, which it really does look silly if you have a / before every sentance you type.

You could still use it for gestures also, so it wouldn't break anything really. You could set it up so when you do "/booga" you do your booga gesture with its booga text and sound, and your script picks up your /booga on channel whatever and then does some booga particle effects.

There would need to be a decision as to wether by default when you do / commands your typing gesture plays or not. I would say yes it would. Except if the person has "Don't Play Gesture When Typing" checked, then of course you wouldn't do the typing gesture at all.

If you still want there to be a key that makes you not do the gesture maybe have in the Preferences an input box to declair your own, that way if you want to still use / for not doing the gesture you can, and if you want to switch / to ' you can do that also.

I think thats three feature suggestions that would make everyone happy.

I support this product and/or service.

Might I suggest "!a command to my script" as few real chat messages begin with "!" and I don't believe that it has any other SL assignment. Just as with "/" as a starting character, "!" could also suppress typing animation.

(In case this is a problem with non-US keyboards or displays, the character I am proposing is Unicode 0021 "bang" or ISO 8859-1/HTML &#33)

I too am confused by the resentment at using / like every other game does. The only possible feature that could be lost would be if you wanted to type something start with /, and is that really common enough to warrant using a non-conventional key like ! or [ or anything else? Like Oz said, gestures could still be parsed, so typing "/clap" would be the same no matter what. It would even open up the door for built in commands such as /im, /reply, /who, etc.

And if people really want to type "/text here with no typing anim" then have // equal the current usage.

Actually Malachi, I believe the first 128 chars in the ASCII table are pretty much universal.

I am confused by developers who don't seem to grasp the meaning and importance of the term "backward compatibility". Did the whole sitting-animation flamefest teach you nothing about how finicky people are about even minor changes?


Is compatibility with EQ really so important tht it's worth sacrificing backward compatibility and p---ing off the user community that's used to the current way of doing things?


Current system, user types: Slash Cee Ell Ay Pee Enter (clapping animation and sound begins)

Your proposal, user types: Slash (typing animation and sound begins) Cee Ell Ay Pee Enter (typing animation and sound ends) (clapping animation and sound begins)

No, the two are not equivalent.


And what's wrong with doing it the other way around? Using double-slash (or bang, or backslash) for the new function, while leaving the old function as it is? If it's such an insignificant change that you're willing to impose it on the rest of us, why are you unwilling to impose it on yourself?

I'm a scripter, I understand the need for some way of sending "inaudible" commands to scripted objects. But I'm also a dancer, and if you screw around with the gestures-and-animations system, you're screwing around with my in-game livelihood. If you want to redefine the exclamation point or the backslash or the double-slash to perform some new function, that's cool. But if you make me re-enter all my custom gesture commands, and re-learn all the manual commands I've worked at memorizing, I *will* be p---ed about it, and I assure you I won't be the only one.

The only change suggested would be that the text output, if any, gets sent to channel 1.

That's it. Nothing more. No typing, no sound, same as it is now just a different channel.

In other words typing "/clap" would produce zero chat output, zero typing animation, zero typing sound, and make you clap. Just like it does now.

But typing "/anim backflip" would produce "/anim backflip" on channel 1. In addition to zero chat output, zero typing animation, zero typing sound. Less spam than you see now.

The only place my proposed systems would differ is if you wanted someone to see the words "/text goes here" you'd type "//text goes here".

As for "EQ Compatible" it's more like (from only my personal experience) EQ, AC, AC2, DAoC, FFXI, most MU* clients (which defiantely predate the rest), IRC clients, and many more. The convention is overwhelmingly in favor or / for private command input in textual chat systems.

<edit>
Thought of the case where you have a /gesture that produces chat output. Simply have the gesture processing take precedence over "channel 1". Thus if I set up "/clap" to put "*clap*" into chat, then it would put it on 0.

Liberty did you totaly ignore my post? I pretty much resolved any backwards compatability issues I think.

And I think Cienna's solution also solves that.

Using / as LL did was a very very odd thing to do, as most any software I have ever used, uses / for commands, its just one of those universal things it seems. SL *kinda* uses / for commands when used with gestures, but the whole no typing thing adds an odd mix into the equation. Basicly making it also output the text entered to a silent channel would just extend the current functionality and if done right could still leave it backwards compatable.

Its all a matter of habbit, while using // for commands wouldn't be the worst thing to have to do most of us and most people in the world are used to using / for commands. Even you use it for your dance commands.

I think my and/or cienna's suggestion would solve any habbitual inconviences for everyone.

Okay, re-reading it all, I can see you both arrived at solutions that are mostly backward-compatible. Though I can think of plenty of edge cases in both that would break current usage. (You do know that commands can be put in the middle or the end of a chat line, right? Or that sounds and animations can be triggered by words that aren't flagged with a slash ... like using 'yes' to trigger the Yes animation, even if it's in the middle of a sentence?)

And I'm still not convinced that consistency with other programs is really more important than consistency with earlier versions of this program. It rubs me the wrong way that a new feature should displace an existing command rather than getting a new command of its own.

I was building a head of steam hearing people say "nobody uses that" about functions that I use all the time, and the cavalier attitude taken early on in this thread about how much change other users would be willing to tolerate.

I apologize for blowing my stack. But I still think that re-purposing the '/' key is a mistake. This thread is made up almost exclusively of scripters, who are not representative of the general user population. Don't assume your own usage patterns are typical, or that everyone else would tolerate changes that you find insignificant.

I apologize if that upset you, but I was just stating what I've seen, and I rarely see anyone who uses / for the sole purpose of not doing the typing gesture. I myself use it for gestures and know alot of others who do also, but not for the fact that it gets rid of the typing animation.

I don't want to break the functionality it has now either, as I enjoy what it does too. But what I meant was that I rarely see anyone who uses it to not do the typing animation, if you do however then obviously its still needed.

The only reason I don't use it to get rid of the typing animation is because it keeps the / infront of the text, and I've become used to the typing animation.

I don't think current functionality should be broken by new things either, I think there are ways of going about it that would keep it working how it does while also making it do other stuff too.

Too often LL has put in new features and gotten rid of other ones that were still usefull. Or changed how something worked without an option to change it, like flying/jumping.

I think this is something that can be done without getting rid of anything we have now.

Processing of /commands in the middle or end of the text wouldn't be affected. Basically the only time special processing would even enter into it is when the line begins with a /. So "I dunno /shrug" would operate the same as before.

A short flowchart if I may:
1. If the line does not begin with / process as current
2. If the line begins with // replaces with single / and emit to chat as current / does
3. If the line matches a system command (/im, /reply, I'm being hopeful :) then process it as such.
4. If the line matches a gesture process as normal (beginning of line gestures, non-start ones would process under step 1)
5. Otherwise, emit to channel 1

I think the nature of the current behavior also serves to support usage of it as the command character as much as it serves to detract from the thought. The "supress anim & sound" nature of it and being used for gestures puts people in a mindset for it being 'special', I would wager. There are also many scripts that already use it as a command character. Third, it has a large body of convention in similar programs, as mentioned. Finally it has better ergonomics than something like ! since it is unshifted and in a fairly easy to hit spot.

The option to be able to have your own channel-1 output echoed to you would be nice, much like you can show muted text currently. This wouldn't show to anyone else, but only to the emitting avatar.

I have to apologize as well, I think I came off a bit too accusatory, when really I'm just wanting people to shoot holes in my theory to make it better. ;) I know people do use this function I'm just trying to gauge how and why to better tailor my suggestions to extending the functionality without having "I don't sit like that" type shirts made. The goals of anim/sound supression and chat output supression are fairly similar in nature, so I would be reluctant to push for something entirely new to learn.