Re: Halliburton to Rebuild New Orleans?
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Jeffrey Gomez
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Join date: 11 Jun 2004
Posts: 3,522
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09-10-2005 23:25
Crosspost from my screwup in General. Original text: Can anyone confirm this? Someone told me earlier that Halliburton had been contracted for rebuilding New Orleans. Curious about it, I went on Google, only to find most of the sources aren't exactly reputable.Was there an article I missed that confirms this is happening, or should I pass it off as another cheap shot at the folks in power? Because if it's true, it's going to send shockwaves through the political community.
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Ellie Edo
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09-10-2005 23:37
From: Jeffrey Gomez Can anyone confirm this? Heres one that looks reputable. But the only firm link with Halliburton is the work repairing some naval bases. We'll see soon, I guess. http://observer.guardian.co.uk/business/story/0,6903,1567081,00.html
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Jeffrey Gomez
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09-10-2005 23:52
Yeah. I didn't like the Guardian's first link, so I decided to dig into the issue. Found one in the Miami Herald/AP. Since the login is free, I'm cross-posting it here: From: someone http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/12612599.htmPosted on Sat, Sep. 10, 2005 Associated Press AUSTIN - As Vice President Dick Cheney toured Hurricane Katrina shelter operations in Texas' capital city Saturday, a group of about two dozen protesters gathered outside chanting, "Cheney, Cheney, you can't hide, we charge you with genocide." Cheney visited the Austin Convention Center shelter and the Texas State Operations Center, where state officials orchestrated the intake of more than 240,000 people last week after flood waters rose in New Orleans. At the convention center, where some 1,500 evacuees remained Saturday, Cheney met briefly with 23-year-old Telisha Diaz, who told him she spent four days at the New Orleans convention center before being brought to Austin a week ago. "It's overwhelming that the state of Texas is giving so much, just giving us everything - jobs, food," Diaz told the vice president, who was surrounded by local officials and congressmen. Cheney said Diaz's sentiments of gratitude were echoed by all of the evacuees he had spoken with in the two weeks since the hurricane pummeled Gulf Coast communities in Louisiana and Mississippi. He applauded Texas' response to the disaster and the outpouring of support from the state's leaders and residents. "I was impressed with the caliber of the effort that was mounted here and it's a good place to come learn some valuable lessons," Cheney said. He brushed off media questions about the federal government's slow response to hurricane victims in the hours and days after the storm, and FEMA director Michael Brown being removed from his command post in Louisiana amid the criticism and questions about his qualifications. Cheney said he supported Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff's decision regarding Brown and would not comment on any other possible leadership changes. While the evacuees seemed to appreciate Cheney's visit, protesters saw it as an opportunity to voice frustration over a Halliburton Co. subsidiary's involvement in emergency repairs at Gulf Coast naval and Marine facilities. Cheney headed Halliburton from 1995 to 2000, and Democrats have questioned whether the company has gotten favorable treatment because of his connection. "Cheney is profiteering off of murder," said 36-year-old Debbie Russell of Austin, who flashed an obscene gesture at the vice president when he waved at her and other protesters as he got into his vehicle. While Cheney was in Austin, U.S. Health and Human Services Secretary Michael Leavitt visited a shelter in Dallas. He said his department has established special "evacuee" status for affected individuals to simplify and expedite their access to benefits. The process will allow states to enroll evacuees without requiring documents such as tax returns or proof of residency for programs such as Medicaid, child care support, foster care assistance and substance abuse treatment. In Houston, thousands of people dodged a cloud burst outside a church where the Red Cross offered financial assistance Saturday afternoon. Inside, evacuees sat across rows of tables from Red Cross volunteers who processed their aid requests. "This was the fastest line I've been in since the storm," said Danny Whitehead, 50, an offshore worker from New Orleans. "We got what we needed, and things are getting better everyday." The crowd included many evacuees who've spent the past two weeks in hotels or in the homes of extended family, friends or good samaritans. Officials said the population at Houston's Astrodome, Reliant Center and George R. Brown Convention Center went down overnight by about 1,300 to a total of 7,327 as evacuees continued to find other places to live. Officials at shelters in Houston and Dallas said they still hope to have everyone in temporary or permanent housing by Sept. 17. "We have a goal of getting these lives restored as quickly as possible. We don't want them in the dome for six months," said U.S. Coast Guard Lt. Joe Leonard, area commander for Houston shelter operations. The NFL team the Houston Texans plays its first home game at Reliant Stadium on Sept. 18, but Harris County Judge Robert Eckels said that was not a factor in trying to get all of the evacuees moved. "This is a shelter, not a home, and it will not become a refugee center," Eckels said. --- Associated Press reporters Jim Vertuno and Derrill Holly in Houston and Sheila Flynn in Dallas contributed to this report.
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Beryl Greenacre
Big Scaredy-Baby
Join date: 24 Jun 2003
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09-11-2005 00:04
I don't know about Haliburton's involvement in the impending rebuild of New Orleans. However, my husband, a civil engineer who works for our local county, got notice this past week from his supervisors that Louisiana is looking for qualified people to come and help. My husband's areas of knowledge include street design, traffic engineering and signal design/timing. The notice he was given indicated that qualified workers who were interested in participating in this project would be reimbursed their normal salary by the State of Louisiana (which would most likely be obtaining this money at least partially from the federal government). These workers would also return to their current jobs after some (I assume as-yet-unknown) period of time.
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Jeffrey Gomez
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09-11-2005 00:28
As long as the government agencies put forth an effort to get all the able-bodied people they can in to help Louisiana and Mississippi rebuild, all is well. But if they cordon off these contracts to their buddies, or turn down necessary foreign aid, they're going to make a lot of angry folks.
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Satchmo Prototype
eSheep
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09-11-2005 07:01
They are already using Blackwater, so I assume Haliburton is next. Between the two fo them we have a legal private industry that is capable of covert ops, espionage, security and nation/city rebuilding. Kinda scary when private industry starts to look like the military. There have been many cyberpunk tales written about this sort of thing.
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Misnomer Jones
3 is the magic number
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09-11-2005 09:58
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Garoad Kuroda
Prophet of Muppetry
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09-11-2005 12:50
Why would this be such a shock? Apparently they can help rebuild stuff. It's what some big corporations do. So just because DC is VP now, they should be cut out of any kind of business, even if they really are the best qualified company for it? Or is there a new consipiracy theory that George Bush, er, I mean Dick Cheney sent the hurricane to destroy NO? 
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WTF is C3PO supposed to be USEFUL for anyway, besides whining? Stupid piece of scrap metal would be more useful recycled as a toaster. But even that would suck, because who would want to listen to a whining wussy toaster? Is he gold plated? If that's the case he should just be melted down into gold ingots. Help the economy some, and stop being so damn useless you stupid bucket of bolts! R2 is 1,000 times more useful than your tin man ass, and he's shaped like a salt and pepper shaker FFS!
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Jeffrey Gomez
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09-11-2005 15:02
From: Garoad Kuroda Why would this be such a shock? It isn't. It's a recurring conflict of interest that leaves me completely unsurprised. What I'm pointing out is a lot of people are searching for a reason this tragedy has seen so little support from the government. Halliburton sticks out like a sore thumb, since they have a bid to rebuild the navy facilities there. Cheney's been in hot water before, ranging from Halliburton's role in the Iraqi cleanup to his "nefarious" role in the Project for the New American Century. ( lite version) If Halliburton's bid extends into civilian areas, there's going to be a major political blowup over Cheney's role in rebuilding versus the government's sluggish response. It's already left a lot of people freaked out, and I have yet to see conclusive proof that they're rebuilding more than just the bases. At any rate, I've sent the issue to the editor of FactCheck.org in advance. Though I have a gut feeling they'll print the issue no matter what I say. -------------- As for this: From: Satchmo Prototype They are already using Blackwater, so I assume Haliburton is next. Between the two fo them we have a legal private industry that is capable of covert ops, espionage, security and nation/city rebuilding. Kinda scary when private industry starts to look like the military. There have been many cyberpunk tales written about this sort of thing. . From: someone In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.
-Dwight D. Eisenhower, Farewell Address, 1961
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Neehai Zapata
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09-11-2005 15:12
From: someone Why would this be such a shock? Apparently they can help rebuild stuff. It's what some big corporations do. So just because DC is VP now, they should be cut out of any kind of business, even if they really are the best qualified company for it? Or is there a new consipiracy theory that George Bush, er, I mean Dick Cheney sent the hurricane to destroy NO? It's called opportunity. Halliburton has received, through much favor, numerous contracts that could have gone to other people. On top of that, no amount of overspending or poor accounting seems to disqualify them from even more contract. It's time for the government to stop sole sourcing projects to these companies and expand. That is what made America great.
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Garoad Kuroda
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09-11-2005 18:51
While I find the Halliburton/Cheney connections (which no longer exist except in people's minds) entertaining, I have to ask what exactly Cheney is getting out of it for himself. Lower ratings in polls? Last I heard he doesn't even own stock in the company anymore. "How dare these evil corporations profit from rebuilding efforts..." It's silly to say this, of course they're profiting, that's the whole point of running a business, it's how capitalism works. It's like saying "How dare all those damn doctors, profiting off of people getting sick!" Huh? I don't disagree that government needs to choose their contracts better and allow more competition. But that problem goes beyond the current administration, no-bid contracts have been going out for awhile, it's a federal government problem in general. I'm even seeing it personally, and believe me it has nothing to do with Dick Cheney. The current administration seems to get the blame for alot of general government deficiencies, maybe it's because people are now taking a closer look at the government than they used to. When people single out people or groups who only represent a subset of a greater problem, but placing all blame on them anyway, it's kinda annoying, because it's wrong. I can't wait for the next Democratic president to be elected. I want to see where criticism of the government's stupidness gets directed then. And for all we know, Halliburton may actually be the best choice. Anyone seen any research that indicates otherwise?
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BTW
WTF is C3PO supposed to be USEFUL for anyway, besides whining? Stupid piece of scrap metal would be more useful recycled as a toaster. But even that would suck, because who would want to listen to a whining wussy toaster? Is he gold plated? If that's the case he should just be melted down into gold ingots. Help the economy some, and stop being so damn useless you stupid bucket of bolts! R2 is 1,000 times more useful than your tin man ass, and he's shaped like a salt and pepper shaker FFS!
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Jeffrey Gomez
Cubed™
Join date: 11 Jun 2004
Posts: 3,522
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09-11-2005 19:14
From: Garoad Kuroda While I find the Halliburton/Cheney connections (which no longer exist except in people's minds) entertaining, I have to ask what exactly Cheney is getting out of it for himself. Lower ratings in polls? Last I heard he doesn't even own stock in the company anymore. To clarify this statement, here's a blurb from his Wikipedia article. I'm leaving out the last line because this is technically a PG forum, but you can read it at the link: From: someone http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Cheney#Relationship_to_Halliburton_as_Vice_PresidentRelationship to Halliburton as Vice President: Cheney resigned as CEO of Halliburton on July 25, 2000, and put all of his corporate shares into a blind trust, except 433,333 stock options worth about $8 million transferred to a charitable trust. As part of his deferred compensation agreements with Halliburton contractually arranged prior to Cheney becoming Vice President, Cheney's public financial disclosure sheets filed with the U.S. Office of Government Ethics showed he received $162,392 in 2002 and $205,298 in 2001. Upon his nomination as a Vice Presidential candidate, Cheney purchased an insurance policy that would guarantee his deferred payments regardless of the company's performance, removing any conflict of interest. Cheney's net worth, estimated to be between $30 million and $100 million, is largely derived from his post at Halliburton. In the rebuilding of Iraq, Halliburton was granted a $7 billion no-bid contract. And here's a detailed FactCheck.Org posting from last year: http://www.factcheck.org/article261.htmlThe point "in peoples' minds" is precisely what's relevant to the issue. Without outright demonizing Cheney in my post here, it still builds a compelling case that Cheney has friends in Halliburton as a result of his time as CEO. That point alone spells political flustercuck whenever Halliburton is tied to a major political disaster, and it's grasping at straws compared to the allegations leveled. What would he gain from that? I'll leave that question to answer itself. From: Garoad Kuroda "How dare these evil corporations profit from rebuilding efforts..." It's silly to say this, of course they're profiting, that's the whole point of running a business, it's how capitalism works. It's like saying "How dare all those damn doctors, profiting off of people getting sick!" Huh? Right. But when an ex-Halliburton CEO has considerable power over the military effort to prevent much of the damage before it happens? Without mulling in the details, it worries me personally. While I agree that this goes beyond Cheney, including the FEMA effort, it remains an issue. The whole point of the posting is to discuss it before the attacks are leveled by both parties' spin doctors. From: Garoad Kuroda I don't disagree that government needs to choose their contracts better and allow more competition. But that problem goes beyond the current administration, no-bid contracts have been going out for awhile, it's a federal government problem in general. I'm even seeing it personally, and believe me it has nothing to do with Dick Cheney. The current administration seems to get the blame for alot of general government deficiencies, maybe it's because people are now taking a closer look at the government than they used to. When people single out people or groups who only represent a subset of a greater problem, but placing all blame on them anyway, it's kinda annoying, because it's wrong. Right. FactCheck.Org has a good piece on this express issue, regarding pre-disaster preparation: http://www.factcheck.org/article344.htmlFrom: Garoad Kuroda And for all we know, Halliburton may actually be the best choice. Anyone seen any research that indicates otherwise? Quick Google to Hoovers.Com. Excuse the popup: http://www.hoovers.com/halliburton/--ID__10697--/free-co-factsheet.xhtmlAs well as the three top listed competitors: http://www.hoovers.com/bechtel/--ID__40059--/free-co-factsheet.xhtmlhttp://www.hoovers.com/schlumberger/--ID__11327--/free-co-factsheet.xhtmlhttp://www.hoovers.com/technip/--ID__92823--/free-co-factsheet.xhtmlMy point in posting is not to sway opinion either way. It's to lay a complete and detailed analysis of an up-and-coming political issue, and to express my own worries with regards to the cleanup and bidding process. While I personally dislike the current administration for other reasons, these points remain relevant and worthy of discussion. I have yet to see anything demonizing. Regardless, this remains an issue that is part of public opinion. How do you feel about it?
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Cristiano Midnight
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09-11-2005 20:45
The Halliburton angle puts an interesting spin on Barbara Bush's comments about things working out for the poor: Halliburton was already wealthy before the disaster, so this is working out quite well for them.
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Hiro Pendragon
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09-11-2005 21:20
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Taco Rubio
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09-12-2005 08:10
From: Jeffrey Gomez ...But if they cordon off these contracts to their buddies, or turn down necessary foreign aid, they're going to make a lot of angry folks in both parties. All parties, please. There are more than two, thanks!
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Jeffrey Gomez
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09-12-2005 16:02
From: Taco Rubio All parties, please. There are more than two, thanks! Meh. Details. Party politics is a sham anyway, but let's not go there.  I'm an Indie voter myself, so I'll fix that one in the original post.
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