The following issue is rated PG.

I hate push scripts! Especially ones people put in their parcels to prevent access! People who do it are morons, I'm sorry, but it ruins a hell of alot of fun (such as flying aircraft about) for alot of people.

I just got caught by one such script, shoved me through the ground and into someone else's parcel, who also had this script. I can't remember the names of them, but that is ANNOYING! For Pete's sake, they have parcel locks BUILT INTO second life, there's no friggin' reason to go and put up push scripts to ruin people's fun.

If anyone has a standing, valid defense against this nonsense, please contact me.

I dislike them as well. I was jolted by a script while flying nearly 300m high. The shock was so intense, it broke texture rendering until I relogged. I could fly around and TP, but any textures that weren't cached would remain blurred.

When this happens, file an abuse report. As you can see in the SL Police Blotter at times, the Lindens will warn owners of overly aggressive security scripts to scale the scripts back if enough people have reported problems.

Well push scripts are fun for pillow fights but that is about it. As for the ones in the sky, people just want to keep you out of their sex boxes in the sky.

... I lack a comment.

You asked for one good reason. Though they should be considerate and turn them off when they are done doing the nasty.

Security scripts should NOT use llPushObject. Period. Feel free to use the Abuse Reporter in cases like this.

w00t

Imagine that...people setting up scripts to keep people from watching them have av sex...who'd have thought these people were so shy lol

They aren't shy, they just don't want you to benefit from their "hard" work.

:rimshot:

But watching is "hard" work too.

Push script security systems are becoming a major problem. It is getting to the point where you can't even explore SL anymore as you are subject to attack at any time. This is as bad as someone running around with push weapons. These things run even when no one is on the property. Its an attack on innocent passing victims by proxy.

This practice must be outlawed to protect free travel and exploration by SL gamers. The indiscriminate use of land bans are bad enough but push script security is really crossing the line.

People who use these systems should be held to the same penalties imposed on people who shot innocent victums with push weapons, a warning followed by suspension.

What I find interesting (and baffling), is that people are still allowed to sell this stuff.

I mean you have a thread like this, and a Linden will even weigh in with the official word that it's against the TOS etc., yet you can go to any of various stores and buy objects, security systems etc. that do these TOS violating activities.

Why can't I abuse report someone for *selling* a security system that has as it's main purpose TOS violating activities??? I can of course, (nothing will happen), but why don't the Lindens see that stopping people from selling this junk would really change the landscape?

Why don't the operators of places like SLUniverse and SLBoutique stop advertising these kinds of things? It's up to them as business members and upstanding citizens to take responsibility for the vendors and products they sell isn't it? You can go on either one of these web-sites right now and buy all kinds of "greifer gear" and if no one ever draws a moral line in the sand it will just go on and on and on.

That old NRA saw about "it's not the weapon that does the damage it's the person using it," is a meaningless cowardly justification.

Here's a message to the creators and sellers of this kind of crap:

Take a little responsibility and stop hiding behind empty phrases and excuses and (maybe), the world will change. It sure won't as long as your more concerned with counting your money than the damage you cause to others.

I fully agree... In the real world, you get into even more trouble for making an auto turret that shoots people who come onto a parcel of land as you do for actually utilizing such a booby trap.

I personally will sometimes make weapons of messy destruction that could easily be interpretted as violations of the geneva convention. But I will NEVER provide such things to other people with or without monetary compensation. As a result, all the weapons i sell (and i only sell a few) are 100% tame special effects that don't even cause much sound or particle spam. They're just flashy flashy, that's it. Purely to look cool without being annoying...

If anyone griefs anyone else with stuff that I make, it makes me more guilty than the griefer because I provided it to that griefer and others, knowing full well what they'd do with it.

As for the bit about the NRA, they're actually right. The NRA does not advocate the ownership or usage of assault weapons. They're mostly an organization for home protection and hunting. If someone uses a rifle intended for hunting food inorder to kill someone, the vendor shouldn't take responsibility as they were selling it for the express and exclusive use of hunting food.

Once we get onto the topic of outright banning real world firearms, it becomes a slippery slope. We could ban the use and sale of automobiles because you can run people over with them. Ban the sale and use of asprin because if you take too much of it, your blood thins so much you bleed into your own lungs and drown.

On Second Life there's an obviously clear distinction between weapons intended to be used in hunting for survival and weapons intended to harm other people. Mainly because there's no hunting in Second Life. No need to eat, or anything of the sort.

I agree. I just did a post in the suggestions as to why there are no limits. Why I can only teleport 300m but a push security system can send me three sims or worst yet, crash my system. This is unacceptable. Everyone needs to file an abuse report on every single push security system out there to get the point across. Indiscriminate bans on lands are bad enough, the push security systems simply cross the line of deciency. I can't figure out why "push" should ever be more then 10-20m anyways. Why is there no limit on this?

To weigh in on the other side.

There are some of us that do not believe every AV in SL has the (insert diety or none) given right to explore every inch of every sim. It is not necessarily about sex. Privacy can be desired for many reasons including not wishing to pick up ones latest creation everytime one leaves home because it is not yet ready for public consumption (or whatever the individuals chosen reason is). Some just feel wierded out coming home to find strangers doing the nasty in their bed. As long as people feel the need for privacy and the tools for it built into the game are inadequate (and ban lines are) these scripts will exist.

Having said that I would like to point out that as far as I know most of these scripts can be tuned to be considerably less invasive to others.for example on Dragon Isle ground level and the house level above it are open to the public and can be explored at will. We have a private level above that at 200 m high that is indeed protected by a sim wide security script pointing up. The entire underside of this platform is plastered with warning signs about this security. Honestly I feel no guilt. If someone chooses to deliberately try to enter an area clearly marked as being protected by security and they get bounced, well that is their mistake. This is a private island so we are not interfering with others right to fly over in route to another destination.

IMO your really quite mislead about the NRA, but I am assuming you are American and it's off-topic so best we just drop it.

I will only mention two things (just as food for thought):

- The NRA has consistently blocked all attempts at any kind of gun control including the banning of hand guns and assault rifles for "home use."

So the idea that the NRA is just about "guns for hunting" is not true.

- Most other "western" countries have had gun control for a long time and there is no "slippery slope" to be detected. The USA is one of the only countries without effective gun control and the citizens of the countries that have it currently enjoy more freedoms than the average US citizen.

So the idea that gun control leads to limiting freedoms in general is just not true.

But the thing is, you do not need to push to secure an area. Just have them ejected from the land. That is the difference I think most people are missing. It is not that they mind the security, but they mind how the security is working.

Being pushed into orbit can not be justifed in any circumstance. The aim of the security is to keep them out of the area, not to punish. So we have the eject command - they are no longer in the area, but nor are they so high up they have to re-log.

What I would see as even better would be a push field that prevents them from moving into the secure area, but with the lack of fine control on the detection of incoming mass and the force used in the pushing. But until that is available, the only thing that should be used is the eject.

mislead? Criminals are criminals, they dont care about laws. Making guns illegal would mean the cirminals would still have the guns, and no one else would. That is not better.

Ours is set to TP home for one reason and one reason only. If we pushed there is no control of the direction of the push. They could easily be thrown above our level and get caught in a continuouse loop that would eventually crash their machines of hitting the field trying to get down and being pushed again. It has been tuned as finely as humanly possible to not impact the parts of the island that are indeed public. This sort of loop by the way only can happen because we have no neighboring sims. We cannot use the land tools because the sim is both private and public. Our solution a sim size platform up high where there is no flyover possible (since we are an island no reason for someone to fly over), Finely tuned security, and alot of warning signs (the entire uderside of the platform to be exact). If we could afford a second private sim we would do it and it simply would never be open to the public at all. Until then this is the least impact solution we could find.

the point of my post was really that people do have their reasons for using security BUT that it is on them to do it in such a way that a compromise is reached between their needs and those of the community. Failing to tune a system I completely agree is wrong.

well Darkness, in that exact set up thats probably not to bad... but i dont think anyone was saying security is not needed, so im not sure why your trying to make a case for it. Private sims are a bit different then ones that are connected to all the main grid areas


I just really hate when im traveling around looking at things then all of a sudden i get some warning that i better leave the land or ill be ejcted in 10 seconds. I'm look all around to figure out what land its talking about as it usually a bunch of little lots, and it takes me a lot longer than 10 seconds to just figure out where it is im too close to, then all of a sudden I'm either thrown across 3 or 4 sims, or it auto TPs me to my home and pisses me off even more cuz i might not remember where i was to find it again.

I dont think anyones land and security scripts should be able to do more to you being on their land than drop you off their land very close to it. The only way you should be able to be TPed home is if they set it up as a damage zone and nuke your butt with weapons.

Well I can say from personal experience with owning a skybox home I feel security is a must, but is gotta be in a resposible matter. I placed a 25m radius field of return home that encompassed my home. My reasons for doing this are simple:

My home is not a public bath you can find somewhere esle to do the nasty. All because I have a collection of good poseballs that I leave out for easy access for myself & my mate/pet(s) doesn't make them public domain.

My home has been violated by griefers in the past leaving bombs and such at my front door, not no more.

My home is NOT a tourist trap. If I don't know you, you have no reason to be exploring my home without permission.

A field encompassing to the edge of my home I feel is reasonable. Why? You can still see that there is a home there and unless you intend on getting close to explore it you won't get sent home. No accidents invovled. All returns home were done intensionally because you intensionally tried to invade my home for one reason or another.

Ok , listen, noobs are noobs , griefers are griefs, we will always have them, but theres only about 20% of SL filled with them, we get new residents in SL everyday, If everyone should be punished because of ones actions is childish. And your tourism comment is just flat stupid, People dont always just go inside your home just to have sex, More like to learn more, and helping new residents by not letting them explore the greats of SL will not make them any better, Like everyones been saying the whole push security thing 2 - 3 sims is very stupid and it needs to be fixed.

And, yes good looking homes attract people, dont blast them out of the grid to say get out, it would be better if you say it yourself, thats why we have griefers, they are noobs who learned to use these push weapons from more expierienced players.

You make my point exactly. It is not the security script that is the issue. It is the individuals use of one. It has to be tuned to only cover what truelly needs to be covered.

Truth be told we are only recently on an island. We had security on the mainland for well over a year. Never set it higher than 2 m above the buildings roof. And on the mainland it did eject not TP (we only use TP now because of a unique problems with islands and eject).

Let me also add that anything that blasts you 2-3 sims away has been defined as excessive by a Linden (someone I am sure can provide the link I am unable to search right now). If that happens report it. It is abuse. As far as bouncing of the land if what I was told by a scriptor is right they can neither control the direction or much in the way of the force. You should still land within the same sim (unless you were on a boarder to begin with in which case you might get bounced that direction). Give the scriptors the tools for a gentle nudge off the property and I am sure they will be used. Better yet make the built in land security tools from LL effective and the whole security script thing becomes moot.

I also would like to add that being on an island does not make my points irrelevant. If these scripts are banned they will be banned gridwide. That means Private Islands as well.