Expressive Puppeteering

Back in 2006 there was a huge deal about SL getting "Expressive Puppeteering" along with all the whoha about mono scripting, and new havok physics...

We have havok in beta testing... We have mono in alpha testing....

What about the expressive puppeteering? Is this still coming? was it scrapped?

The idea behind it was something that really made me excited for the future of SL, more so then other things being worked on and added... not to mention the avatars of SL really seriouslly need a revamp in how they move, and how textures apply to them.

[edit to add link to wiki page on the system]
http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Puppeteering

Well ... the others have come to pass - I personally don't remember hearing about this but I hope it WILL be coming ... w00t!

I didn't hear about it before too... but oh my, that would be truly awesome!!!

Morwen.

I've been wondering the same thing, Michael. I was psyched when they announced the puppeteer stuff. I remember reading something about LL licensing some cool animation tech, possible the same that drives the Endorphin software... ah yes, here is a link that mentions it
http://www.secondlifeinsider.com/2007/05/03/endorphin-to-change-your-expression/

Let's hope they continue work on this once Havok4 is in place.

Sounds excellent, what is it?

And on that same note, what happen to the speedtree trees?

(Silly VB needs actual words in the post)

You see somebody cares they left that tree stub just big enough for him to cuddle

I'll agree with Tofu. First, get the system more stable rather than introducing too many new shinies at once. Right now, the new Havok is supposed to help with some of the stability issues, so I don't consider it a new shiny. Now, Windlight is a new shiny, but we do need at least one new shiny per 6 months and they have been extensively testing it, rather than just rolling it out wholesale.

Havok, Mono and the client re-write that went with Windlight are all directly working towards SL being more stable with large numbers of users. LL seem to be at least trying to put their work where their mouth is when they say their focus is on increasing stablity for us.

I think this is the right approach.

You guys are all talking sense. You're not leaving room for the baying bucktoothed masses armed with pitchforks. For shame.

(I can wait for the puppeteering ... but when the day dawns that we have it ... wow, the machinima possibilities ...)

I agree that the animations are needing a revamp...but I don't agree the avatars necessarily need a revamp--if you look at super talented texture artists (Soreal, Second Skin Labs), you'll see that you can make an AV look pretty damn photo real...and these same skills can be used in clothing as well.

I think it would be nice to have 'tools' that help and tutor someone more simplistically through a realistic skin or clothing build...but I don't think the UV mapping or poly count of AVs are anything to snub as they are...it's all about the artists texturing abilities.

Check out Soreal, and Second Skin Labs....then tell me we need to revamp our AVs.

Sure there are a few 'seams' that show up in UVmapping...but that's always the case, for every game designer and artist.

Edit: as far as facial expressions...yes, this too can be revamped.

We really do need a better AV mesh They're actually pretty dreadful for skinning. Yes, a lot of people have learned to work wonders around it, but the mesh itself really is very poor.

Mari

FWIW, I recall "expressive puppeteering" being part of a "Physical Avatar" project. I never understood how the avatars would get any more physical than they are now (unless the mesh itself... ah, never mind ). But assuming there's some sem- to those -antics, perhaps it's a good thing it all waited for Havoc 4. Though I have absolutely no idea what I'm talking about.

Best thing I have read all day. LOL

the skins might look fine.. tho way to low polly ((i've never yet seen a realistic skin, no matter whose)) it's how the clothes appear and look that needs a revamp.. skirts, dresses, pants... none actually conform and apply to the body as they should.

But then again, do I want my avatar look really realistic? Maybe for others it may, but I am fine as my avatar looks like (and did look from the first days she was created)... pretty, but you surely can see she is not real. But that is just good with me.

Morwen.

Google around for online demos of rag doll avatar physics. The demo I saw had an avatar fall off a bridge, and automatically reach out and try to grab hold of something as it fell. In fact, it *did* manage to grab on to something, and thus did not fall.

I think of it this way. In RL my body sometimes reacts quicker than I can think. My avatar should be the same way. In addition, I should be able to control how my avatar reacts to falling, attacks, rain, snow, being under water, being pushed, etc etc etc from some sort of control panel and from a script.

Maybe one avatar would be a cowardly lion, but another would be James Bond like.

This is just some pie in the sky 22nd century stuff, but it could get here sooner than we think.

the more physical was because with the press of a key (ctrl in the early tests) you would get points on the avatar you could click on and manipulate... so you could grab your arm and stretch it out to shake someone elses hand all in real time with everyone seeing what you were doing.

Perhaps I am just to picky about it, but when i look at someone's avatar I don't see pretty, or cute.. I see skirts that are either unyeilding, and appear deformed, or dresses with half the time sitting inside the avatar, butt cheeks sticking out the back... Seams on the shoulders of shirts, shirts never lining up perfectly with pants on the waist line...

it's all just small things most people don't even notice but drives me crazy

*blows some dust off the topic*

For those who care about puppeteering: http://www.massively.com/2008/04/07/peering-inside-whither-avatar-puppeteering/

Short version: the Linden who was working on it left in August 2007, it's been collecting dust ever since and can be assumed to be dead and buried.

Ya, I jes read dat as well. Sadly, it seems to be one of the troubles: no one picks up the projects spearheaded by departed Lindens.

Mind you, I dun tink dat's always bad, with the leaving of a certain Linden who will remain nameless an infamous

Mari