Anyone use vector based programs for clothes design?

Does anyone use vector based programs for clothes design, programs like Adobe Illustrator or CorelDraw?

Of course you'd have to export to a bitmap format for use in SL, but there might be effects one can get from a vector based program that wouldn't come as easily as they would in bitmap paint program.

I ask this 'cause I do vector based sign design at work and thus think about vectors versus bitmaps more than a person really ought to.

I use Illustrator pretty extensively. Outside SL, I use it at least as much as Photoshop, if not more. For clothing, I don't use it all that often, but I do from time to time, depending on the task at hand.

On a side note, Photoshop's vector tools get more powerful with each new version, as do Illustrator's raster tools (although to a lesser extent). The line between the two keeps getting blurier. I've long suspected the two programs will merge one day.

Any reason you're asking beyond simple curioisity? It would probably be interesting and useful to get some vector technique discussions going.

Paint Shop Pro also has some fairly nice basic vector tools, although certainly not in the league of either of the above, I think. Still, I use them all the time.

By the way, is there a vectorized clothes template that shows the avatar polygons somewhere? Might be fun being able to draw and snap onto them precisely instead of the hit and miss technique using the usual raster templates.

Robin's got a verctorized version, using PS CS2's smart objects. I still haven't upgraded to CS2 (slap me now, Robin) so I haven't had a chance to play with it. I would imagine it can be ported over to Illustrator. Vector objects in previous versions of PS always could.

I haven't upgraded either though the CD's have been on my desk since November.

I think you should be able to just drag and drop the smart objects into Illustrator though.

ROFL! I don't have to slap you, Chosen. Not having CS2 to use is slap enough.

It's even easier than that to use the Vector Smart Objects in Illustrator. Just double click on them, which opens them in Illustrator. Save As.. something ... and there you are.

(If you just Save, not Save As, it will change the file in PS.)

Hope this helps!

What do vector smart objects do??

Check this out:

http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop/pop_smart.html

I'm an Illustrator fanatic (see my website for evidence) but I've never really tried using AI to make textures for SL; it's just been a lot easier to pull the templates into Photoshop and scrawl over them.

Plus there's the transparency issue. I just played with saving something as a TGA from Illustrator and it seems to either drop the transparency (when saving as a 24-bit targa) or output an image set entirely transparent (when saving as a 32-bit targa and pulling up in SL or Preview, though Photoshop loads it as entirely opaque).

Can't find the server. Typo in URL, perhaps?


Alpha channel output (transparency) from Illustrator is really simple. Everything in Illustrator is entirely object based, and TGA output (with or without transparency) is no exception. Here are the basic prnciples you need to know:

1. When you export a 32-bit TGA, the grayscale values on the alpha are determined by the opacity/transparency of each object in the image. So, for example, if you've got an object with an opaque stroke and a 50% transparent fill, the corresponding area of the alpha channel will be white in the shape of the stroke, and 50% gray in the area of the fill (assumig we're talking about an object that does not overlap other objects).
   
   
   
2. The canvas will not be exported, nor will any part of the artboard; just the objects and whatever space is required to enclose them. The size of the exported image will be determined by the objects, not by the canvas in any way.
   
   
   
3. If you want your image to be a certain size, you MUST enclose your intended canvas area with a rectangle. Otherwise, the image will be no larger than the total size of the other objects present. I suggest getting in the habit of placing the bounding rectangle, and locking it down, before you do anything else in every image.
   
   
   
4. With the above point in mind, if you are going for a fixed size (which you should be), make sure there are no objects present on the artboard outside your bounding rectangle. Remember, Illustrator will export all the objects without any regard to the canvas. If you've got a stray object 10,000 pixels away, your exported image will end up being 10,000 pixels wider. The point here is be careful. Keep your artboard clean.
   
   
   
5. If you want a transparent background, just give the bounding rectangle a transparent stroke and fill.
   
   
   
6. When you examine an Illustrator-created 32-bt TGA in Photoshop, you will see that the background appears to be white, not transparent. This in no way means that it's not actually transparent. Remember, transparency is determined by the alpha channel, and only the alpha channel. If you take a look at the alpha, you'll see that all the proper black, white, and gray values are present. That's all you need.
   
   
   
7. If for some reason, you want to check the actual appearance with the transparency applied, simply copy the alpha channel to a layer mask. TGA's are inherently flat, so the image you're looking at only has one layer. Apply the mask to it, and you'll see the transparency. You can use the mask as long as the file is open, but be aware that it will cease to exist when you close the file. TGA does not support layers, so it follows that it can't support masks since masks are function of layers. Don't worry; the transparency will still be there, preserved in the alpha channel, so SL will inerpret the image just fine.

I use Illustrator for a lotta tattoo work that I do, considering most tatts are rather vectorish in style, with outlines and fills and text sometimes, then I paste that stuff into Photoshop for tga makin'.

http://egypt.urnash.com/view_album.php?set_albumName=Illustration

I wish I could make stuff like that

Yeah, Candide guessed the proper URL just above this. I blame BBCode.



Much easier: use the rectangle tool to draw your bounding box, then do object->crop area->make. Any bitmap output will be cropped to this, regardless of where you have paths. Some of my art sprawls way outside of the crop areas because of how I generate some effects.

Some experimenting with going between AI and PS (CS2 suite - what version of AI are you able to get TGAs with working masks out of, Chosen? Could be they broke it in CS2.) is suggesting that AICS2's TGA output is broken - it just outputs it against a white bg, with a 100% white alpha channel. I suppose one could create a workflow of outputting a PNG and abusing it in Photoshop to flatten the opacity into an alpha channel, but I don't feel like fighting pixels right now.

I've generally found TGAs to be sporadically annoying things, so I may try taking a test image or two direct from AI to SL later tonight. Abstracty lacy confections of line blends would certainly be fun to wear.

Thanks for the tip. That's really useful. Can't imagine why I dind't know that was there, seeing as how it's been right in front of my face for years. D'oh!


You're right, Mech. This is indeed broken in CS2. (Yes, I just upgraded, so Robin, you can stop yelling at me now. ) I've tried every way I can think of to get Illustrator 12 to spit out alpha channels properly, but it just ain't happening. I'll E-mail Adobe about it. I'd suggest any other Illustrator users do the same. This should be patched.

To answer your question about what versions work correctly, I know for a fact it works fine in 11, and I'm 99% certain it also worked in 10. I can't remeber before that.

For now if you're using Illustrator 12, you'll need to use Photoshop as a buffer to create TGA's properly. I wouldn't go the PNG route though. There's not much point in creating extra files. Just copy your work directly from Illustrator and then paste it into Photoshop before saving to TGA as a final step.


Don't sweat the TGA's. They're incredibly simple files. Problems only arise with them when programmers decide to break stuff that's been working fine for decades, like Adobe did before with Photoshop 7, and now again with Illustrator 12. I think the difference this time is it might be accidental, so it might be forgivable, unlike that evil PS 7 fiasco.

Just confirming that the .tga export is broken on the Mac, too.

I even tried to use the old plug-in, from Illo 10, instead. (I figured, hey, the broken .tga plug-in works in newer versions of PS, so why not?) But it simply fails to read it. Sigh. (I never got Illo CS, so I can't try using that plug-in, although I understand that it did work.)

Yeah, writing to Adobe and pointing out that it needs fixing is probably the only thing that we can do. (I even went ahead and installed the latest update, but this issue isn't addressed there.)

I posted on the Adobe forums, and I'm going to write to them as well, later today. Right now, though, I have to go back to the day job (which is sucking up all my time, at the moment.)

CS2 is such a marketing release. At least as far as Illustrator is concerned. Live trace/paint, whoopee, especially since they're only accessible through the annoying new screen-wide 'control palette'. And a few things like this broken! (I still find myself wishing I had the Mac binary for the old hatch effects plugin somewhere sometimes.)

I'll have to find the revised clothing templates with the 'vector smart objects' folks are mentioning here and fool around. I did some testing and the method of cut-and-paste from AI to PS to save a TGA does indeed work in CS2, though it leaves me feeling terribly awkward. I'd certainly feel more at home with this than I would trying to paint in PS...