Second Life Forums Archive - Microsoft to Take on the Metaverse: "Embrace and Extend!"

Kage Seraph

I Dig Giant Mecha

Join date: 3 Nov 2004

Posts: 513

05-13-2005 13:09

Overheard at Wired.Com:

From: someone

But Allard [lead dev for the XBox] insists that his plan is different, because a new era of high-definition gaming is upon us. To him, hi-def is about more than screen resolution. Xbox 360 will introduce gamers to a world where they can create and maintain a persistent, evolving online persona regardless of which game they're playing. A user profile, maintained at a Microsoft data center, will follow you around and track your progress from game to game. That way, if you're a Halo 3 ace, you won't get thrown into a multiplayer Splinter Cell session with a bunch of newbies. The Xbox Live network will also tie into real-world payment systems - à la PayPal - so players can buy, make, and sell virtual weapons, car parts, and clothes via micropayments.

If it all sounds like the virtual-meets-real Metaverse that Neal Stephenson described in his 1992 sci-fi novel Snow Crash, it should. Allard is a Stephenson buff, and he requires his crew to read Snow Crash. With Xbox 360, Allard is bringing the Metaverse to the masses.

If you feel led by the Spirit to respond, *please* go RTFA (read the article) before doing so. Get it here: http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/13.06/xbox.html

Let's please refrain from knee-jerk "M$OFT is teh suxxor" reactions. I'm not interested in your reactions, I want your thoughtful responses . =D Wow, I sound really condescending. I'm not!! I just want to forestall flaming and trolling. Impossible? Perhaps, but I am an incurable optimist. =D

Seems to me like Linden Lab is (a) about to get one BIG competitor in the metaverse development arena and / or (b) gonna really benefit from the huge exposure of the metaverse concept to the ignorant, unwashed game console masses.

Discuss!

With love,
Kage

Jon Marlin

Builder, Coder, RL & SL

Join date: 10 Mar 2005

Posts: 297

05-13-2005 13:23

From: Kage Seraph

Seems to me like Linden Lab is (a) about to get one BIG competitor in the metaverse development arena and / or (b) gonna really benefit from the huge exposure of the metaverse concept to the ignorant, unwashed game console masses.

No, I think they're setting their sights a lot lower. From what I can see, they're talking about an online profile keeper, and maybe some common digital marketplace areas.

I don't see anywhere in the article them talking about doing what SL does, and the only reason this is coming up is because the reporter thought the tie-in with Snowcrash would be cool.

- Jon

Kage Seraph

I Dig Giant Mecha

Join date: 3 Nov 2004

Posts: 513

05-13-2005 13:30

Granted, they'd HAVE to shoot for lower than SL's degree of control-- can you imagine trying to primcraft with a console controller? Ugh. I did note, however, this bit:

"The Xbox Live network will also tie into real-world payment systems - à la PayPal - so players can buy, make, and sell virtual weapons, car parts, and clothes via micropayments."

Talen Morgan

Amused

Join date: 2 Apr 2004

Posts: 3,097

05-13-2005 14:11

There goes the metaverse.....I guess he'll call it the microverse now

_____________________

Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...set a man on fire and he'll be warm the rest of his life

Chosen Few

Alpha Channel Slave

Join date: 16 Jan 2004

Posts: 7,496

05-13-2005 16:08

From: Jon Marlin

No, I think they're setting their sights a lot lower. From what I can see, they're talking about an online profile keeper, and maybe some common digital marketplace areas.

I don't see anywhere in the article them talking about doing what SL does, and the only reason this is coming up is because the reporter thought the tie-in with Snowcrash would be cool.

- Jon

Agreed. It seems that MS doesn't have anything remotely resembling SL in mind here. They're simply talking about a way for people to maintain their identities from game to game, which is actually a pretty interesting idea.

As for the line about allowing players to make stuff, I'm fairly certain such items would be game-specific, similar to the way in which players can already craft items inside MMO games like World of Warcraft. It's highly doubtful they're talking about persistent items that can exist in multiple games, let alone a persistent universe that can host multiple games. I can't see someone making a souped up race car for Grand Theft Auto and then expecting to be able to port it into Splinter Cell so Sam can drive it around town. That just doesn't make sense.

I'm much more concerned about the real-world implications of Microsoft's plans than anything they're doing in VR. If you read the artical, they're talking about intigrating the PC and/or the X-box to become THE device to tackle all your entertainment and telecommunications needs. While it would be great to have such multiple capabilities in one neat little box, it also conjures up some scary thoughts regarding too much consolidation of power. Not only would you be screwed if your machine were to break after you've allowed it to be responsible for everything, but the idea of having one company providing every service is dangerous. If you think spyware in your PC is bad now, imagine what could happen after you've allowed to control and monitor all your telephone calls, TV viewings, etc.

Don't get me wrong. I do think this new technology is cool. I just worry that a company with as poor a security track record as Microsoft has is the one currently persuing it.

Anyway, I think I'm drifting off topic here. To get back to the MS metaverse thing, I don't think LL has anything to worry about. X-box 360 doesn't seem like it will resemble what SL is about in the slightest.

_____________________

.

Land now available for rent in Indigo. Low rates. Quiet, low-lag mainland sim with good neighbors. IM me in-world if you're interested.

Yoshi Platini

Registered User

Join date: 23 Jul 2004

Posts: 111

05-13-2005 16:35

Oh, yay!

Maybe they'll have a little 3-D dancing paper clip with anisotropic lighting and local shadows, that interrupts you with a ton of chatty, worthless advice every time you try to do something basic, and then spends 45 seconds driving whatever their version of a sim is into lagitosis with a cutesy exit animation when you finally locate and click the "get the HELL out of my way!" button.

I can hardly wait. Because I want Redmond to have the 3 or 4 bytes of personal usage profiling that Microsoft Word and IE forgot to transmit to them every time I opened either app for the past five years.

Where do I sign up?

-- yoshi

Chip Midnight

ate my baby!

Join date: 1 May 2003

Posts: 10,231

05-13-2005 16:41

Some of the features of the xbox 360 sound very cool... especially that you can voice chat with people without having to be playing the same game they are, or even be playing a game at all. Also the ability to act as a hub for music, tv, and images on a media center PC is cool too. And it's HD. Some people will find a reason to hate MS no matter what they do, but this looks like an impressive product. I'll definitely be replacing my first generation xbox.

As for the thread topic, I agree with what others have said... having a persistant profile is hardly the metaverse

_____________________

My other hobby:
www.live365.com/stations/chip_midnight

Icon Serpentine

punk in drublic

Join date: 13 Nov 2003

Posts: 858

05-13-2005 16:51

I already do all this with my PC... and if I had a living room, I could already do it all with my PC. Wirelessly. And better.

I dunno... seems like another product just like any other. It will be gimmicked and marketed till you have teenagers frothing at the mouth.

It'll be yet another cheap consumer product, another reason to stay inside, and eventually another hunk of poisonous materials to add to the trash heap.

It's not going to be some mystical "metaverse." It prolly won't even be around in 2 - 3 years.

_____________________

If you are awesome!

Microsoft to Take on the Metaverse: "Embrace and Extend!"
Kage Seraph I Dig Giant Mecha Join date: 3 Nov 2004 Posts: 513	05-13-2005 13:09 Overheard at Wired.Com: From: someone But Allard [lead dev for the XBox] insists that his plan is different, because a new era of high-definition gaming is upon us. To him, hi-def is about more than screen resolution. Xbox 360 will introduce gamers to a world where they can create and maintain a persistent, evolving online persona regardless of which game they're playing. A user profile, maintained at a Microsoft data center, will follow you around and track your progress from game to game. That way, if you're a Halo 3 ace, you won't get thrown into a multiplayer Splinter Cell session with a bunch of newbies. The Xbox Live network will also tie into real-world payment systems - à la PayPal - so players can buy, make, and sell virtual weapons, car parts, and clothes via micropayments. If it all sounds like the virtual-meets-real Metaverse that Neal Stephenson described in his 1992 sci-fi novel Snow Crash, it should. Allard is a Stephenson buff, and he requires his crew to read Snow Crash. With Xbox 360, Allard is bringing the Metaverse to the masses. If you feel led by the Spirit to respond, please go RTFA (read the article) before doing so. Get it here: http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/13.06/xbox.html Let's please refrain from knee-jerk "M$OFT is teh suxxor" reactions. I'm not interested in your reactions, I want your thoughtful responses . =D Wow, I sound really condescending. I'm not!! I just want to forestall flaming and trolling. Impossible? Perhaps, but I am an incurable optimist. =D Seems to me like Linden Lab is (a) about to get one BIG competitor in the metaverse development arena and / or (b) gonna really benefit from the huge exposure of the metaverse concept to the ignorant, unwashed game console masses. Discuss! With love, Kage
Jon Marlin Builder, Coder, RL & SL Join date: 10 Mar 2005 Posts: 297	05-13-2005 13:23 From: Kage Seraph Seems to me like Linden Lab is (a) about to get one BIG competitor in the metaverse development arena and / or (b) gonna really benefit from the huge exposure of the metaverse concept to the ignorant, unwashed game console masses. No, I think they're setting their sights a lot lower. From what I can see, they're talking about an online profile keeper, and maybe some common digital marketplace areas. I don't see anywhere in the article them talking about doing what SL does, and the only reason this is coming up is because the reporter thought the tie-in with Snowcrash would be cool. - Jon
Kage Seraph I Dig Giant Mecha Join date: 3 Nov 2004 Posts: 513	05-13-2005 13:30 Granted, they'd HAVE to shoot for lower than SL's degree of control-- can you imagine trying to primcraft with a console controller? Ugh. I did note, however, this bit: "The Xbox Live network will also tie into real-world payment systems - à la PayPal - so players can buy, make, and sell virtual weapons, car parts, and clothes via micropayments."
Talen Morgan Amused Join date: 2 Apr 2004 Posts: 3,097	05-13-2005 14:11 There goes the metaverse.....I guess he'll call it the microverse now _____________________ Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...set a man on fire and he'll be warm the rest of his life
Chosen Few Alpha Channel Slave Join date: 16 Jan 2004 Posts: 7,496	05-13-2005 16:08 From: Jon Marlin No, I think they're setting their sights a lot lower. From what I can see, they're talking about an online profile keeper, and maybe some common digital marketplace areas. I don't see anywhere in the article them talking about doing what SL does, and the only reason this is coming up is because the reporter thought the tie-in with Snowcrash would be cool. - Jon Agreed. It seems that MS doesn't have anything remotely resembling SL in mind here. They're simply talking about a way for people to maintain their identities from game to game, which is actually a pretty interesting idea. As for the line about allowing players to make stuff, I'm fairly certain such items would be game-specific, similar to the way in which players can already craft items inside MMO games like World of Warcraft. It's highly doubtful they're talking about persistent items that can exist in multiple games, let alone a persistent universe that can host multiple games. I can't see someone making a souped up race car for Grand Theft Auto and then expecting to be able to port it into Splinter Cell so Sam can drive it around town. That just doesn't make sense. I'm much more concerned about the real-world implications of Microsoft's plans than anything they're doing in VR. If you read the artical, they're talking about intigrating the PC and/or the X-box to become THE device to tackle all your entertainment and telecommunications needs. While it would be great to have such multiple capabilities in one neat little box, it also conjures up some scary thoughts regarding too much consolidation of power. Not only would you be screwed if your machine were to break after you've allowed it to be responsible for everything, but the idea of having one company providing every service is dangerous. If you think spyware in your PC is bad now, imagine what could happen after you've allowed to control and monitor all your telephone calls, TV viewings, etc. Don't get me wrong. I do think this new technology is cool. I just worry that a company with as poor a security track record as Microsoft has is the one currently persuing it. Anyway, I think I'm drifting off topic here. To get back to the MS metaverse thing, I don't think LL has anything to worry about. X-box 360 doesn't seem like it will resemble what SL is about in the slightest. _____________________ . Land now available for rent in Indigo. Low rates. Quiet, low-lag mainland sim with good neighbors. IM me in-world if you're interested.
Yoshi Platini Registered User Join date: 23 Jul 2004 Posts: 111	05-13-2005 16:35 Oh, yay! Maybe they'll have a little 3-D dancing paper clip with anisotropic lighting and local shadows, that interrupts you with a ton of chatty, worthless advice every time you try to do something basic, and then spends 45 seconds driving whatever their version of a sim is into lagitosis with a cutesy exit animation when you finally locate and click the "get the HELL out of my way!" button. I can hardly wait. Because I want Redmond to have the 3 or 4 bytes of personal usage profiling that Microsoft Word and IE forgot to transmit to them every time I opened either app for the past five years. Where do I sign up? -- yoshi
Chip Midnight ate my baby! Join date: 1 May 2003 Posts: 10,231	05-13-2005 16:41 Some of the features of the xbox 360 sound very cool... especially that you can voice chat with people without having to be playing the same game they are, or even be playing a game at all. Also the ability to act as a hub for music, tv, and images on a media center PC is cool too. And it's HD. Some people will find a reason to hate MS no matter what they do, but this looks like an impressive product. I'll definitely be replacing my first generation xbox. As for the thread topic, I agree with what others have said... having a persistant profile is hardly the metaverse _____________________ My other hobby: www.live365.com/stations/chip_midnight
Icon Serpentine punk in drublic Join date: 13 Nov 2003 Posts: 858	05-13-2005 16:51 I already do all this with my PC... and if I had a living room, I could already do it all with my PC. Wirelessly. And better. I dunno... seems like another product just like any other. It will be gimmicked and marketed till you have teenagers frothing at the mouth. It'll be yet another cheap consumer product, another reason to stay inside, and eventually another hunk of poisonous materials to add to the trash heap. It's not going to be some mystical "metaverse." It prolly won't even be around in 2 - 3 years. _____________________ If you are awesome!

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Microsoft to Take on the Metaverse: "Embrace and Extend!"