Article V (for Vendetta)
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-13-2006 06:52
I have just learned that the now Fascist "Walled City" (which erroneously calls itself Neualtenburg) has decided to pursue charges against me at their next Judicial hearing. Specifically: Article V: Charges against Kendra Bancroft for violating the constitution by conspiring to prevent the SC from exercising their constitutional prerogative of closing a forum." While simultaneously spreading lies and defamations about myself and Phase III of the Projekt (Port Neualtenburg) on their own forums, the Rogue Government now attempts to paint me as an "Enemy of The State" and bring charges against me for protecting against their assault of The Neualtenburg Projekt Forum that I founded. There are two interesting facets about this to discuss: 1) The moment that the "Walled City" moved it's official forums to an off-site, Did they in fact have a right to any say in The Projekt forum --which was being used by the City but not founded by them? 2) Is the Government of the "Walled City" effective as an SL organization? They might indeed find me guilty -- but what then? Ban me from a Sim I have no intention to ever visit? (Though I was back recently to help them thru a building crisis out of the kindness of my heart) In point of fact this Article V is nothing but Vendetta against me for not subscribing to the group-think party line. The purpose of Phase III is to begin to grow, organically, a system which truly serves a purpose: To protect both the Artist and Consumer as they relate to our community, while providing an entertaining environment both to live and visit. Organic growth is essential because as we can see in "The Walled City" (or Iraq) handing citizens a constitution and a democracy does not ensure that they will be used or appreciated. It becomes in short --a role playing game. Phase III is an addressing of that flaw. The "Walled City", which in my estimation has failed at this point, is a vanity project that seems to serve only it's own bureaucratic windmill. It has become an insular community of some 30 people ruled over by a select elite that believe they "know what's best" for it's citizens.
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Lucifer Baphomet
Postmodern Demon
Join date: 8 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,771
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06-13-2006 07:33
From: Kendra Bancroft Organic growth is essential because as we can see in "The Walled City" (or Iraq) handing citizens a constitution and a democracy does not ensure that they will be used or appreciated. It becomes in short --a role playing game. Thats what I feel I've seen on my visits to the Walled City. A politics based RPG.
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-13-2006 07:47
From: Lucifer Baphomet Thats what I feel I've seen on my visits to the Walled City. A politics based RPG. Mind you --there isn't anything especially wrong with a politics based RPG, but it is not what The Projekt is interested in pursuing. From it's beginning in Anzere, Neualtenburg was purposed to be a cooperative community that serves as both a protection to it's artisan class and a guarantee of quality and customer service to it's consumers. It is supposed to have a function beyond becoming Peewee's Parliamentary Playhouse. Once the opening cermeonies are over with, I will be posting more about artist rights issues, IP protection, Consumer Guarantees and tribalist notions of group cohesion. I encourage active discussion on both the Forums --and in "Guild" meetings which will soon begin as scheduled discussion groups. All artists and artisans will be welcome.
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Aliasi Stonebender
Return of Catbread
Join date: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 1,858
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06-13-2006 14:43
Y'know, Kendra, have you ever read the V for Vendetta book?
This isn't meant as snark, truly it isn't. I've been meaning to ask for some time, but with recent events it would have seemed petty.
... it's just, a socialist taking the a personification of anarchy as a symbol trips the irony-meter something fierce. This didn't come out as clear in the movie (which has more of a vague "up with people!" sort of message) although movie V is still a clear proponent of the Land of Do-As-You-Please. Just less crazy.
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
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06-13-2006 17:25
From: Kendra Bancroft The "Walled City", which in my estimation has failed at this point, is a vanity project that seems to serve only it's own bureaucratic windmill. It has become an insular community of some 30 people ruled over by a select elite that believe they "know what's best" for it's citizens. First, let me say that the Walled City is a brilliant moniker, capturing their refusal to even discuss third-party mediation, criminalizing all who dissent, forcefully taking over the forums, closing citizens' threads in their off-site forum, denying the right to due process to foreigners, engaging in kangaroo trials, interpreting the constitution liberally to allow abuse, and on and on (I should keep a list in this forum). It's a perfect nickname for their troubled city.  Second, this concept of an insular elite waxing endlessly bureaucratic is spot on. I still laugh when I read that perfect example of Orwellian doublespeak that states they will discuss "charges against Kendra Bancroft for violating the constitution by conspiring to prevent the SC from exercising their constitutional prerogative of closing a forum." Good grief. It's of course an alternative to admitting that they're going to get together and validate their presupposition that the SC could lock down a forum without consulting the populace and then punish Kendra's successful attempt to take the forum back by casting her in the light of a traitor, while ignoring LL's enormous role completely as they are still their supplicants. I can't believe the Walled City is spontaneously generating Orwellian doublespeak. It as if they want to perfectly demonstrate why user-run government in virtual worlds is insanity. That phase of the project honestly could not have failed more spectacularly.  ~Ulrika~
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-13-2006 17:47
From: Aliasi Stonebender Y'know, Kendra, have you ever read the V for Vendetta book?
This isn't meant as snark, truly it isn't. I've been meaning to ask for some time, but with recent events it would have seemed petty.
... it's just, a socialist taking the a personification of anarchy as a symbol trips the irony-meter something fierce. This didn't come out as clear in the movie (which has more of a vague "up with people!" sort of message) although movie V is still a clear proponent of the Land of Do-As-You-Please. Just less crazy. I'm not identifying with "V" here (and yes I've read the Graphic Novel many times). I merely was having fun with the numbering of Article V being a form of Walled City vendetta against moi. I'm not, myself, and anarchist. I'm a diehard socialist and tribalist experimenting in communal living in a virtual world.
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Aliasi Stonebender
Return of Catbread
Join date: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 1,858
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06-13-2006 19:56
From: Kendra Bancroft I'm not identifying with "V" here (and yes I've read the Graphic Novel many times).
I merely was having fun with the numbering of Article V being a form of Walled City vendetta against moi.
I'm not, myself, and anarchist. I'm a diehard socialist and tribalist experimenting in communal living in a virtual world. Ah. The V graphic that once graced your sig confused me.
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Red Mary says, softly, “How a man grows aggressive when his enemy displays propriety. He thinks: I will use this good behavior to enforce my advantage over her. Is it any wonder people hold good behavior in such disregard?” Anything Surplus Home to the "Nuke the Crap Out of..." series of games and other stuff
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-13-2006 19:58
From: Aliasi Stonebender Ah. The V graphic that once graced your sig confused me. I work for DC Comics and liked the movie and graphic novel ::  hrug::: Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
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MeiLin Miranda
China Maven
Join date: 10 Feb 2006
Posts: 84
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06-13-2006 21:24
From: Kendra Bancroft I work for DC Comics and liked the movie and graphic novel Really? Matthew Clark is one of my hubby's best friends...
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-13-2006 21:35
From: MeiLin Miranda Really? Matthew Clark is one of my hubby's best friends... neat!!
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Aliasi Stonebender
Return of Catbread
Join date: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 1,858
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06-14-2006 07:01
From: Kendra Bancroft I work for DC Comics and liked the movie and graphic novel ::  hrug::: Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. Fair enough! ... but does that mean I get to gripe at you in any small way for "Superboy punched time"? 
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Red Mary says, softly, “How a man grows aggressive when his enemy displays propriety. He thinks: I will use this good behavior to enforce my advantage over her. Is it any wonder people hold good behavior in such disregard?” Anything Surplus Home to the "Nuke the Crap Out of..." series of games and other stuff
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-14-2006 07:05
From: Aliasi Stonebender Fair enough! ... but does that mean I get to gripe at you in any small way for "Superboy punched time"?  I work in the toy department. You can gripe at if there are flaws in the action figures 
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Karsten Rutledge
Linux User
Join date: 8 Feb 2005
Posts: 841
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06-15-2006 12:46
From: Kendra Bancroft I have just learned that the now Fascist "Walled City" (which erroneously calls itself Neualtenburg) has decided to pursue charges against me at their next Judicial hearing.
Specifically:
Article V: Charges against Kendra Bancroft for violating the constitution by conspiring to prevent the SC from exercising their constitutional prerogative of closing a forum."
While simultaneously spreading lies and defamations about myself and Phase III of the Projekt (Port Neualtenburg) on their own forums, the Rogue Government now attempts to paint me as an "Enemy of The State" and bring charges against me for protecting against their assault of The Neualtenburg Projekt Forum that I founded.
There are two interesting facets about this to discuss:
1) The moment that the "Walled City" moved it's official forums to an off-site, Did they in fact have a right to any say in The Projekt forum --which was being used by the City but not founded by them?
Wow, um, I've heard of petty before, but I think they're going to have to rewrite the dictionary now. What exactly do they hope to accomplish by this, I wonder? Oh well, let them have their pettiness if it makes them happy and keeps them from bothering normal people. From: Kendra Bancroft 2) Is the Government of the "Walled City" effective as an SL organization? They might indeed find me guilty -- but what then? Ban me from a Sim I have no intention to ever visit? (Though I was back recently to help them thru a building crisis out of the kindness of my heart)
I hate to say 'I told you so...', but, um, told you so. 
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-15-2006 13:00
From: Karsten Rutledge Wow, um, I've heard of petty before, but I think they're going to have to rewrite the the dictionary now. What exactly do they hope to accomplish by this, I wonder? Oh well, let them have their pettiness if it makes them happy and keeps them from bothering normal people. I hate to say 'I told you so...', but, um, told you so.  and I'm big enough to admit how wrong I was. Please continue to tell me so 
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Karsten Rutledge
Linux User
Join date: 8 Feb 2005
Posts: 841
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06-15-2006 13:56
From: Kendra Bancroft and I'm big enough to admit how wrong I was. Please continue to tell me so  I'm curious though, didn't you withdraw from the Walled City prior to the forum fiasco? How can you violate a constitution you weren't subscribed too? Sounds a little retarded, honestly. They have to know that the worst they can do is ban you from the sim (I'm sure you'll lose sleep over that.  ) which is pretty much the utmost display of being petty little dictators when you're not causing them any problem (and apparently even helping them). It's a wonder this 'government' lasted as long as it did if this is the mentality of it.
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Dianne Mechanique
Back from the Dead
Join date: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 2,648
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06-15-2006 14:15
IMO this whole thread is yet another travesty of insults from the ex-members of the soon to be renamed City of Neualtenburg.  For those interested in the facts, check here: http://forums.neualtenburg.info/viewtopic.php?t=77That is if the censors don't get to this post before you read it.  You will find that the city is *not* (so far) bringing charges against Kendra, only that someone suggested we should, so we have a duty to look into it. If someone suggests that another member has broken the law we look into it. It doesn't mean that anything will actually happen. It might be a completely spurious request. The process is also completely transparent and every single word said in any SC meeting is posted on the wiki for anyone to read, citizen or not. There is no secret bureaucracy, and no "elite." You will also find replies to Ulrika's accusations describing how she actually misconstrued the meaning of the word "doublespeak". Remember a dictionary can be your friend! 
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Karsten Rutledge
Linux User
Join date: 8 Feb 2005
Posts: 841
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06-15-2006 14:34
From: Dianne Mechanique IMO this whole thread is yet another travesty of insults from the ex-members of the soon to be renamed City of Neualtenburg.  For those interested in the facts, check here: http://forums.neualtenburg.info/viewtopic.php?t=77That is if the censors don't get to this post before you read it.  You will find that the city is *not* (so far) bringing charges against Kendra, only that someone suggested we should, so we have a duty to look into it. If someone suggests that another member has broken the law we look into it. It doesn't mean that anything will actually happen. It might be a completely spurious request. The process is also completely transparent and every single word said in any SC meeting is posted on the wiki for anyone to read, citizen or not. There is no secret bureaucracy, and no "elite." You will also find replies to Ulrika's accusations describing how she actually misconstrued the meaning of the word "doublespeak". Remember a dictionary can be your friend!  Except Kendra isn't a member, and wasn't prior to the forum thing, so how can you bring charges against her?
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-15-2006 15:02
Yes. I agree. Anyone who wishes to see the level of toxicity on your forum need only type the following into the Search engine there: Ulrika Kendra Port Neualtenburg. Or would it be easier if I compiled a "greatest hits" list.? BTW. Here at The Projekt we don't engage in senseless censorship of frree speech.
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Dianne Mechanique
Back from the Dead
Join date: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 2,648
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06-15-2006 15:19
From: Karsten Rutledge Except Kendra isn't a member, and wasn't prior to the forum thing, so how can you bring charges against her? Well that would be one of the big problems in bringing charges against her for sure. It is certainly something I will bring up when the item comes up for review at the next meeting. The last meeting we had where that was an agenda item, it was the only item we did not get to. Even though it was item "V" on a list of "VIII" or "IX" we re-ordered the agenda at the start of the meeting. I assume at the next meeting it will be number "I" for... well I guess I won't go there.  The legal system in the soon to be re-named City of Neualtenburg will hear cases against non-citizens though. Realistically however, other than banning someone from our sim or any sim under our governance, or perhaps denying citizenship or the use of our resources or forums, there is not a heck of a lot we can do. If Kendra was charged, it would be one of those "trials in absentia" things which are sometimes highly irrelevant to the person being charged or tried. On the other hand as the government and the society of the soon to be renamed City of Neualtenburg grows and becomes more accepted in Second Life, the fact that someone would not have access to our schools, our banks, our notaries public and legal system could be seen as a big detriment. Now that the grid is being flooded with lawless alts and other idiots, a lot of folks are looking at sims with some sort of structure as a very desirable thing. The soon to be renamed City of Neualtenburg is already the only place where you can incorporate your business or sign a virtual contract with any hope of enforcing it, who knows what the future brings? 
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-15-2006 15:26
From: Dianne Mechanique The soon to be renamed City of Neualtenburg is already the only place where you can incorporate your business or sign a virtual contract with any hope of enforcing it, who knows what the future brings?  That's not really true ya know.
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-15-2006 15:32
From: Dianne Mechanique If Kendra was charged, it would be one of those "trials in absentia" things which are sometimes highly irrelevant to the person being charged or tried.
On the other hand as the government and the society of the soon to be renamed City of Neualtenburg grows and becomes more accepted in Second Life, the fact that someone would not have access to our schools, our banks, our notaries public and legal system could be seen as a big detriment.
In other words, I would be facing this big "detriment" without even being allowed to be present at my own trial.
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Dianne Mechanique
Back from the Dead
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06-15-2006 15:35
From: Kendra Bancroft Yes. I agree. Anyone who wishes to see the level of toxicity on your forum .... Come on, how can we be boring and toxic at the same time? Sorry about the censorship, I thought it was clear I was joking. 
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Dianne Mechanique
Back from the Dead
Join date: 28 Mar 2005
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06-15-2006 15:40
From: Kendra Bancroft In other words, I would be facing this big "detriment" without even being allowed to be present at my own trial. Well you could be present, I was assuming you wouldn't want to. My personal hope anyway is that we spend less time in the future worrying about the past and more effort working on making less work for ourselves. 
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
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06-15-2006 16:00
From: Dianne Mechanique Well you could be present, I was assuming you wouldn't want to. My personal hope anyway is that we spend less time in the future worrying about the past and more effort working on making less work for ourselves.  at present, The Walled City is bringing me up on charges for something they claim I did in the past and they believe will somehow affect my future. Meanwhile, I'm holding Chicken Racer Bumper Car events (next one on Saturday Jume 17th at 8pm SLT) in our new "Cluck Off" sporting arena, and having a marvelous time If you folks wanna move on --please do so. I already have.
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