VOICE/SIDETONE .. The "can't hear yourself" issue

I've just thrown away money buying a USB headset (one highlighted by Second Life as suitable) which does NOT provide "sidetone." Which means you cannot hear yourself in your own headset.

Why do you want that?

BECAUSE it lets you hear problems with your microphone placement / volume etc. It's like when vocalists record or perform, they have headsets that let them hear themselves. It's what the stupid ol' Ma Bell knew long ago.

NOTE: I am NOT talking about "echo" -- a delayed copy of what you're saying. That will drive you insane. lol

ALSO NOTE: This is NOT something that Second Life should handle -- the sidetone should be provided by the headset. WHAT IS Second Life's problem -- is that they are recommending headsets that do NOT provide sidetone. AND not mentioning this as an issue for voice chat.

Now, I understand I will probably get responses like: "I don't want to hear myself." Perhaps you don't care if you are speaking too loud, or making popping noises, or loud breath noises ... but many people do care. AND they like the intimate feeling of hearing their own voice lightly in the headset .. like all phone calls used to be... before VOIP -- where the tech designers are IGNORANT (or penny-pinching) of a LONG-UNDERSTOOD issue in voice communication.

QUESTION FOR ALL: If you have found a USB headset that DOES provide "sidetone" please tell me here.

i got a 10 dollar wallmart head set and it works perfect

you can set the side tone thing in the windows volume settings thing

i found that out when i 1st installed my headset and i went to turned it off

the headset advertised on secondlife.com is like 50 or 60 bucks! why would any headset cost that much!

Thanks for the reply.

I suspect your headset plugs right into the mic and ear inputs. (Am I right?)

I think the problem is with USB headsets ... with relatively slow digital signal processing chips -- by the time the digital signal gets into the computer it is already too late to create "sidetone" (hear yourself) ... without an ECHO.

For a USB headset to solve this problem, it must have "sidetone" fed back to the headset BEFORE it goes through the digital signal processor (on mine, a block on the cord).

NOTE: I'm running Windows XP home edition. USB Headset is Plantronics DSP 500

check your soundcard for a loopback function.
if that fails im pretty sure you can achieve the same thing adjusting the mic playback levels in the windows audio panels (mic may be muted playback).

Thanks, Nina ...

My Toshiba laptop does not have a sound card, it's built into the chipset.

And I also Googled the problem, and someone at Yahoo answers ... responded that
no, there was no way to get sidetone when using the kind of Plantronics USB headset
I'm using. (Which is the one that is featured on the Second Life site.)

NOTE: Windows XP
And I've also checked every possible control panel for sound, and there seems
to be nothing about the mic being muted.

Again, I think the issue is with USB headsets which do their own analogue to
digital conversion and noise cancellation. They would have to include
a sidetone feedback loop BEFORE the sound gets digitized (or have much
faster chips).

QUESTION: Is anyone using the Plantronics DSP 500 USB headset, and
found a way to hear themselves? (I'm pretty sure the answer is no.)

I've had many many headsets, none of which had a feature called, "sidetone."

I don't think you need it. If you want to test the mic, use WINDOWS--there are ways to test levels--at least I'm pretty sure there are.

If you're THAT concerned about how your mic is working, or how you sound...download a free music/sound application like Audacity, and test it that way.

Audacity is a small, very useful sound application. I actually do multi-track recordings with it all the time. I also record my sound for SL using it. The downside is it lacks Fx.

Thanks, Michael

But the issue is not testing the mic level -- I can do that -- but the only way I hear myself is with a delayed recorded sound.

The issue is hearing yourself WHILE you are talking (like on the telephone -- or when in the recording studio). If you ever tried to sing on stage without a monitor circuit you know what I'm talking about.

AND THE PROBLEM apparently is NOT with headsets that plug into a soundcard or the analog inputs on the computer -- it is specifically with USB headsets that, duh, plug into a free USB port.

What goes into a USB port ... must already be digital. Already processed from analog to digital (and perhaps other processing).

If I had a cheap $10 headset that plugged right into the analog input ports, I suspect I'd have no problem.

BUT ... Second Life highlights the Plantronics DSP 500 on this website ... A USB headset ... which does NOT allow you to hear yourself (apparently) no matter what you do.

Why is this a problem? Cover both your ears with your hands and talk. What does that sound like? That's what you've got when you use the "recommended" headset.

The old telphone company understood the issue. The new VOIP companies often don't.

BOTTOM LINE: If you are using a USB headset for Second Life -- unless the manufacturer has included a "sidetone" feature -- you CANNOT HEAR YOUR OWN VOICE in your USB headset. And this is BAD. (And Second Life should NOT be featuring a USB headset for use with Second Life that does not have this feature.)

NOTE: Here's the question and brief answer on Yahoo Answers.

"Is it possible to get sidetone on a Plantronics USB headset? Thanks.?"
http://sg.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=1006051115682

I haven't gotten around to looking for a headset yet and I want to thank you for bringing this up before I do. I know exactly what you are talking about and when I do start talking in SL I too will want to be able to to hear what I sound like.

i've never heard of 'sidetone'. this is just loopback, yeah?
if you look in the playback bit of windows audio mic should be listed there (if not it can be enabled). if it is muted or turned down this will affect the recording loopback volume from a mic plugged in in the conventional sense. ive never used a usb mic as they are too laggy for my purposes, but they may work the same. then again the headset may have an audio interface of its own.

Thanks Kaimi ... Yes, I wish someone had pointed this out to me first -- before I bought one.

And thanks, Nina -- I've finally gotten around to editing the title of this topic to include "USB Headsets" because THAT is the problem. The loopback/sidetone in a USB headset can't be done in software on the Computer side ... but only within the Headsets own circuitry (unless they use MUCH faster chips).

The BIG concern here is that Second Life is specifically recommending headsets that DON'T have this feature... And THIS is a BIG mistake on their part -- because it can cause a whole lot of people a lot of UNNECESSARY IRRITATION... Which is a BAD thing.

--
P.S. I see I CANNOT change the topic to include the words "USB headsets" in the title where it is visible in the forum -- and "USB headsets" is REALLY what this thread is about. Live and learn.

Lifting this up one last time ...

The issue is really ... Does anyone know of a USB headset that lets you hear yourself.

The recommended ones DO NOT.

NOTE: This is not an issue with sound card headphones/mic ... This is strictly an issue with USB headsets ... that do their own digital processing ... and therefore DO NOT ALLOW YOU TO HEAR YOURSELF ... unless they have been designed that way.

Plantronics DSP 500 headsets DO NOT allow you to hear yourself (like on the telephone.. or in a recording studio).

THE QUESTION IS: Do you know of a USB headset that provides "sidetone" feature?