Land - couple of questions

Okay, I've read through a few of the threads in the forum. Now I am very confused.

Atm I am on a basic account. I was thinking about upgrading to a premium one. The thing is that I would like to buy some land. I don't want to spend too much money as I am in england and the conversion is too confusing even without all of the extra fees I would have to pay. Plus I am not sure how much I can afford.
The whole thing just confuses me. I know that on a premium account you get a 512 allowance and a weekly stipend.
The land allowance - how exactly does this work. Is it like a bonus land usage? can i own a 1024 plot but pay for only 512 land usage or something? also what about renting land? how does that work? Which in your opinion is easier? Are there any tips you could give me as I need as many prims as possible so I can create my items on my land.
I want to be absolutely sure what I can expect to pay so are there any extra charges etc that I would need to know about?
I am not so bothered about location etc for the moment.
I think I have the very basics but I just need it spelling out simply for me.
I am such a noob lol.

thanks xxcsxx

I'm sending you a couple of documents in world on notecards. Please feel free to contact me for further information.

Char

Phew, that's a lot of questions. So let's give it a try:

1) You do not have to go premium to rent land. Only if you buy mainland.

2) I won't confuse you further with mainland vs. estate land ... let's just consider mainland for the moment.

3) If you go premium you (i) get a weekly L$ 300 stipend and (ii) get 512 sq of free tier which allows you to own that much land without paying anything in addition.

4) If you own more than 512 sq, you pay monthly tier. Details here: http://secondlife.com/whatis/landpricing.php

5) 512 sq of land give you 117 prims. Bigger parcels give you more. The formula is prims=size*15000/65536

6) Consider joining the "SL Land Answers Unlimited" group for in-world help with land by expert volunteers.

7) In the long run, the land purchase price does not matter a whole lot in determining what you can afford. It's mainly monthly tier which makes the difference. Determine for yourself how much money you want to spend on SL per month and adapt your tier accordingly.

Hope that helps.

LOL

Ricky spelled it out better than I could and types faster.

GOOD LUCK!

Thank you so much Unfortunately my home broadband is not working so am using a friends computer. I cannot get in world for a couple of weeks as you can imagine I am going a bit mad lol. I can't help it, I'm addicted!

LOL. I can imagine. Feel free to use a private msg to send me an email addy and I can email the same info I quite understand if you don't want to 'go there' tho

Char

Charlene, I just wanted to thank you for being so very helpful. I especially thank you for helping me 'hands on' when i was just learning the ropes. I am still not allowed to open scripts.

wow! thanks! that great. I just have to get my head around the conversions lol

To clarify a few points:

If you were to buy 1024SM of land it would support 234 prims.

You have to buy the land but you do not have to pay tier on the first 512 SM of land.

You will have to pay tier on the second 512 SM of land at US$8.00/ month.


The tier costs decrease in $/SM as you own more land, as explained on this web page.

https://secure-web12.secondlife.com/account/landfees.php


The cost of a premium account, as explained here
https://secure-web12.secondlife.com/account/membership.php

is US$9.95/month if you pay monthly

but only US$6/month if you pay annually.

Thanks. That makes it clearer. So I could upgrade to a premium account for just under $10 a month, buy 1024sm of land for the buy price (however much that is) and pay a monthly fee (tier) for 512sm and get 512sm worth of tier free.
For that I would get 300L$ a week, use of my land, and 234 prims to use.
My monthly bill if I bought 1024sm from LL would be:
$10 - premum account
$5 - Land tier

I think that would work out at something like £7 a month for me not including VAT. obviously that is not including any L$ i would need to buy the land in the first place.

Or I could always but 512sm and not bother about tier fees atall but thats a low prim allowance really if I want to build.

Thats not bad. I will definitly think about it. I will have to wait until i get back in world but it sounds like something I would be able to do now I have my head around it properly.

Thanks for the help. I got a bit confuzzled with all the numbers and conversions etc.
(I would put an embarrassed face but I forgot the shortcut and can't find it lol)

I think Ricky did you something of a diservice to gloss over Estate rentals. They often work out cheaper than renting mainland from LL or other 3rd parties. But I'm a bit too tired to argue the point today.

Claire, I am selling a dandy of a home on the mainland that you'll be sure to love. It's a 512 parcel so once you get your premium account, there would be no tier on it (if you haven't already bought something else). This is beachfront land--such a pretty view (not common on the mainland--there is no junk or clutter here), and you can do all kinds of waterssports out there.

I built the house myself and it takes up only 4 PRIMS! That's so important on a 512, as many other houses would take up much more space than that and not leave much room for furniture. Additionally, the design allows for a large floorplan with four large rooms PLUS open garden space outdoors.

Please take a look. Search on Coverdale on your map and look for the stone and glass house down on the beach. Please consider all the value presented here. The house and land are priced a bit higher than other parcels, but the design of the home, low prim use, beachfront location--all this presents incredible value--all on a 512 parcel that you won't have tier payment on your premium account!

IM me in-world if you have any questions.

No argument there, Darien! I'm myself renting an Estate sim nowadays after I got rid of my mainland holdings.

I just didn't want to add to the confusion. Try to explain the concept of renting mainland vs. "buying" Estate land vs. buying mainland to a newbie.

After all, it's easy to dump mainland whenever you like, so this decision can be made at any time later.

True enough. Land is a very complex and apparently emotionas subject in SL. When you think about it, it's already a complex subject in Real Life, but with the additional options afforded by a synthetic world, it's just that much more complex. Sometimes more choices is a bad thing

That sounds really nice teejay, but atm am not in a position to actually buy. I am offline for a couple of weeks and can't get in world. This is going to seriously delay any possibility of buying right this minute. Plus I want to think about it for a little bit before I commit to anything. I want to make sure I completely understand everything.
I must admit though, this has seriously tempted me, it sounds like a fantastic deal!

I've never owned land (or rented) privately in RL or SL so I'm glad the information was put so simply. Its helped me to understand. I think if we went into estate rentals i would get very confused very fast. That may be a subject for another thread maybe when I have been n SL a bit longer.
Or I may even eventually figure out how to use the search facility lol and find out myself. I understand that land has been discussed a LOT, but trying to filter out a simplistic explanation from all the info the search box brought up was just confusing me even more. It was just easier to ask hehe.

I do think Estate land probably needs to be explained here, because for someone starting out it has the potential of being a good option compared to Mainland. And this is from someone who's never owned anything but Mainland.

When you get around to shopping for land, you'll probably use Search | Land Sales in-world. This tool has a drop-down selection box that lets you hunt only for Mainland, only for Estates, or for both. As described in other posts, Mainland properties have a kind of monthly tax, or "tier" that must be paid to Linden Lab directly by you; Estates, however, remain the property of the Estate owner, who "sells" parcels to the public. The Estate owner still has to pay a fee to Linden Lab each month, so will charge something to the folks who "buy" parcels on the Estate to recover that fee. There's all manner of confusing and "creative" language to describe the costs associated with having an Estate parcel, but it amounts to an up-front cost (the "sale" price) and regular (monthly or weekly) fees.

Another important difference is the existence of "Covenants" for Estate parcels. Here the Estate owner describes the expectations for how the land is to be used and the "rights" of the parcel holders. This may have the appearance of a legal document, but it's not: there's no enforcement whatsoever, just whatever the Estate manager decides to do. So, while it's reassuring to see in a Covenant that the parcel holder has the right to resell, there's just nothing to prevent the Estate owner from just booting you off the land for any or no reason at any time--or simply disappearing from SL altogether--and then you'd have nothing to resell.

Hence, when selecting Estate property, it's just crucial to choose it from a reputable Estate owner, or to recognize the risks associated with Estates that don't have such a proven track record. (Note that having been an Estate owner for a long time does not equal a good reputation; witness She of the Spinning Ads who charges too much up-front, too much monthly, and habitually just kicks folks off their parcels in order to be able to sell them again; lucky for her, there's one born every minute.)

Now, after all these cautions, why consider Estate land for starting out? Well, mostly, because it saves the cost of upgrading to Premium. Indeed, with the stipend and the 512 bonus land, Premium is a bargain--but it's especially a bargain when one is ready to commit to a year-long membership. One can always change one's billing plan from monthly to quarterly or yearly, but the longer terms represent a quite substantial savings, so I'd be inclined to wait till I was sure I wanted that year-long term, and in the meantime "practice" on a good Estate, knowing that the land could just vanish overnight.

There's also mainland rentals to consider, which offer much the same flexibility as Estates, but without up-front fees or the ability to resell the land. I'll recuse myself from describing that option further, since I rent out a few parcels myself.

Actually I've been looking for a small waterfront place and if it's beach that would be great, I'd be interested in it. I don't mind paying a bit more, I've looked at plenty of lots that were piled high with junk and for sale signs on all sides. I'll take a look at it when I get home from work.

Thanks everyone for the input! This post was extremely informative!
Qie-


Can you explain or give an example of Estate fees? I think I've been confusing estate fees with tiers mentioned at http://secondlife.com/whatis/landpricing.php . ..but it sounds like Estate owners are charging their own fees to recover their costs?

yep.. estate owners set their own fees for everything. Initial cost is set by them, rent is set by them... everything. You might not get as good a deal on rent or initial coast on an Island, however you don't have to deal with the premium membership fee, so it kinda balances out.

The main problem with Estates (As always) is that they can choose to kick your out whenever.. even right after you pay your next 6 months rent.. and I don't think LL will protect you even then.

I believe you can cut your costs some by paying for a year of premium at once, for a total of 72 dollars.

There's some info at land-answers.wiki.zoho.com .

Wow! thanks Qie. Still not sure what road I want to go down yet. I like the idea of Estate land first before getting premium membership and buying mainland. I would definitely have to look around though because I have heard some really bad stories about estate land. I know these are the worst examples and not the norm but it does put me off a bit i have to admit. but then there are horror stories about everything.


A year's premium membership does sound very good and looks like a good deal. But I have a habit of starting things and not finishing so I would have to make sure I am not going to skip out on second life before i commit. I am sure i wont because i love second life but i want to give myself chance to fully experience it as I haven't been in for long.