Effects of temp rezzers on sim performance

Does anyone have opinions on using temp rezzers on sim performances?

Yep, I used to have some Klingons living next door. They had a fleet of 4 spaceships on temp rez. Once a minute the sim would slow down to 12 FPS as these things re-rezzed. It was quite annoying.

I filed a support ticket and they were removed. I never actually saw the Klingons, maybe they were on a mission.

your joking? 4 full sized spaceships, thats just mad

i'v used them befor in my old swamp, a few of my higher prim trees were in them. 2-3 seemed to be fine, any more than that tho and you could deffinatly feel the frame rate drop.

obviously things that take longer to rez will impact more as well, eg. things with scripts, flexi prims, large textures, ect. ect.

-Crunch

I have a big build next to my sky store. It re rezzes every minute. I don't even notice it and it's probably better now with mono as things do rez faster.

Tarina, the effect of temp rezzers really depends on what they're rezzing, how often they're doing it and what else is happening on the sim at the time..

Mono shouldn't impact it at all..

Hmm. Me, too... wonder if it's the same bunch? It took a couple of prodding of the Lindens, but they finally spoke to the Klingons, who agreed to remove the 580+ prim temp-rezzed-once-a-minute fleet of ships.

Few realise that temp rezzing is however limited...500 prim max on large parcels and a lesser mathematical calculation for smaller lands..many only realise this when items only rez for seconds with gaps inbetween.

The real bugbear is that SL has advanced in creativity and the parcel prim limits are too small. The average newbie gets their 512, puts up the house a fireplace and easy chair then realises they have filled the parcel. A rezzer becomes a necessity.

ive endured the temp rez issues....and have now banned the use of them from my island. Aside from the slowing everything down to a crawl as all the gear re-rezed every minute..some makes seemed rather problematic...re rezzing multiples of items until once a parcel was filled with stuff and items started being returned.

I dislike them with a passion Live within your prim allocation...or buy bigger?
Fai x

Uh.. No.

Buying more land or having less stuff out becomes a necessity.

Quite apart from the lag problems of temp rezzers, there is the problem of prim limits.

Originally, temp-on-rez prims were additional to proper prims and you could use an unlimited number of them, no matter how small a parcel you had. Unfortunately both griefers and non-griefers worked on a variety of systems to make temp on rex prims permanent, and so the rules were changed, to give a limit on temp on rez prims that could be used.

Unless something changed when I was looking the other way, the result of the changes to temp rez limits that the Lindens made many months ago, was to give sims a hard limit of 15,000 prims. That means, if you have a parcel on a sim, that your temp rezzer is actually taking the prims from the total available for the sim.

If you use all 500 temp-on-rez prims available on the sim, that will men that there are 500 fewer prims available, sim wide. As most people operate slightly below their prim limit, this may well mean that you are taking up all the spare prims, and that people will be unable to use their full prim limit.

I have been on parcels where there were 100 or more prims free in theory, and yet it was impossible to rez anything. The message has to be not to use them unless you own the sim... in which case temp rezzers aren't really relevant as you will have the real prims to use.

I'm not sure you are right there. I have a photo of a 250 prim temp-rezzed "guard" on a 64m plot.

Some months ago, the 15,000 hard limit was being changed so that temp prims would be additional to it, rather than have to fit within it. It was to happen in an update, and presumably it's happened.

Hey Phil that definitely needs documentation to be believed, otherwise please don't pass that around as 'possible' fact, you should know better than that, just saying

It was in the notes of an update - in the blog - and has been mentioned in the forum before.

Having messed with temp rezzers for foliage and blocking out unsightly crap, now that I have openspace I'll only have certain things on temp rez i.e. Svarga's finest beehives and bird nests. Don't need anything else and if I do then need to be conservative with the prims to make it so.

See http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/SVC-1166 for more info on the supposed relaxing of the limitation on temp prims. See also http://blog.secondlife.com/2008/03/07/havok4-early-adopter-update-rc0-of-the-new-second-life-simulator-with-15-fixes-2008-03-07/ for a Blog entry that seems to state that they don't count against region prim limits any more.

The blog reported that the RC0 'early adopter' Havok 4 release included "SVC-1066", which was to fix temp-on-rez prims counting against region sim limits. But "SVC-1066" is about a completely unrelated "page not found" problem.

I did a search of the JIRA, and the closest I could find was "SVC-1166", which is still OPEN and not resolved. In that ticket, the person who opened it made this statement:



I think they may have experimented with "fixing" that in the RC0 Havok 4 release, but the fact that this ticket is still open implies that it didn't make it into the final code for the Havok 4 server release.

Excellent info, Ceera. The blog entry is where I read it:-

SVC-1066: Temp prims no longer count towards region prim limits

Perhaps the SVC number was a typo or simply an error. It's hard to imagine that the words were typed by mistake. It would be interesting to know for sure. I think it's reasonable to assume that the words are correct though.

Further follow-up:

In JIRA ticket SVC-1477, which is marked as resolved, we have the following statement:



So Kelly says he did fix a logical error in the Havok 4 routines that check for a parcel full error, so it identifies temp prims before checking the total in the parcel or in the sim for limits. The bug, based on the other discussions, was that before this fix, it checked for a parcel full limit before bothering to see if any of the prims were temp.

=============

So... It seems they DID fix the issue of temp-on-rez prims stealing available prim count, both on the parcel and on the sim-wide basis, as part of the Havok 4 release.

But use of temp-rezzers to keep an object in place full-time still is unwise. They are fine for a holovendor that only rezzes something on-demand, to be looked at, and then allows the item to de-rez when the client goes away. They are fine for something that only rezzes a handfull of one-prim fireflies or falling leaves. But a rezzer that constantly re-rezzes the same object every 60 seconds is still going to cause sim performance spikes, especially if the object in question is a high-prim one. Because it is still asking the sim to rez a complex object every 60 seconds, and at the overlap point there is a gap of a few seconds where both the old copy and the new one have to be tracked by the sim. Imagine the impact of having several rezzers in a sim, each of them rezzing the max allowed number of temp prims for their parcel. Several people have experimented with this, and they have consistently found that a temp rezzer that re-rezzes high-prim objects does cause a loss of server-wide performance.

Bottom line. Temp-on-rez is safer than it used to be, and there are now per-parcel limits that seem to have been thought out with some consideration of their impact on server performance. But they should still only be used where necessary, and sparingly.

So it wasn't a change of policy towards temp prims, but a fix of a previous error.

Looks that way. Apparently when they chaged the allocation formula to : "temp_prim_limit = prim_limit - current_prim_count + min( 0.5 * current_prim_count + 400, 1000) ". They intended this not to count against the sim's limits, as the poster of SVC-1166 believed was the case. Though why they didn't say that in SVC-1166 and close that JIRA ticket is something I can not explain.

Excellent detective work, Ceera

This is not true. Sculpties for sure have reduced the number of prims used all over the grid. People went from 20 prim stairs in their home to 1-2 prim sculpty stairs. Creators now use textures in ways that make you think you are looking at more prims than you really are.

People on the grid are far more prim thrifty that my time. And that is a fact.