What should we do about lag?

I posted about this in another thread, but it was way off topic there and as always I apologize for the xposting, but I feel that this is an issue that needs discussing.

The problem is excessive lag. I think we can all agree that it stinks, and it's becoming worse and worse. I am partly to blame for my noobish color script that i wrote when i had no idea about the problems of using a timer function or randoms, and i encourage everyone to pick up and use the new 'fight the lag' version from me or Tcoz. There is another thread suggesting other things that we can all do to reduce the strain on a server. Now, if we all do our part I am sure we will help the situation somewhat, but the fact of the matter is that there is nothing in place to discourage this type of careless unchecked lag-proliferation from taking place again.

Like the Lindens have said, this is our world. Unfortunately, this world is limited. So, what we need is a way to discourage wasting of resources, creating excessive lag. one way is simply to increase awareness. I feel this is not enough, because I know we would all love to create the largest most complicated objects and scripts possible and this simply cannot be. In my opinion, an improved economic model is a great solution.

The current economic system(or lack thereof) does not give much value to the most limited and valuable resource in SL, the resource which is SL itself, namely, server resources.

I think we should be charged taxes for how much server resources we use. this would equate Linden bucks with server resources. This would mean that a Linden buck is worth a certain amount of processing power, memory, bandwidth, or something like that. The total amount of money, or SLGDP if you will , would be equivalent to the amount of server resources that could possibly be used. In the other post, Zanlew mentioned that this will limit creativity. This is true. But it can be adjusted, through taxation and giveaways to the point where it limits creativity to where it should be limited, the capacity of the servers. And giveaways should be more in line with taxes and could be used to adjust for inflation(lag).

I know this would be a rather large change. I think it would work. I'm not saying this is the only way, but something must be done. What do you all think?

I think this is a fabulous idea. Just as there's lag pollution instead of air pollution in SL, server capacity is certainly the fundamental natural resource. Having server usage cost money fits the metaphor perfectly, and would fix the problem. Do it.

Do a search on economics.

SL$ is supposed to be a representation of server resources. And it is a representation of server resources. The money in the world is fixed. And does not go up until resources are added. The things that cost money are those that take resources ($ to upload stuff, $ to rez stuff into world, $ in taxes to keep stuff in world).

What you are describing as what you want is what is in place.

The problem right now isn't the economy. The problem is overpopulation. The world was crowded before it went open beta. They added 5 or 6 more servers and didn't let anyone except a select few special projects move in. Then they opened to open beta with no new land.

My guess is that it is part of a stress test. And stress tests are good (tm).

Here is a breakdown of how the economy works:

Things that take up resources cost $$. Lights cost extra tax $. Putting objects into world costs $$. Keeping objects in world costs money. Cleaning up the world gives you money back.

All money collected in the form of taxes etc. goes into this pool. Which is divided up: some goes to lindens to fund events and projects, some goes to paying voting booths, some goes to stipends and some goes to ratings bonuses. In order this allows them to reward approved events and projects that keep the world alive, cool buildings (and events), people who pay (once its live) and people who are other residents think are cool.

So in theory the money, or ability to use server resources, gets shuffled around to the people who benefit the world the most (through cool things, events, or just being cool) with accomidations that everyone who plays is entitled to some amount of server resources.

I've posted better explanations.

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I'm not saying its perfect
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Changes I would make:
- Charge more taxes for enabling physics.
- Charge $$ to use certain script calls. Although I think many that cause lag should be charged less than $1, because one call every 15 minutes or so isn't going to hurt the server, even though at $1 (the smallest increment of money now available) it would still bankrupt them in a couple days if not sooner. However, run the same thing every 10th of a second as is possible now, and lag city.

Physics and certain script calls take up a lot of resources but aren't charged for it.

Charging for script calls becomes an issue if controls for scripts are put in, because the cost of running the script needs to be clearly available.

In addition, I'd personally like to see a cap on the amount of objects/polygons/textures/sounds can be build/used within a 4x4m plot of land. Nothing strict enough that would severely limit our creativity, but something that would further encourage people (out of lack of choice) to look for better solutions for their ideas.

Also, there's been a bit of talk about politics and each server having a leader/representative for the population of that server, with the Lindens having final say. Perhaps if the game heads in that direction, one of the roles of this server leader could be to decide (to some extent) where the resources are used.

For instance, in Jessie, us WW2OLers have a LOT of useless stuff. I'm guilty myself, with that large graffiti-covered water tower sitting atop my bunker (hehe). But everywhere you look, we have huge billboards promoting our little group (most of it is on the level of inside jokes carried over from WW2OL forums). I'd personally hate to see that stuff go, but it's plastered everywhere, cluttering things up and probably using resources that could be used elsewhere.

Ama, I didn't realize that they already balance out the amount of money in game. Thats good. My other point was that other things especially scripts that also use resources are not being taxed to curb them a bit. I was purpusely trying to be vague and not explain exactly how I think it should work, cuz I wasn't sure yet. Your two suggestions though, are exactly the type of thing i'm looking for. In fact I think that may be the perfect way to do it.

Thanks for the info, guys. That plan sounds great.

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My only concern here is the mention of limits. Oh no please don't limit. I was in another online game rpg. They started putting in limits and in the end I believe it killed the game. therefor I am against any limitations.

Just my 2 cents

Cat

My problem with taxing scripts per call is that it seriously curtails creativity.

No one will use scripts when they don't have to, since it's so damn expensive.

If we have to tax scripts, I'd rather do it this way: derive a "script cost" similar to an "object cost" and add that to the initial fee and weekly fee.

I.e. a simple script costs $10 to add to an object and $1 per week to maintain in the world (non-running scripts in your inventory are not taxed). A complex script might cost $50 to apply and $35 per week to maintain.

Objects use resources all the time too, but Linden made an extremely smart decision in not charging us huge amounts of cash and not charging us hourly or daily. Let's use the same precedent for scripts.

I moved out of an area recently because it became techno hell and lag was so bad you could never move. the new area i moved to in tacoma was great for a week then everyone started placing the flashing lights. and shooting guns and lag when to hell again. what we need is a couple sims to stil all the gunners and techno spaz on hehe. if they like lag make certain areas where entires houses of pictures and lag intensive scripts can be used and make some areas for those who like to build and be social. You can hardly build nice items when its that laggy ive had to go to some of the reserved areas to build and sucks cause i like to hang around my house and socialize with the friends ive made.

i'd much rather have a per-call tax than a $50 application and $35/wk maintenance fee

i think something more along the lines of $5/script application and $1/week tax would be better... we want newbies who are strapped for cash to still be able to play around, but at the same time, we want to prevent scripters from running rampant. i should know, because i'm a scripter, and i have to be careful to keep myself in check



THAT'S THE POINT. if you don't have to use a script, you shouldn't, because it costs server resources, whether you have to pay for it in L$ or not. also, if we could find an accurate way to tax the complexity of a script, it would encourage efficient scripting

Well, I don't have to build anything in the game; but I do because I want to. By the same reasoning, should everything cost more than anyone can afford, just because only the most essential things (i.e. nothing) should exist?

well, you made me think about it, and i can't really think of any instances in which you could replace a scripted object with an unscripted object and get the same functionality. that's what i meant by "if you don't have to". however (for example), some people have scripts that call llFrand() to do various things, and even worse, they call it inside a timer event. llFrand() could, in most cases, be replaced by something like llCloud() that can return a pseudo-random number. while it may not be as effective as llFrand(), for something like dictating when an object should flash to a different color and what color it should be, various combinations of llCloud() and llWind() could achieve the same results and use a lot less processing power.

why llFrand() uses a lot of processing power (relative to other script calls), i don't know, but i've been told it does, so that's why i'm using it as an example. another example might be using a for loop to move a door 0.2m at a time, 10 times, to open it 2m. while this produces a "smoother" animation, it would be quicker, and less processor-intensive, to just make it "snap" to the open position with a single llSetPos()...

people who still want to use the for loop animation should have to pay for it. i know my bunker door snaps open

The fact that you want to make something is what will give money value in the game. If you have to pay to make or do something, then money all of a sudden has real value.

The cost of things should be proportional to how much they affect the server. This is the same as saying it should cost you more if because of what you're doing less people on the server can do stuff. All it does is make you more aware of how you're affecting everyone else. Building stuff and running simpler, non-physical, scripts don't do much to the server(generally) and shouldn't cost much at all. But if you're going too far and ruining the server, then it should cost you more.