Linden Licensing? Anyone use it?

I was finally reading the wiki on how to make movies. http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Movie_help

..and found this:

IMPORTANT! Commercial usage

If your film is for commercial gain, you need to email Linden Lab Licensing so we're cool with it. We need to know:

1. What your film's about?
2. Do you own rights to content featured in the film? If not, do you have permission from the creators?
3. Link to your video so we can watch it?
4. Your real-life contact info?

I have not heard of anyone actually contacting Linden Lab Licensing.

Has anyone actually gone thru with this process and if so, how did you find it?

Curious minds wanna know...

:0 well i don't know, but i would imagine csi ny 'needed to' (though they probably got approved to use sl before they could've even applied ;0), and perhaps that, what, new italian movie or series featuring sl?? the ones i've heard about... oh and maybe molotov's hbo series maybe needed to (after getting picked up by hbo ;0)

Firstly, what has this to do with LL?
Do I have to ask permissions when I grab a screen shot? What we are filming is content, LL do not provide content.
Probably what they are looking for is contacts... knowing what companies are interested in SL, is perhaps feeding their marketing machine. I for one will not ask permissions of LL for content that I create. I am not breaking TOS.

I bet CSI:NY had to get approval from LL.

If its good enough for you, its good enough for me.

Thanks all, seemed weird to me too.

This is the important part. If it isn't, they are saying you don't have to contact them.

This was actually raised in another forum, and some filmmakers tried to contact both LL and Torley for clarification which was never forthcoming in a final definitive statement.

http://z-studios.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=373

AWM, I agree that this is not in the ToS so in theory LL can't complain. However, LL have been in the habit of posting policy changes in the blog and not in ToS. This guideline is posted in the wiki, does that carry any weight?

I'll guess we'll find out in court, if anybody ever makes a million and LL sue.

Thanks for the link Rosco. Sounds pretty lame all around. All I agreed to explicitly was the TOS and I don't think the wiki, given that fact that supposedly anyone can add content to it, has much weight.

LL is a provider of a platform, digital grass.. along with a basic avatar account. For which they charge a very large amount of money on a regular basis. There are 2 sets of rules... TOS which is a legal document, and covenant which relates to behaviour of individuals and or resellers.

The whole concept of the platform, is to sustain revenue for the provisional and enabling of the digital grass (accounts are free if required). All content is then created and supposedly owned, by the creators. It is they that according to TOS, have the IP rights to that content, albeit LL are supposed to uphold those rights.

Making amendments to the 'rules' on a blog is not considered as legal by law, unless every user has to actively agree to them. This is normally done by clicking a submit button, or checking a box before agreeing to the Terms and Conditions at the point of logging in/downloading, installing etc.

The ability of being able to grab screenshots and or making movies in SL has been provided freely without restriction (you do not have to agree to any terms and conditions before doing so) within the client, supplied by LL, almost from the start. In fact they have actively encouraged that process, posting users media on their own showcase website. When you present that media to LL, you have to agree that they can use it in their marketing without restriction.

The ONLY potential agreement that you need, is if:-
You record a TM owned by a legal company, and or content that they state clearly is prohibitive and is protected by law.
You record content owned by a third party that has stated clearly that you must have their permissions to do so.
You create content in the form of a movie, banner, picture and or representation that degrades a company/individual and or organisation (defamation/slander), and or use their content within an act that breaks the law. Consider those people that created animations and functionality for the use in child porn, along with the actual filmakers and participants.

If I write a best selling novel using MS Word, I do not need to seek MS permission to sell the book. Nor to I need to aknowledge the editing/creation programmes I use to create machinima, of which SL is a part of that process. It would be 'good manners' to aknowledge SL/LL in credits, along with actors, set builders, sound, location etc in a movie, but unless stated clearly by each party, in a legal agreeance/acceptance format, that you cannot use their content, then you are considered freely to do so.
The 'Good Manners' extends to contacting any potential interested parties, which leads to creating a relationship of mutual interest.

This maybe the case should you create media that includes LL content, that is not expressly and clearly stated, as being forbidden to be used, in a legal format. Do not consider the digital grass as being LL content. Copyright laws state, if you make 3 identifiable alterations to content, it is not considered a direct and malicious copy. LL have patented a Process, not content.

The link posted above is not a LL/SL supported information exchange. The heading is 'Guidlines' which expresses no legal committment. As a signed up member of InSL, I abide by the agreement, which only relates to the use of the SL/LL logo.

If you do go ahead and create a film for profit (Something I am considering in the near future) and you create it WITHOUT LL's permission. Will they go all busty ass on you? Now, for CSI and The Office, and Two and a Half Men, they may do that and get away with it. They have enough lawyers to cover their asses. I, sadly, do not. Regardless, if they are right or not, I do not have the resources to fight a legal battle. If I got into a battle with them, I'd go bankrupt.

Now, I should point out that provably CSI and the bunch got permission before they did it. And I bet LL got a cut of the proceeds. I am not certain if I could afford to give away what little profit I might get from making machinima with Second Life. Hopefully for the little people, they don't take a cut.

If they do take a cut from everyone, I may just film using traditional film to make money. I really love the possibilities of machinima, but eventually, I need to make a profit.

I would go along with AWM's excellent post.

I think there is more problem with using other residents creations without perms tho that is a gray area too.

I buy a dresser to use as Set Dec in a RL film, I don't have to get permission from anyone to use it...I think that RL standards will eventually apply to SL as well.

However a sim owner might have some standing if your film there as they are the ones renting the server space from LL and in a sense you are using their server space while filming.

As for being sued by LL, I think that would end up being really bad PR for them and they would be more likely contact you privately. If they sued you, just get on the line to the press immediately....

I think they understand they would benefit from any SL machinima doing well commercially because it would attract RL attention in a positive way.

I don't believe LL's take on this (hopefully they will add to this thread and enlighten us) is to get, ask, demand etc a Cut from the proceeds, I believe their motivations is to see how they are represented and, to gather marketing information that they can use themselves.

I can also ensure you, unless you are a million dollar company, there would be nothing for them to gain by trying to sue you. Why employ a high paid lawyer to sue someone who has little to offer? No judge would offer compensation beyond A) the value of the project B) your means to pay. At absolute worse, if you had broken the Law, you may get a fixed fine, but thats usually criminal law, not civil law.

Anyway, as I said previously, no law would be broken as far as LL are concerned, by making machinima in SL. They cannot impose any changes to the TOS you signed up for when you download, install, login unless explicitly agreed to. To my knowledge, their is no rule regarding this within the TOS. Blog and or Wiki annoucements, hold no legal presidence or represent a legal binding agreement, unless you are in someway forced to read it and explicitly agree to it by action.