How to seriously determine if you're a "stakeholder"

Consider this question:

If tomorow, you had to completely give up on SL...release all your land, cancel your accounts, break off all contact with your friends there, uninstall the client from the computer and never connect again, could you do it easily?







If the answer is any varient of "no", then you probably have some sort of stake in Second Life, emotiional, monitary or otherwise.

(I probably shouldn't expect this post to be taken seriously - "wizard's first rule" definately tends to prevail over the forums and the MJW decible in particular- but considering the long rants I *want* to write that I don't have the time or energy to write at the moment, this will have to do.)

good point - nearly everyone is a stakeholder in Second Life

Although it sounds like the people who have invested large sums of Real Money have monopolized the term for the current debate.

But I must say in SecondLife it does not matter who the stakeholders are - we all are (and should be) treated equally, as we all agree to the same EULA and services rendered by LL. This is a service-user relationship between Linden Labs and us, not company-investor.

Marcus

EDIT: I gave up on trying to read all up on the MJW crap. So pardon me if this has been stated. But I just wanted to emphasize that "stakeholder" in relation to SL is a meaningless term.

<<< is obviously a stakeholder.

People are still talking about this?

I thought the stakeholder thing was last week's joke.

I don't appreciate the trolling one bit. I'm sick of perfectly good threads being treaded on by trolls masquading as highly respected community members (sic).

Tell me, Jauani, are you still a MJW officer or do you agree with any of the written goals they've set out? If so, why would you reflect badly upon them by making posts like this?

(If you were never a MJW officer, then I stand corrected and got the wrong idea from reading meeting logs).

He is an officer, but it is only to reflect badly on the group and not to promote any of the group's goals. I'm hoping he'll quit.

coco

I could easily do without everything else except the part in bold. For that matter, I feel like that about most of life.

Well, obviously, a stakeholder is someone who is holding a stake. Like Buffy?

my post is the simplification of communicating the ridiculousness of the topic. sorry, but to my eyes it looked like your fluff piece on the well beaten dead horse was a joke/troll post, and i responded accordingly.

Well I am not a stake holder, but i want to be a steak holder. So lets do this. A building contest! $1000 linden for the best prim steak! All builds must be submitted by October 7 (I'll be very hungry by then). I invite Nolan, Taco and Enberan to assist me as judges, but we might need one more, a vegetarian, to complete out panel. In case anyone actually wants to make a prim steak, I will acquire some land so that we can put them on display. Extra points for presentation.

Will we get bonus points if we make a moving machine that slaughters a cow and extracts steaks?

cocca, why are you spreading lies about me? if you cannot understand my intentions and motives, don't pretend.

just to make it clear what is going on - once the MJW had established some semblance of credibility, the Prokocoa faction took the long weekend as an oppurtunity to coerce the founder of the group out of the MJW when she (anshe) proposed having open elections. the reason? alone, they would never be able to raise this kind of support or consituency. but now they live comfortably in the house that anshe built, using it as a platform to belligerently attack everything that moves with. this is precicely why prokofy opposes elections in the group. i think it is entirely unjust and deceptive, and potentially harmful, to let these two represent a constituency they admittedly did not even build.

normally i would turn a blind eye to this, but i was asked to be an officer and ended up in this mess and so i feel it is my responsiblity to shut you hacks up unless you hold an election as intended and win the popular support.

as for stakeholders and tourists - wtf! both are incredibly essential to SL. being a tourist is good! it's a position of luxury. and tourists provides LL and financial stakeholders with income. it is completely ridiculous to even consider one is more important that the other. both can have their own lobby groups. SL needs both.

Yes.

With who?

Elle, you've raise an intresting point, but i'm afraid that the whole "stakeholder" thing still seems abit suspicious to me:

There are many people out there who spend vast sums of money on MMORPGs such as City of Heroes, EverQuest, Lineage 2, Matrix Online, and so on.

These players have invested Large amount of time and money into these games.

Social networks has been created that which are depended heavily on the game being served.

If you were to leave any of these games, it would usually mean alot of involvement and headache. Wouldnt you say that every serious MMORPG player has a stake in the game they play?

However, these people do not expect any sort of a special treatment from the company. Why should we? Because SecondLife is "not a game"?

Indeed, SecondLife is not a game. But this doesnt really change the fact that, creators, users or not - we're all nothing but customers who purchase LindenLab's online service.

I approve of the idea of having a group who can band together to discuss issues in a unified fashion and raise topics for the company to look at. This may (and most probebly will) proove to be more efficent then the current forum mess and Voting site which we all know is pretty much a "Seemed like a good idea at the time" kind of a thing.

But calling ourselves "stakeholders" and using that as a reason for anything...

... i'm sorry, but i'm afraid that from my perspective, this is just plain silly.

with the only people that matter - Philip and Robin

Darn, that was going to be my Burning Life build if I'd got a space this year...

...maybe I'll do it anyway!

This is so completely wrong I have trouble accepting that you really do believe this is what occured simply because you were out of town that weekend.

To know what actually occured, see my thread, titled "My Statement on the MJW Thing,"in the General Forum. Or ask Anshe.

There is absolutely no truth whatsoever to the idea that anybody did anything to force anybody out over the weekend, unless it was Anshe, insofar as she no longer wanted to work with Prok.

Anshe, that weekend, was scheduling elections even BEFORE the agreed-upon officers meeting - which was scheduled with enough time to give all officers a reasonable chance to log on and find out about it - and the agreed-upon regular member meetings thereafter, which were ALSO scheduled with enough time for everyone to find out about them and participate.

I myself sent out the messages for these meetings out to the membership late Thursday night, I think it was, while in an IM with Anshe. She, Prok, and I, and I forget who all else, had agreed to do these meetings that night, and I was in IM with Anshe afterwards to make sure how the notices should be sent out, and making sure the wording was okay with her.

I was sending out those notices as a favor to her and to Prok, since someone had to, and both of them had already done quite a bit of work and were tired. Nonetheless, she hung in with me until they went out.

Before the Sunday meetings even had a chance to roll around, Anshe had sent out notecards apparently scheduling an election to be completed BY Sunday. Without any discussion with any other officer. As far as I was concerned, I had just talked with her at 1 am the night before, and we had sent out meeting notices, and nothing further would happen until the officer's meeting on Sunday, followed by member meetings starting on Monday.

Again, I suggest you refer to my detailed report of exactly what happened that weekend. In a nutshell, Anshe didn't want to work with Prok one minute more. Now that is neither here nor there to me, but as I said in my statement, no group can function in a fashion wherein you schedule meetings for Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday, then all of a sudden you are holding elections to be completed before Sunday even rolls around.

Anshe says these notecards were meant only for discussion by the officers about election timing. The problem was, the officers wouldn't even be ON until Sunday, if then. As it was, we were functioning without half the officers being present, AND it was a labor day weekend.

That you, Jauani, persist in dishonestly and unethically attempting to portray any of this in such a blatantly false light is astounding.

You are telling total, complete, bald-faced lies. Over and over. Why? For the fun of it? To make Anshe look bad? I'm not interested in making Anshe look bad. I want to work with Anshe in her new group. I'm even LESS interested in listening to you tell total lies about me.

The truth is, Anshe and Prok wanted to work together. Anshe could no longer do so. She took rash action. Prok objected. I declared it all too precipitous. She quit. The end.

You probably want to ruin not just MJW, but also Concerned Citizens, by getting me to talk again about Anshe's mistakes in MJW. That won't work, though, because I still support Anshe and her concerns AND the new group Anshe founded, which is proceeding along much more reasonable terms than what happened that weekend in MJW. And so do lots of others, also in that group. You would know that if you were paying attention.

Regardless of why you are repeating these falsehoods, nothing of what you say is in any way the truth. I think that not only were you not around for any of it, you also didn't read my statement on any of it, and moreover, and more importantly, you don't CARE what the truth is of any of it, because you care not one whit about truth.

coco

LoL

i think i made it very clear i support the idea of lobby groups for all. you are a very bad painter. stick to reality, dude! i don't support your crackpot justice!

prokocoa justice issue # 1:
is jeska modelling for slboutique a crime against humanity!?!?

get real!

I dont need to be a stakeholder, I dont need to be a tourist, I dont need to be in a group lobbying. I am able to accomplish my World Domination of Second Life all on my own.
All the power to do what I need to do is contained in my one index finger.

Seriously though, I also have the power that I could close the lid to my laptop and easily walk away without a worry or a care in the world -- for I do not have hundreds of people dependant on me to stay in the game. Nor do I need to stay in the game to survive.
Now thats power.

You say you support lobby groups for everyone but if Philip and Robin are the only ones who really "matter" in your view then I suppose those lobby groups would be pretty irrelevant to you in the long run. Would they not?

This entire topic is rife with contradictions none of which really mean jack when you read the bold print in the EULA.

i don't understand your point. the goal of the lobby groups is to get the attention of the lead developers of this platform. be it to gripe about stipends or to request new functionality, it is people like philip, robin, and many other developers in LL that have the power to affect change.

philip uses words like country to describe this game. robin calls this a community. we are all refered to as residents. so the contreversial question is are these words insincere hyperbole or do they challenge some aspects of the TOS.

SL is a community oriented game. LL will need to cater to all the various kinds of player groups to sustain and grow the player population. there's no reason why these groups shouldn't organize to put forth demands on the service provider. it will certainly beat the reoccuring allegations of secret favoritism etc.

SL is different from many other games as it's very nature is the emergence of social order and in that regard it encourages the conditions for players to organize and make demands rather than keeping them seperated and invisible.