SL, Paypal and online banking

e mail recieved...

"Dear Incony Hathaway,

This email is notification that we were unable to bill your Second Life account on February 28, 2008. Please review your Second Life membership and billing information, and make sure everything is up-to-date........
Don't worry; this billing failure will not prevent you from logging on with your Second Life account. We will simply try to bill your overdue balance again the next day. If we are unable to collect the amount due within seven (7) days, your account will be suspended pending payment for an additional thirty (30) days."



Paypal say on their website when i try to make payment direct from my valid and verified bank account:

"
This recipient accepts PayPal payments only through their website. To complete this payment, please go to their website and follow their instructions, or email the recipient for instructions.

Some information is incorrect or missing. Please correct your entries and try again."

The website? SL lets play ping pong all day, hey? ive just been to the website, and had this conversation with support...

Shaun: Hello Incony_Hathaway, what can I help you with?

Incony_Hathaway: my account has not been billed.. for some reason i`m noy aware ofg.

Incony_Hathaway: damn.. typing sorry.

Shaun: OK I will just take a look at your account

Shaun: The error we are receiving is that your transaction would exceed your paypal monthly limit

Incony_Hathaway: is that because i recently made an auction success.. i guess that is the reason..
it was done via paypal i think... what should i do.. will it go in March ok next week?

Incony_Hathaway: else can i pay direct via online banking instead?

Shaun: Im not sure how paypals limits work, you would have to check with them

Incony_Hathaway: can i pay direct using online banking... like i can for all my bills?

Incony_Hathaway: else maybe its time i said sod it, closed the account and send a copy of this converstion to mr linden..
too much hard work for nothing.

Shaun: You could add a credit card to your account but
we are currently experiencing problems with credit cards at the moment

Shaun: You can contact paypal and ask them how you would go about raising your limit

Incony_Hathaway: ill think about it.. its just not worth the hassle.. even giving up the quarter sim..
that would cost me over two hundred uk pounds.. but i would get that back in a year not paying SL...
imagine my bank did this kinda stuff.. they would soon go out of business. nothing personal.. you understand..
im just really pissed off.

Shaun: It is not an error with us, but with paypal

Shaun: You will need to contact Paypal to get your limit increased or to ask them how the limits work

Incony_Hathaway: ok.. your loss SL not mine.. if you close the account..
im an engineer on call.. its probable i cant do this within seven days.. i cant say...
what a way to go...something that worked fine for over a year killed in seven days..

Shaun: Well like i have mentioned it is a problem with Paypal, not Second Life


the phone number paypal give .. 08707 307 191 doesnt work..

ive emailed them...ive yet to get a reply..

if i try to make a credit to my paypal account, direct from my bank account so i can make a payment that way, the process time is listed by paypal as 7 to 9 days, if it takes seven days or more, my account goes on hold SL says.. and in any case ive got no secondlife info to make that payment to..

what do i do now..? i cant pay because secondlife and paypal dont meet somewhere, i cant change that easily.. i cant pay SL directly.. the info e mail in paypal " lists @ secondlife isnt valid, so because of that.. do i have to make an international call from the uk.. laughs.. Sl isnt being my best friend right now..

to get to this point has taken me over three hours... Mr linden.. are you going to fund this time of mine...? its precious to me.. i only get it once...

bearing in mind ive just paid you 70000 lindens for 1024 sq metres of land..
any suggestions please?

So either get paypal to increase your limit or add a credit card for the Lindens to charge directly..

What's the big deal? No need to be that rude to the support person.

i wont subscribe to your remark.."What's the big deal? No need to be that rude to the support person."

i made it clear it wasnt anything personal.. i want to pay sl.. sl makes that difficult not easy.. paypal and sl are not integral.. paypal have an issue that sl give no prior warning of.. they just tell one its an sl paypal problem.. sl did not give me any warning.. unless you accept the email as the warning at time of issue.. the payment cant be made.. i am not a paypal expert.. the method on account sign up should be made clear to avoid this problem..

given that i had just made considerable payment on demand... i have an issue that angers me with the way sl works that i think needs sorting.. i asked if i could pay by online banking, support gave me no indication i could or could not.. and said it wasnt an sl but paypal problem.. paypal wont let me pay sl direct, they say the info isnt valid.. that sl give..

ive no issue with shaun... i told him so.. but shaun represents sl.. sl is where i have an issue..

Yeah.. That sucks and is unfair.

Well, except for this bit:

The billing problem he mentions is in the LL blog and was only having issues for about an hour this morning.

example: your car is at time for testing... you have a garage service, they maintain your car... keep it running... its legal.. ready to go on demand... last month they cost you 70000 units... you paid on demand.. no problem ...

today you get a message from the garage." sorry, unless you solve a payment problem.. we will make your car illegal and unroadworthy until we recieve payment, we could not recieve payment.. we know this is a booked and recognised payment you make.. still we cant recieve it...


you talk to the garage .. say.. whats the problem.. its a payment i make every month.. how come you havent got it.. i dont understand.. can i give it to you right now? give me the info.. i want to pay you now...


the garage says... "sorry its not our problem but a branch in the service that we acknowledge and use... has the problem not us ...its not our problem but theirs.. you have to talk to them... else in seven days.. you cant use your car.. no payment.. car off road.."

one asks the garage.. can i pay you now? what is required? the garage doesnt even recognise that question, offers no reply...


you contact the branch... try to make a payment to the garage thru the branch.. the branch says it doesnt recognize the garage....


you cant make payment to the garage... the branch wont let you... the garage has no info you can use to make payment.. even though you have spoken direct with a garage representative and asked..

your car is off the road in seven days unless you pay the garage... the garage is over three thousand miles away.. you have no direction.. no doors to open.. even though, until that point you were unaware that any problem existed..


i am angry that anyone should reach that point..

You increase your own PayPal billing limit. Log in, go to Profile, then Pay List (center column). Click the merchant link for Linden Research and you should see another link about three-quarters of the way down which says 'Edit Billing Limit.' Click that, change the limit and save.

my billing limit was 250 dollars.. for february the demand was 246 dollars.. i raised the limit to 300 dollars.. still no solution.. the amount was not paid..

today i was advised by customer service at SL:

Greetings,

I've looked over your account, and it appears that your billing agreement may not be set up correctly. Here are some steps that you can take to try and fix it:

1) Log in to your Paypal account.

2) On the account summary page underneath where it states your name and email address it should say Status and "Verified". If it says Unverified, please verify account before continuing. (Please note that for international residents, the requirement for Verified status may vary, however in order to do business with Linden Lab, you need to be verified to US standards, which does include having a Credit Card on file with Paypal and having a Verified Shipping Address.) If it says verified, and you meet the previous criteria, continue to next step.

3) Click on 'Profile'.

4) Click on 'Pay List' which is found at the bottom of the list entitled 'Financial Information'.

5) Cancel all current Linden Research Billing Agreements. You can do this by clicking on each agreement and selecting 'Cancel'. If you have no Linden Research Billing Agreements listed, skip this step.

6) Next, go to the Second Life Update Payment Method Page, which is located on the right hand side of your account summary page, on the Second Life Website.

7) Log back in to your Paypal account. Agree to the terms and conditions of the Billing Agreement and click on "Continue". This will take you to a page that should say "Your Billing Agreement Has Been Created".

To Verify that your billing agreement is configured properly, return to your 'Profile' page of your Paypal Account, and then the Pay List link. There should only be one active Billing agreement now.

9) Designate a secondary funding source. Paypal will always use your balance as the primary funding source, but in order for your Paypal agreement with us to work, you will need to specify a back up, even if it is never used. You can do that by clicking on the Billing Agreement and clicking on 'change' next to where it says 'Secondary Funding Source'. Please note that you must designate an instant transfer enabled Bank Account as a funding source. Credit Cards will generally silently fail, and if your Bank account is not Instant Transfer enabled, it will also silently fail. (Lack of a credit card on file is generally the reason why a Bank Account would not be instant transfer enabled, and so that is why a Credit Card is necessary.)

10) Select 'Ok'

That should be it - you can then return to your Second Life Account and try your transaction again. If for any reason following these exact steps fail you, you may need to contact Paypal to verify that your account is configured properly.

Best regards

Aaron

Linden Lab Support

SO:

i closed all paypal accounts with SL followed Aarons advice..

it solves the immediate problem.. but.. and for me this is the problem still, i wont let it go, until SL give me a solution or compromise.. the fault wasnt mine.. its between SL and Paypal

"Ticket has been reopened

Comment(s): So please can you explain to me how, for over a year, ive been paying you every month..if my paypal account was not set up correctly..? it was verified. it uses my primary bank account as source.. i would rather pay you direct.. using my bank, set up a standing order... i asked support if i could do that.. i got no reply.. i ask again, can i set up a standing order using my bank to pay SL? regards Incony "

i am not creating an obstacle... the problem wasnt something i was aware of.. i had no indication there was a problem.. even though during the last year i had changed my primary source details.. because my current bank account details had changed with the issue of a new visa card from Barclays... my bank.


suddenly.. without notice.. SL wont accept payment for something they had been accepting for over a year..

the options given at that time did not allow me to solve the problem..

The solution given by Aaron required me to close and reopen a billing method.. even though i was unaware of any previous problem.. Paypal have still not replied to my e mail..

ive no grief here with anyone.. just that the method SL uses Sucks.. its full of holes and dead ends.. It took a day to get a solution from Aaron.. why cant that method be made more apparent.? whjat does one have to do to get a solution? how many doors does one have to knock on for that"? why at all? SL is an engine that deserves better scope than it is getting..

the solution is found...next time one cant pay sl using paypal.. close all accounts and reopen them.. if you think that is an obvious solution.. i bow to you.. lead the way..

Wow.. It was working all that time then stopped without anything having changed? That's harsh..

I have to agree, it's ridiculously complicated and the requirements are obtuse; apparently you MUST have a bank account AND a credit card AND a verified street address (how do they verify this anyway?) with all of those items attached to your paypal account, in order to pay SL?

Still, the reason it worked for a year and then stopped is easy to guess. It's their fraud prevention system kicking in. For a while it was lenient with certain types of paypal accounts that were set up a certain way such as yours, and then there was fraud from that type of account and they got stricter.

You shoulda known your monthly limit but yea.. my advice is dont pay premium dont pay "tier" and "buy" land from LL simply downgrade to a regular account and rent any land you need from a reputable Landlord or Landlady.
The simple fact is tier is rent and owning land in SL is a fiction in fact the consequences are worse for not paying tier and prem to LL than they are for not paying a landowner in SL kinda crazy but true.

A sad fact of life i guess, but i thank you for the responses, i dont feel so alone now..

there certainly have been moments when ive considered its not worth pursuing solutions and just letting SL go.. but i like its 3D capability.. it has so much going for the conception... its what holds the anchor right now..and me clinging to it with one arm..its stretching, SL.. do you really want me to hold on or let go... ive one life... do you really want to share it?

Today i repursued the reopened ticket.. in a month ive yet to get any reply, or comment to the reopened request...