A Living Wage In SL

a phrase that keeps popping up recently, used by someone with Quixotic delusions about certain areas of Second Life, has gotten me wondering. how easy is it to make a "living wage" from Second Life. i don't mean covering tier or enough to shop about the grid. i mean paying RL rent/house payment, food, clothing, cinema etc. what is the percentage of people that are vs. people that put more money in than out. large multiple sim estate owners and running a shop like Bare Rose etc, i can picture it, but, really, just how possible is it?

I think if you were one of the early front runners, you had a better chance - not so much now. And, from the comments I hear, you have better be willing to put in a ton of work hours for it.

Plus, I think it depends where one lives in the world. I have a friend who makes a living wage in the country where *she* lives from SL. She still works VERY hard in SL, but what constitutes a "living wage" in her country is a lot different than in other countries.

i had debated the different costs of living accross the world, but that could have made for an enormous post should i have categorized... i also left out the possibilities of the various scams run by the grifters who keep finding new techniques, have been exposed for being the low lifes they are, yet people still line up tp trust them and give them still more L$. IMHO, i feel there may be a new con being developed by someone looking for a way to game the system (as opposed to gaming the game). i haven't figured out their angle yet, but when someone is wanting to do something for "the betterment of others" no matter what the cost to anyone (duplicity at its finest), and then infers possibilities of profit from doing so, my suspicions immediately become piqued.

It's not just the money. Keep in mind that LL may change an aspect of SL, e.g. the tier pricing structure or search capabilities or what constitutes adult content at a moment's notice which may deprive an SL entrepreneur of her livelihood.

IMHO, this is no place to build an existence on. As an add-on, yes. But not as a sole source of income.

to true. and, if it became one's sole source of income, it wouldn't really be a Second Life anymore, but more of a First Life (meaning not quite Real Life, but very, very life consuming).

Virtually impossible, unless your idea of a "Living Wage" is far below the poverty line in most developed countries of the world.

There are a VERY few individuals in SL who actually manage to cash out $2000 USD or more a month in SL, out of MILLIONS of accounts. Those few people who "make a living wage" either work extremely hard, or were first to grab a specific niche market and make an unassailable name there, or invest huge amounts of real money for slim margins in land speculation and other risky deals, or have incredible talent and drive in their chosen area. Or all of the above!

You have better odds of making yourself a star in Hollywood than of making a living wage in SL. And I can almost guarantee that per hour spent, you'll have to work much harder in SL to make the same amount of money than you would in the real world.

And this is coming from one of the small number of content providers in Sl who actually DOES cash out at least some money every month!

In order to even THINK about earning a living wage in SL, you need to have the following:

1) High end skills in the creative arts - Photoshop/Maya or animation AND access to a motion capture suit.

2) Enough start up cash to cover your land needs during start up and/or seed money for sim purchases.

3) Exceptional business skills - you are, for all practical purposes, starting a business and all the RL business rules apply. You can be the most talented and creative person in SL, but without business management skills you will never go beyond covering tier.

4) Marketing skills. Traffic bots are not marketing skills. Marketing is how your reach the people who are going to spend money and includes advertising, promotions, signage, product placement, understanding how Search works, etc...


In other words, you need to be a true entrepreneur if you are going to consider attempting to turn SL into a job.

Totally Agree!

SL was GREAT when I had a crap job & made very little in RL. It was the "extra" that helped me through.

Now that I've been working & make a livable wage in RL, SL is just a "hobby" that pays for itself

Making a living wage can still be done in SL, but how long it will last is another matter. Someone already pointed out how things can change very quickly due to LL decisions. For most people, the idea of a living wage includes it lasting for some years but, imo, SL isn't yet reliable for that.

Is it possible?

Definately yes! There are many examples of people in SL that make more than enough for living expenses. I have met quite a few myself.

How possible?

Well that is a question yet to be decided by actions and events that have yet to occur
between you and your requirements.

But Isablan hit the nail on the head in her post.

You definately need skills and most importantly commitment to your project to make any
significant amounts of money in SL.

If a person who is unfamiliar with SL is considering it as a primary income, I think this would be a very unrealistic expectation.

However if you grow your knowledge and creative and business skills through active participation in the experience of starting and growing a small business then you will
minimize any potential loss.

Then when you get to that magic number of it handling living expenses I think you will know.

Dont quit your day job until it costs more to Go there than working in SL.

After all part of the beauty of the virtual platform is that it does not require
attendance at all times.

The other day I was wearing a blue dress I made some time ago. Several people said how nice the dress was without any prompting from me. That same dress has been on sale in my shop for months for only L$25 and not one has sold! Near the dress is a barrel of my freebies that goes like hot cakes.

The biggest price hurdle in the SL marketplace is that jump from 0L$ to 1L$!

Having said that, some people do make a real living from SL, so it is possible. But it's a bit like RL artists and musicians - lots of people can draw and paint or play a musical instrument well, but very few of them are able to make a living from those talents.

It's like there's probably a niche in the entertainment world for one professional who can do novelty neck-tie tying as an on-stage act. But there would be no room for a second one!

I thought about this when I first started playing, back when there were still quite a few niches that could be exploited. What I decided tho, was that Phil could decide to pull the plug any time, and if SL was my main source of income--where would I be then?

The original sex beds still sell better than anything coming out of the furniture stores with better animations and lower prices. The guy making all those slow dances still sells more animations and poses better than (arguably) better new animators. They've got the name.

Since I made the decision that SL is a game and not a business, I've seen the Lindens destroy the gambling business, the banks, (granted, these were largely scams.) put on a tax collector hat that made life difficult for European players, kill markups on the mainland market. Play pricing games with estate land products, and now it seems they're intent on shaking up any business related to sex. AND they're looking into imposing memory limitations on avatars and land now. That ought to break a few AO's and multi gadget tools.

Speaking of sex. . .SL content is like sex. Sure you can pay for it--but there's always someone around willing to give it away for free. The things I make are better than most of the stuff I bought when I started out. And you can find good free stuff all over the grid no matter WHAT you want.

I don't see a living wage coming out of SL for most people. And the folks who are lucky enough to be able to do it now better have a bolt hole for the coming hard times.

There are people who do make a living wage in SL, I know a few. But out of the ones I know personally, not one is using SL as their sole income source for their household.

I think people like myself are more common. SL income makes for a "nice to have" at the end of the month. Without discussing particulars, I can say that we'd survive without it, but it really does help pay the bills.

So, what is the "secret"? Isn't one, I'm afraid. Be lucky enough to make or provide something people like, that's different enough from what's already out there. Understand that the hour/wage ratio is not going to be anything close to what you would make at a similar job in RL--but on the other hand, in SL you get far more creative control, and you can do the work in your bathrobe with your fuzzy pet of choice sitting on your feet.

If you were going to create in SL anyway, you enjoy the time spent online, and you don't rely on the income, then you'll be fine. Even if all you do is make enough for tier and a weekly dinner out, you'll have had fun.

But if you find it drudgery, then go find drudgery that pays better

Precisely!

I get to make a little extra money, which allows my family to have a few extra luxuries once in a while, like a dinner out at a "nicer than we can usually afford" restaurant. And I can do the work in the comfort of my home, with my dog at my feet, while wearing my bathrobe or comfy clothes and my bedroom slippers. And I can still keep an eye on my daughter to make sure she does her Violin practice and finishes her homework on time.

I like to build, and I like making textures. I can do it well enough to cover my in-world expenses and get a little cash out each month. If I wasn't building and selling stuff in SL, I wouldn't have the land I live on now, or a place to put up all kinds of fun stuff for my friends and their guests to enjoy. I probably wouldn't have a "Home" in SL at all, and would be spending about 1 percent of what I do now on clothes, toys and other stuff.

Of course, Linden Lab advertises heavily on the notion that you can make real money in Second Life. That's why so many people come here with pie-in-the-sky ideas that they are able.

I don't doubt that it is possible to make a living wage purely within Second Life. However, what you need to do to make it happen would be about the same things you'd need to do in real life when starting up your own business. You need to plan ahead. You actually need to lay out up-front money, to buy the tools you need, and to buy advertising. You need to be willing, and able, to devote full-time effort to your business for a while before you can actually make profit.

You can't expect to devote zero money up-front, keep your day job, and have a living wage roll in on day one.

Now, the problem with Second Life is that it is so unstable, and Linden Lab is so unreliable, I think you are a fool to make that investment of time and money- a huge risk- on Second Life. If you have the time and money to invest in your own business, you are better off doing it somewhere else.

Another problem with Second Life business is that, in most cases, it's impractical to run a business all by yourself. You need people. And the anonymous nature of Second Life doesn't make it easy to hook up with people you can trust.

The other problem is that in Second Life, it is far easier to make money with scams than with honest work. If you have no problem cheating people out of their money, you have an easier road to your living wage.

But the one thing you can't do is expect to make your living wage without up-front investment of money and time. That is where the residents with dollar signs in their eyes fail. The people who do make living wage money on Second Life- and I don't actually know any, so I'm guessing- but I bet they had to take risks on time and money investments up front. And then they had to get lucky that Linden Lab doesn't screw them out of their hard-earned revenues. And I would love to compare the number of Second Life financial success stories with the number of people starting their Second Life business with a great business plan, with appropriate up-front investment of time and money, and seeing it all flushed away to no good end.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlgsfLkAUVg

This was what happened to me.

congrachewlayshuns on your emancipayshun.

I think that if you were to attempt something like this you should first pitch the idea to a reality tv producer. They could chronicle your whole adventure from rags to riches. Then write a book about the whole experience.

it was my yellow dress that liberated you, wasn't it.
even the impossible dream can be a reality in second life. secret dungeons are very romantic, aren't they? LOL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qq1py7BQGo&feature=related

well, truly, i have know such belief that i'm destined to be making a living from SL. not why i came here, anyway. actually, i was just passing through to see what SL was about, and wound up staying. didn't even know there was so much of an economy within as i'm an example of someone who had never even heard of Second Life until a short time minutes to hours short) before i fitst logged in.
highly doubtful i'll even so much as open a store since i find myself continually building. that doesn't mean i don't HAVE a store. i have a near entire shopping type area that just sits there empty. like i said, i build, so i built it. and tons of unfinished, finished, and limited finished product in my inventory. if i find that i'm still around, or SL for that matter, there may come a time where i actually finish things, stock them in, and open the shops. if it pull in a couple of L$, fine, if none, fine. i didn't come here expecting to reverse my money flow

i came to build

and, perhaps

to eventually finish the ones i start

Earning a RL wage in SL is a long shot at best. Sure it's still possible, with a vast amount of talent, a whole lot of dedication and a healthy dose of luck. But you're going to have to come up with your own way of doing it, because if it was easy, then everyone would be doing it!

Also, bear in mind that SL is a very volatile platform. It is governed by LL who can make changes at the drop of a hat that could affect any sort of business and you have no recourse to reclaim lost income.

So if that loss is a risk that you can tolerate, and you can find your niche and have the time on your hands, go for it, and hope that some luck comes your way too.

Otherwise, I would look for a job in RL....