Looking at new computers!

Ok, so after being told basically that my $1000 laptop sucks I am looking at desktops now. I would appreciate any suggestions for new desktops that will support SL. I dont need anything fancy, just a gaming PC that will support SL very well and wont be bothered by these updates. Im not really computer literate (so to speak) so break down technical terms for me. LOL. Any and all help would greatly be apreciated=)

Definately get an AMD64 Processor no less than an AMD3500.
1GB of ram should be adequate.
and one of the most important parts the video card, I highly recommend Nvidia 6600 and up, if money is not an issue get a 6800, 7600 or even 7800.
As for hard drive size, chose one that will fit your needs, 120GB these days is considered small.

I second this, damn good post Seigmancer

Well, if you look at this thread, you'll find good suggestions for building a SL capable machine for under $500. I'm sure that it'd be easy to scale up to your budget, such as buying the next most expensive video card, more hard drive space, more RAM, etc.

A little word of advice, Single Core CPUs like the AMD 3500 are rapidly becoming dinosaurs.

Since I had an AMD 64 3000 clocked to 2.3GHZ (performing better than the previously mentioned 3500, and still experienced lag, etc, I went to an AMD 64 x2 3800 and an NV7800GT.

Not, admittedly the world's cheapest CPU/Video card combo, but the difference in my SL has been significant, plus the fact that I am able to run other programs such as skype, Instant Messenger, Excel, Media Jubebox and more, and suffer none of the problems I had with the single core CPU.

Intel also recently released a value dual core CPU, called the D805, which is selling for around $125 from Newegg, and the D820, which sells for about $175, which compete directly in price with the AMD 64 3000/3200.

It is my profound belief that any SL user who recommends a single core CPU has never experienced the benefits of a Dual Core; There is to my mind very few if any reasons not to employ them.

In the Link provided above by Draco you will find much information, some of it possibly contradictory. Also in there is a post of mine detailing my various systems.

I provide a link to some screenshots of Dual Core systems running SL, along with some other programs, and showing the CPU utilization. I would dearly love to see anyone with a single core CPU post a similar screenshot, and be able to quantitatively tell me it runs as well as mine or better.

http://baartman.us/General/SL_Task_Manager_1.doc

here is a screenshot of a friend's Intel based Dual Core:

http://baartman.us/General/Sazzy_SL_Taskmanager.doc

As an afterthought, I built my x2 3800 system for a touch under $1000.

Also, both cores need to be enabled, something which is easily done.

Good Luck, and wise shopping!

For SL a AMD64 3000+ is plenty.

Graphics wise 6600 or ATI X800 ( and judging by my experience and posts in this forum the ATI's seem to be coping better ) is fine.

40gig of disk space for a SL only system is fine. One area worth upgrading though however but 2gig of Ram in before going up on the disk space.

Oh and for the record I use SL on a mix of Single and Dual core Rigs :-

Intel 805 Dual + 6600GT
AMD 3800+ X2 + X1800XT
AMD 3200+ + X800

The 3200 is plenty good enough for a SL only rig.

With the OP having a Laptop if they need to multi task the Lappy can do the web surfing etc.

The 805 Intel is ONLY any good if you plan on overclocking it.

Alternativly buying a second hand rig isn't a bad idea.

SL will run fine ( all be it having to run with reduced graphics options ) on as little as a AMD XP 2500+ with a ATI 9800 graphics solution.

Just make sure you have AT LEAST 1 gig of Ram.

Pre-built, the

"Titan" AMD Athlon 64 3200+ System (FS-001-OK)

from http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Full_Systems_43.html#aFS_2d001_2dOK

Will play SL fine ( that system does need a monitor, KB/Mouse and Operating system on top - around £120ish for 17" CRT, KB/Mouse and XP-Home).

Katier has no problem with a single core, whereas I preach against them, on a Dollar for Dollar & Value basis. So be it!

Just to throw some more fat on the fire. in the beginning of 2006 my wife and I had the following configrations:

Wife: AMD Sempron 64 3100, 1GB Ram, NV6600/256MB (Standard Clocking)
Myself: AMD 64 3000 (Venice), 2GB Ram, ATI X800GTO/256 (Overclocked to 2.3GHz, PR approx 3600)

At a given place, the lag and framerate on my system was always worse than on my wife's system. So, I replaced the video card with an NV7800GT/256. That made a noticeable difference, but I found while in the game, if I needed to pull up the calculator, or was on skype, or in Yahoo/MSN Instant Messenger, things we still prety slow. Looking at the Task manager showed what I believed to be the reason. The CPU stayed hard spiked at 100%, and was having a tough time with the page swopping.

I decided to try the x2 3800, and Voila! problem solved.

The moral of the story is, single core CPUs are acceptable if you do not attempt to use any other programs with SL. But, be aware that they will always be close or at 100% utilization, which can, and in my experience does contribute to perceived lag.

Katier states that the D805 in her experience has to be overclocked to work with SL. Luckily, the D805 is an excellent candidate for a modest overclock to 3.5GHz, according to Tom's Hardware site. (they were able to take it to 4.1GHz, where it was competing directly with CPUs in the $1000 range) Beyond the 3.5GHz point additional cooling becomes neccessary.

http://www.tomshardware.com/2006/05/10/dual_41_ghz_cores/

Tom's and Anandtech (to mention only two of the more popular hardware review sites) have a number of interesting articles concerning Dual Cores and their emergence and acceptance into the mainstream.

Here is a link to Anandtech, with an article comparing the use of the D805 with standard clocking:

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2736

As has been stated in these forums before, do not attempt to compare SL with any of the games used to benchmark in articles such as these. SL is its own animal completely. What would be of very real interest to our user community is to try to convince the testers on sites like these to incorporate SL testing in their suites.

I would be interested to hear more from Katier about the details of the D805 configuration in use (such as Motherboard, particulars on the degree of overclocking attempted, etc)

On the 805 front we're talking here someone who probably won't want to delve into the world of overclocking. Hence it's a bad option. My 805 is doing 3.6ghz rock stable on an AL-8 Abit and stock cooler ( it does folding@home so both cores 24/7 100% ) so sure they clock well but they HAVE to be clocked.

That Tomshardware article ( which I've seen discussed ad infintum) is terribly written. It compares a STOCK high end AMD chip with an overclocked low end Intel chip. The fact that a 3800+, 4400+, Opty 170 and FX62( think that's the right model off top of head) can all clock well and will beat the intel with ease when clocked means whilst the 805 isn't a bad chip, it's NOT as good as any AMD.

You example is a good example of where dual core is handy. Voice programs can get CPU intensive and will lag a single core. However when you have a lappy you can put the extra stuff like that on the lappy and run SL purely on the main PC. Hence dual core is not a requirement. Dual core only becomes a benefit if (like yourself) you use multiple CPU intensive applications. I'm certain the OP doesn't do that and therefore dual core isn't needed.

Ok, so I am totally lost now! lol...are there complete computer systems out there with this stuff already in it??

I do apologise not surprised we confused you. Basically you need to look for a computer with a :-

ATI X1300, X1600, X800, X850, X1800 or X1900 (cheapest to most expensive - more or less)

or

Nvidia 6600, 6800, 7600, 7800 or 7900

with 1 gig of Ram minimum.

Processor is better being AMD but if you can only find Intel ones in your price bracket it's not a biggy.

I have a T2300 (Core Duo Laptop) with an ATI X1400 and I love it. With the two cores (running only at 1.6 Mhz each!!!), this machine just zooms...It has 2GB DDR RAM in it, which probably contributes a great deal.

And it wasn't expensive. I believe laptops similarly configured are selling for <$1,000 now.

Flipping between applications is no problem at all. I was flipping between Blender and SL last night, with the music streaming from SL in the background while I worked in Blender with nary a hiccup...

I love my laptop!

Considering that the D805 costs $125, about as much as an AMD 64 3000, and will readily overclock (as does the 3000) Would you not consider the D805 a worthy SL solution? Especially since it will handle multiple programs, including SL, with ease?

Nothing less then 3500 amd? are you joking? I doing very well with 3200.........

It's obvious that the OP is not technically knowledgeable. Overclocking is ONLY for people who know exactly what they're doing. What the OP needs is a ready setup system they (she?) can just install SL on and go.

What I suggest is they do some window shopping find 2-3 systems they think match up with my advice on spec above then we can confirm if they are indeed SL compatable.

Also on a slight offshoot, CPU useage in SL seems to have dropped. Which makes sense given I'm certain more of the graphics is thrown in the direction of the graphics card than before.

Just a suggestion for a very good deal on a good system (P4D/820 (dual core/2.8ghz)), 80gb SATA harddrive, 512mb ram.. Try the Dell Outlet refurb store at http://outlet.dell.com... About three months ago, I bought a Dell GX620 from the Outlet with the above specs.. actually mine was a bit better, it came with a 250gb SATA drive vs the usual 80gb drive. Now to the great part: I paid $429 (plus $99 shipping + $35 tax) for this system. I support a bunch of Dell systems at work, and we buy the same machine from Dell for a bit over $1000 each for the same specs... The Outlet machines are simply machines which have been returned during the 21 day return period, and are gone thru by Dell and recertified -like-new, and sold as a refurb.. Whatever warantee/software the system originally had comes with it as a refurb. In my case, it had a 3yr on-site warrantee, and MSOfficePro (several hundred dollars additional, if you buy it separately).. Most of Dell's home systems that you see on TV or magazines, only have a 90 day warrantee. Since the Optiplex line is their corporate model, the warrantee is MUCH better.. Just today, I was checking the Outlet, and spotted another system like mine for only $319!!! One thing to watch for: many of the systems on the Outlet are not dual core, but the old-style Hyperthread processors, which are ok but not as good as the dual core systems. I just wish I had the $$$ to snap that machine up for use as a Linux system, but alas!! Since my purchase, I've upgraded the ram up to 2gb (the system has 4 slots and will take up to 4gb vs the 2 slots that Dell's home systems have), and a Nvidia GF6200 512mb video card. The Optiplex system, since its a corporate machine, has onboard Intel video, but also has a PCI-express video card slot....

Hope this helps some to get a cheap, good machine!!!

Tas

A warning about Dell though:
If you find a particular model of PC practically LITTERING a Dell store and it looks like they are giving them away, DON'T BUY IT. It's probably a defective model (that is, all of them are bad and will probably have some kind of hardware failure in a month).


Link to This is True.com

Drop by your local big-name PC repair shop (such as Best Buy's Geek Squad...)

If you see 10 desktops being repaired, and 6 or 7 of them are the same brand... don't buy that brand.

Especially if it's not a brand the store even SELLS, because those people obviously are paying good money since it's not warranty work... so the problem's definitely more than a small pain.

(For the record, I'm referring to Dell.) *shudders*

Some Dell's can be good. You have to know what to get (i.e. not the economy "as seen on TV" stuff). Always get the business level line. I've had very few problems with my laptop (Latitude D600) and anything that has gone wrong I can get fixed for free because of my 4-year on-site unlimited warrenty. I even had to ship it to California (from Pennsylvania) and it was garunteed to be back in 3 days. It was back in 2.