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Any way to speed up flexible prim animation?

Tanstaa Freelunch
Registered User
Join date: 27 May 2006
Posts: 16
02-02-2008 01:29
Sorry if this question has been asked before. I searched but had no luck finding anything related.

Does anyone know of a setting, or method, of increasing the frame-rate of flexible prims?

I have a fairly powerful computer. Second Life, or Windlight, at a resolution of 2560x1600 with all graphical options maxed (except aniso and anti-aliasing) I get frame rates in the hundreds while apparently only using around 10% of my cpu. However, flexible prims on any object (my avatar for example) animate at around three frames per second approximately. I've seached for settings related to flexible prims and other than mesh detail haven't had any success finding a means of upping this rate of animation.

If possible, I'd like to push the envelope and get the client to animate flexible prims faster.

Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks.
Void Singer
Int vSelf = Sing(void);
Join date: 24 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,973
02-02-2008 01:41
From: Tanstaa Freelunch
Sorry if this question has been asked before. I searched but had no luck finding anything related.

Does anyone know of a setting, or method, of increasing the frame-rate of flexible prims?

I have a fairly powerful computer. Second Life, or Windlight, at a resolution of 2560x1600 with all graphical options maxed (except aniso and anti-aliasing) I get frame rates in the hundreds while apparently only using around 10% of my cpu. However, flexible prims on any object (my avatar for example) animate at around three frames per second approximately. I've seached for settings related to flexible prims and other than mesh detail haven't had any success finding a means of upping this rate of animation.

If possible, I'd like to push the envelope and get the client to animate flexible prims faster.

Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks.

I believe mesh detail is the only one, but it also depends on the settings applied to the flexi... if it's set to a low springiness it won't react very fast
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Tanstaa Freelunch
Registered User
Join date: 27 May 2006
Posts: 16
02-02-2008 03:15
From: Void Singer
I believe mesh detail is the only one, but it also depends on the settings applied to the flexi... if it's set to a low springiness it won't react very fast


I looked for a setting for springiness, the only ones I can find (this is with Windlight, I'll check out the normal client here in a bit) are:

Softness
Gravity
Drag
Wind
Tension
ForceX
ForceY
ForceY

Playing with these settings didn't seem to affect the speed at which the motion of the prim was updated. Is there a hidden setting perhaps, something a prim function controls? I'll go do research into that as well but figured I'd ask while I was here.
Qie Niangao
Coin-operated
Join date: 24 May 2006
Posts: 7,138
02-02-2008 06:16
There's a Client Debug Setting for RenderFlexTimeFactor, which, it is said, "Controls level of detail of flexible objects (multiplier for amount of time spent processing flex objects)." No idea if it does anything. If it does, you'd have to restart the viewer after a setting to see any effect.
Dnali Anabuki
Still Crazy
Join date: 17 Oct 2006
Posts: 1,633
02-02-2008 07:14
From: Tanstaa Freelunch
Sorry if this question has been asked before. I searched but had no luck finding anything related.

Does anyone know of a setting, or method, of increasing the frame-rate of flexible prims?

I have a fairly powerful computer. Second Life, or Windlight, at a resolution of 2560x1600 with all graphical options maxed (except aniso and anti-aliasing) I get frame rates in the hundreds while apparently only using around 10% of my cpu. However, flexible prims on any object (my avatar for example) animate at around three frames per second approximately. I've seached for settings related to flexible prims and other than mesh detail haven't had any success finding a means of upping this rate of animation.

If possible, I'd like to push the envelope and get the client to animate flexible prims faster.

Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks.



I'm considering rebuilding my computer; would love to know the specs of yours.
Tanstaa Freelunch
Registered User
Join date: 27 May 2006
Posts: 16
02-02-2008 10:50
From: Dnali Anabuki
I'm considering rebuilding my computer; would love to know the specs of yours.


Motherboard: XFX 780i
CPU: Intel Core Duo qx9650 quad core extreme edition, overclocked to 4.5 gigahertz
CPU Cooling: Prometia Mach 1, CPU cooled to -30 degrees Celcius
Video: Three nVidia 8800 Ultra (EVGA) in Tri-SLI configuration, factory overclocked to 655 GPU/1125 Memory
Video Cooling: Passive water cooled
RAM: Four one gig Extreme Low Latency DDR2 Viper (four gigs total)
Drives: Two 160 gig Western Digital Raptors in a RAID 0. I don't remember the model, they're the new generation with the window so you can see the platters spinning and heads moving if you want.
RAID Controller: Areca 1200 (two channel PCIe 1x)
Sound: Auzen Prelude

Bus is at stock speeds, the 780i chipset is not overclock friendly, and runs extremely hot. If you're going to build a machine using it, I suggest replacing the air cooling with water (which I plan on doing eventually).

I have the CPU multiplier set to 13 and voltage at 1.75 (from 9 and 1.2). It's rock stable, however, if I drive it hard with say Prime 95 it can overcome the now aged Prometia Mach 1 and eventually warm the CPU up enough that the system become unstable (at around 0 degrees C). I'm considering upgrading to the Mach 2.

Another thing, while this machine is capable of SLI, the current drivers from nVidia absolutely suck for OpenGL support. Enabling SLI gets significantly less performance than Single GPU mode (specificing single GPU in the SLI profile for Second Life gets absolutely nothing, you must completely disable SLI). Maybe some day Nvidia will wrest the OpenGL performace crown back from ATI, but I'm not holding my breath, to many times waking up with drool in my keyboard for that. The same applies, btw, for ANY OpenGL based game (for example world of warcraft). DirectX games reap massive benefits from Tri-SLI (think Crysis if you're into it (I am)), but OpenGL suffers miserably. However, in this case, a single 8800 Ultra overclocked a bit, is still very fast.

I might add, as far as I know, Vista is still necessary for Tri-SLI support (I'm currently using Vista Ultimate 64 bit), and you will pay about 20% Vista sucks tax in terms of raw performance versus XP. This is overcome by Tri-SLI obviously, but not so much in Single GPU mode. I'd dual boot but Vista isn't very multi-OS friendly and with 320 gigs of drive space two OS's (windows OS's) would eat that up fast. Frankly I wish Macrohard would get their shit together and make an OS that was actually BETTER than the previous generation. Look to the Linux Kernels (or to a lesser extent OSX), it IS possible. </soapbox>
Dnali Anabuki
Still Crazy
Join date: 17 Oct 2006
Posts: 1,633
02-02-2008 12:00
oh I do covet thy machine! And it answers a question I had about SLI..I can do two cards but have put off putting in the second one.

I think for now I can boost my RAM to 4 gig from 2, put in the 2nd Video card but don't put in SLI mode...already have the Raptor Sata for SL.(with the cool window..lol..)

and maybe hope for the super fast internet our provider says is in the works.


I'm not familiar with that motherboard usually sticking to ASUS cause that is what I know.
Can you tell me more about it?

My Athlon 64 is 2.4 gigahertz...any hints on how to overclock it? It is supposed to be overclock friendly but I find it hard to understand the process. I have a system that is so well aircooled it feels like a refrigerator when you touch the case so I should be able to tweak this a bit but really don't know how. Can you direct me to the best place to find out?
Tanstaa Freelunch
Registered User
Join date: 27 May 2006
Posts: 16
02-03-2008 00:02
From: Dnali Anabuki
oh I do covet thy machine! And it answers a question I had about SLI..I can do two cards but have put off putting in the second one.


If you're using crossfire then you might be ok. I don't know if SL is crossfire friendly, I do know that there are claims out there that ATI opengl support is more reliable than Nvidia.


From: Dnali Anabuki
and maybe hope for the super fast internet our provider says is in the works.


I've got super fast internet, I don't know how quickly SL streams for you, I do know I spend (typically) several minutes waiting for everything to update after a teleport, and I've got my network bandwidth set to 1500 (I'm assuming that's kilobits). A faster connection may not help you any. I seem to recall SL loading faster in the old days, so perhaps they're running short on bandwidth, or it could be somewhere between them and me.

From: Dnali Anabuki
I'm not familiar with that motherboard usually sticking to ASUS cause that is what I know.
Can you tell me more about it?


XFX is just another company that produces reference board hardware. Their 780i motherboard is a reference nvidia board. I suspect they're just someone else with a different badge and a tendency to sell enthusiast targeted hardware.

From: Dnali Anabuki
My Athlon 64 is 2.4 gigahertz...any hints on how to overclock it? It is supposed to be overclock friendly but I find it hard to understand the process. I have a system that is so well aircooled it feels like a refrigerator when you touch the case so I should be able to tweak this a bit but really don't know how. Can you direct me to the best place to find out?


Before you do anything, understand that overclocking will void any (if you still have one) warranty you have, and furthermore, if you've never done it before chances are unless you go for only a mild overclock (say 10-20%) you will almost certainly fry your hardware. I have a box somewhere of fried, cracked, bent, or otherwise destroyed CPUs from years of doing it (someday I want to turn them into keychains). Even if you don't fry anything, overclocking anything WILL shorten its lifespan. A CPU that would normally operate seven years before failing might fail in a year, or even shorter, if you push it hard.

Google overclocking. Check out anandtech, hardocp, and for video, guru3d. There're many guides out there.

I'll try to give you a place to start, but if you toast something listening to me I won't take responsibility.

I couldn't tell you if your CPU is multiplier locked. Most CPUs are, limiting you to whatever their maximum multiplier is (you can always underclock). Intel Extreme Edition CPUs are unlocked (it's part of the reason they cost so much), and AMD CPUs used to be as well until to many people got shafted with illegally rebadged processors.

In any case, the best method of overclocking, if your hardware can support it, is to push the bus speed higher. This is both the best gain method and the riskiest. Higher bus speeds equals more throughput between devices on the bus, a corresponding boost in cpu speed (cpu speed is determined by the bus speed times the multiplier (in most cases)), and ram speed. The risk comes from the fact that most hardware out there does NOT like operating faster than it was designed to (ram in particular doesn't appreciate it, if you've got generic ram in your machine, don't mess with the bus speeds, or, and this is way beyond the scope of a beginner guide, learn how to relax your ram timings to allow faster refresh). A faster bus will affect everything. There are newer motherboards (the 780i for example) that allow independent timings between the CPU bus, the PCI bus (and PCIe), and the ram bus, which is great if you can only overclock by playing with bus speeds. But be forewarned, disparate speeds between the various buses can result in bottlenecks that impare performance worse than just leaving things alone. If you can do it, it's better to have everything talking at the same rate.

This brings us to heat. The faster you push things, the more noise you generate on the bus, in the ram, and within the cpu. So that the signals remain clear, you raise the voltages. This applies in particular to your CPU and ram. Other peripherals tend to be more forgiving (video card, chipset, etc). Raising the voltage means more waste heat. None of the hardware these days is 100% efficient, a good portion of the electricity is lost as heat, and heat needs to go somewhere or things start to melt. Air cooling, in particular for AMD's as they have always run hot, is limited in terms of heat dissipation. Air is innefficent as a heat sink. You can compensate by using bigger heat sinks (more surface area to transfer heat) and faster (more cubic feet per minute) louder fans, but air has a very sharp curve of diminishing returns. Water, on the other hand, is much much more efficient at pulling heat away from your cpu. It also allows you essentially unlimited surface with which to transfer heat into your room (bigger radiators + slower but larger fans = quieter but still more efficient and effective cooling). Check out some of the hardware available at dangerden for examples of water cooling.

A typical bus-based overclocking session consists of, with paper and pen handy to record results, you increase bus speed a little (say one hertz if your motherboad supports it). Test your machine (using something that stresses ram and cpu (prime 95 is about the best for this, it can kill stock speed machines otherwise considered stable), if it remains stable, you raise bus again. Keep doing so, in small increments, until you reach a point that strange things begin to happen (blue screens, lockups, etc). Then you raise voltages (look to both ram and CPU), test, if stable, raise speed, test, if unstable raise voltage, and so on. Most motherboards that support these settings won't allow you to push voltages to high, but even so it's still possible to fry your hardware. Do research on what others have done before, find out what limits you have in terms of voltage to your ram and cpu before you're risking the magic smoke escaping.

Good luck.
Tanstaa Freelunch
Registered User
Join date: 27 May 2006
Posts: 16
02-03-2008 00:11
From: Qie Niangao
There's a Client Debug Setting for RenderFlexTimeFactor, which, it is said, "Controls level of detail of flexible objects (multiplier for amount of time spent processing flex objects)." No idea if it does anything. If it does, you'd have to restart the viewer after a setting to see any effect.



Haha this did the trick. Bumping it from the default of 2.0 to 50 I pushed cpu utilization to 50% and have MUCH smoother flexi animation. I'll continue to play with it, first I need to find a venue with a lot of flexi's and see how it impacts performance. Thanks for the tip!
Darkness Anubis
Registered User
Join date: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,628
02-03-2008 00:42
I have dual ATI 1950's in a crossfire on a vista box and I am pulling some serious good framerates. 50-75 or so on the mainland most of the time.

4 gigs of ram and I know its a core duo but heck if know the actual specs.
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Tanstaa Freelunch
Registered User
Join date: 27 May 2006
Posts: 16
02-03-2008 00:46
Ah, I spoke to soon. It was just a perception thing, changing this value doesn't seem to have any significant affect on how quickly flexible prims animate. Sorry to have jumped the gun.
Tanstaa Freelunch
Registered User
Join date: 27 May 2006
Posts: 16
02-03-2008 00:56
Further update concerning RenderFlexTimeFactor, although setting it higher doesn't appear to affect actual animation speed, there's a direct correlation between it and cpu utilization. Set to a default of 1, cpu utilization sits around 10%, bump to anything higher than 15 and cpu climbs to 50%. I haven't been able to push further than 50%, I suspect because SL is only using two of my four cores.