Second Life Forums Archive - Cory Doctorow Second Appearance Chatlog: 11/4/05

Cory Doctorow Second Appearance Chatlog: 11/4/05
Jeffrey Gomez Cubed™ Join date: 11 Jun 2004 Posts: 3,522	11-04-2005 17:31 Note: Participants were expressly asked for consent prior to this log being posted. This is plainly visible within the body of the log itself. Cory also experienced some... uhhh.... technical difficulties. So he had to maintain the chat through an alt. Given the number of "oh noes!" emails I received from his legitimate email, he's the real deal. Cory Burleigh: Am I in the right place? Fractional Surface: This is Cory's alt? Cory Burleigh: Yes! Jeffrey Gomez: Uh-huh. Green Fate: heh Fractional Surface: A little generic. Someone get the man an AV! Grey Heaney: this is a good place. depends on where you were headed? Jeffrey Gomez: It's okay. A nice small group for discussion this time. Jeffrey Gomez: If you want a large one, I can pull down EVERY contact I have of course. Cory Burleigh: I'm headed for whereever I'm supposed to be -- is Merc4nary around? Jeffrey Gomez: Hi. Jeffrey Gomez: That'd be my online nick, yes. Cory Burleigh: Right -- OK! Green Fate: Mr Gomez that would be. Fractional Surface: Want to talk up here or hit the bar? Jeffrey Gomez: Should have mentioned my SL name. Jeffrey Gomez: Either is good. The bar would be a bit more comfy. Cory Burleigh: Sorry about all the cockups -- I'm unbelivably jetlagged and my SL client forgot my passwd Green Fate: hapens when you pick up a new IP address. Jeffrey Gomez: I was expecting something a little more formal, even at this hour. But hey. You're here. Let's get this show on the road. Cory Burleigh: OKEYDOKE! InuYasha Meiji is online Fractional Surface: We were just talking about Charles Stross and his new book Accelerondo Fractional Surface: Lets hit the bar Cory Burleigh: A fine book! Charlie's a wild-man Fractional Surface: More seating if more come Jeffrey Gomez: I'm also trying to get Pathfinder to come. Seems to be inactive though. Jeffrey Gomez: He's the sort that would love this. Fractional Surface: I like stuff about our coming demise/transcendence due to the singularity Green Fate: snoozing probably. Fractional Surface: Ever since Greg Bear's "Blood Music" Cory Burleigh: Yeah - we tweaked that a lot in our novellas JURY SERVICE and APPEALS COURT Fractional Surface: Lets hit the bar Green Fate: its deep sleep time where he is. Blue Martin: ok, show us th way Fractional Surface: Down here Cory Burleigh: Sterling sez that we go thought daily singularities that destroy our continuity with our pre-singular selves Grey Heaney: I just rec'd Accelerando the other day. I'm eager to start it. it's my reward for hitting 25,000 words for NaNoWriMo Cory Burleigh: I think that the "theory of mind iqualitides" Cory Burleigh: uh, "theory of mind" qualifies Cory Burleigh: Should I be going somewhere? Grey Heaney: I'm not sure. they said "the bar" but I don't know where that is. Fractional Surface: I am a big fan of Greg Egan's work Fractional Surface: Down here! Grey Heaney: oh, nice! Jeffrey Gomez: The folks here have very good taste. I am in awe. Fractional Surface: He has some very interesting ideas about what beings in a post singularity universe would be like Cory Burleigh: Well, he wanted to have all this playful weirdo economic stuff play out, which was pretty fun all right Fractional Surface: You are all about the weird economies.... Fractional Surface: what did you call it Fractional Surface: woofie? Makaio Stygian is online Fractional Surface: woopie! Fractional Surface: ? Cory Burleigh: Whuffie! Fractional Surface: There she blows! Cory Burleigh: Yeah, the reputation economy stuff Cory Burleigh: it was an interesting gedankenexperiment, if only to highlight some of the key elements of the way that, for example, open source software organizes itself Cory Burleigh: warez groups, too Makaio Stygian is offline Cory Burleigh: the important stuff about Whuffie is in the seuqel, tho, Truncat, which was pub'ed on SALN Cory Burleigh: the thing about Whuffie is that it's a power-law Grey Heaney: the cathedral and the bazaar, thing? Fractional Surface: SALN? Cory Burleigh: people with lots of Whuffie hve lots of opportunities to accrue more whuffie Cory Burleigh: Salon.com Cory Burleigh: rich-get-richer Fractional Surface: Just like the rich of today? Cory Burleigh: e.g.: Fractional Surface: Takes money to make money... Green Fate: mining the obtanium Jeffrey Gomez: Heh. Cory Burleigh: I saw a cool thing on Gizmodo this week and blogged it Fractional Surface: Having enough capitol to get the ball rolling is important in any enterpris Cory Burleigh: and I got an email from the guy who had blogged it, whence Gizmodo had picked it up and he wanted credit for it too Fractional Surface: There are a lot of people interested in "Micro-finance" Jeffrey Gomez: You mean the gaming rig with its own GPS? Fractional Surface: as a way of encouraging growth in the 3rd world Cory Burleigh: and my response is basically, "Gizmodo has earned my trust by being a frequent source of good links so they get the credit, since that's where I found it" I don't read your blog because you haven't shown me enough ghood stuff to read your blog Cory Burleigh: But I see the other guy's point -- how CAN he earn enough trust if the onlyway the stuff he blogs gets noticed is when it's re-blogged by other blogs? Fractional Surface: Have you heard of Splogs, Cory? Jeffrey Gomez: Speaking of blogs, it seems Sunbelt, the one I read far too much, loves your entries. Cory Burleigh: But So I'm not talking about needing money to make money -- I'm talking about how the more money you have, the more money you get. Like airmiles -- once you've got Platinum on AA, they give you two miles for every mile you fly. Jeffrey Gomez: A 'splog?' Fractional Surface: There are people that are ripping off content from other blogs in a systematic, automated way Grey Heaney: maybe there's a way to set things up so that sources get some form of credit through a third party for number of derived links? Fractional Surface: So, they put out a hundred virtual blogs that cull content from dozens of actual ones Jeffrey Gomez: And I thought the term "blog" was hard to follow, seeing it's derived from weblogs. Cory Burleigh: Sure, splogs! Interesting phenom. Weirdly, technorati does a better job of filtering them than Google does, even though they're mostly on blogspot Fractional Surface: and kill off the potential for add revenue for the actual originators of content Zon Javelin: well, I'm a photographer, people are always ripping off photos from my blog Jeffrey Gomez: Sunbelt actually pulls your links on occasion. Usually the occult security whatnot. They have their own content frequently, though. Fractional Surface: Yeah, the splogs tend to have a higher google rank than the actual originating site Cory Burleigh: Well, we can imagine that kind of gigantic attribtion enterprise, but it seems impractical. Say 10,000 coders contribute to an OSS project and you use 1 line form it. Do you credit all 10K of them? Cory Burleigh: What if you havew 1,000 lines of code, each drawn from porjcts with 10,000 contribs each? Blue Martin: do splogs credit the source? Jeffrey Gomez: Google rank... shit. My "writing wiki" gets ranked #1 and hit has like zero content. Jeffrey Gomez: That does not surprise me. Fractional Surface: No, splogs are to blogs what spam is to email Blue Martin: ok, thats bad Cory Burleigh: I don't follow your point about splogs reducing the ad rev for legit creators. BB has ads that pay good money. When our stuff isdisplayed on asplog, it doesn't undercut the money our advertisers pay us Fractional Surface: It is a fake site designed to generate ad revenue through deliberate copying of the works of others Fractional Surface: Here is how Jeffrey Gomez: So basically, it's like every other content farm out there. Trash for tabloid readers that don't take the time to find the real source. Fractional Surface: The splogs will almost universally have a higher search engine rank than the genuine original blog Fractional Surface: So, if someone is searching for "Latest Xbox Game Review" Jeffrey Gomez: I'd like to see an example of that phenomena, actually. Fractional Surface: They end up getting a direct link to the splog first Jeffrey Gomez: I have my second box running. Let me check that. Fractional Surface: and the splog gets the add revenue from that search engine click through Cory Burleigh: Well, OK, so it might capture some revenue illicitly, but is that YOUR revenue? The fact that someone is higher-ranked than you and gets an ad payment doesn't actually mean that he's deprived you of the revenue Jeffrey Gomez: Not from me. I keep my hosts file. Cory Burleigh: It's ill-gotten gains, but I'd say that the victim here is the advertiser! Jeffrey Gomez: Ads are funny creatures in the sense they generate money from whole cloth. Almost. Fractional Surface: Well, they are stealing your content verbatim and reducing the chance to near nill that you will get the traffic you would have ordinarily gotten from a search engine Jeffrey Gomez: We know where those funds come from, but the ad wars are just scary in their inception. Cory Burleigh: TO near nil? Really? How do you figure? Cory Burleigh: I search for $STRING and there's a splog and then your site Fractional Surface: Because the originator of the content will often be way at the bottom of the search engine results Cory Burleigh: I click to the splog, which is an incoherent mess, I click back and go to your site Cory Burleigh: What's more I never revisit the splog, because it si incoherent machine-generated goo Fractional Surface: Ah, but the splog won't be a incoherent mess Jeffrey Gomez: Here's the acid test. Fractional Surface: It will be a well templated professional looking site Jeffrey Gomez: I just searched "blog" Cory Burleigh: so they don't get my repeat trade, which is where the big bucks are for advertising Jeffrey Gomez: From the top, and I quote: Cory Burleigh: Naw, splogs are incoherent messes. Green Fate: its usually pretty messy. Green Fate: yeah Cory Burleigh: They really are. There are hundreds of these that are based on BB Bar Box - DIY Version: Unable to give inventory: No item named 'tu' Cory Burleigh: I've clicked through lots of them, b/c they show up as referrers on our site Green Fate: no drink for you! Cory Burleigh: due to pulling ur imgs Cory Burleigh: our Jeffrey Gomez: Blogger. Typepad. Blogger. Blogwise. BlogForAmerica. GoogleBlog. Lessig.Org. Google. BoingBoing. Fractional Surface: People will notice that a splog doesn't really originate the content over time, but most of the time people are just clicking a permalink that takes them directly to an article Jeffrey Gomez: Are you sure you don't have hooks in your Google, Fract? Jeffrey Gomez: Just to be doublesure. Cory Burleigh: Half the time, a Google result to a permalink goes to the wrong post -- they often index adjascent posts under the wrong URL Cory Burleigh: Heh -- nope! No ties with Google Fractional Surface: hooks in my google? I am spyware free, guaranteed Jeffrey Gomez: The "affiliates first" phenomena is one of those spyware things gone horribly wrong. Jeffrey Gomez: Adware, excuse me. Jeffrey Gomez: Just had to ask. =) Cory Burleigh: Though Chris DiBona, the guy who runs their OSS program, bought me lunch on Weds at UNC Chapel Hill! Cory Burleigh: Barbeque! Fractional Surface: I do computer security consulting Grey Heaney: Jeffrey Gomez: Chapel Hill. I've been there. Jeffrey Gomez: Beautiful place. Fractional Surface: Half my business probably comes from data recovery/spyware removal and viruses Jeffrey Gomez: Visit Duke while you were there? Green Fate: It is.. I was just there a few months ago. Jeffrey Gomez: I hope I'm thinking of the right one. Cory Burleigh: I was there yesterday -- but I didn't get to Duke. Just lectured at a UNC conference.. Jeffrey Gomez: Grey Heaney: They have areally good philosophy of mind program at UNC. Cory Burleigh: And I've got to go to Osxford to give a talk right after this Grey Heaney: <--- Philosophy student. Jeffrey Gomez: North Carolina is one of those places I want to go back and visit sometime. Cory Burleigh: Thought I might do a podcast first... Green Fate: I barely escaped NC. Cory Burleigh: The whole time I was there, the Andy Griffith theme was ringing in my ears Fractional Surface: ouch Jeffrey Gomez: Well, in truth I expected more people. I realize this was the best time for you, and I figured the net would be European users implicitly interested in what you do. Grey Heaney: LOL - no! not that! Jeffrey Gomez: But this is nice. Fractional Surface: 4 am here Jeffrey Gomez: Almost seven here. Cory Burleigh: Well, it's awfully kind of everone to turn up Zon Javelin: almost 2am here Jeffrey Gomez: I'd gotten a request for a chat log, by the way. Cory Burleigh: Did you have some Qds for me? Jeffrey Gomez: A couple actually. Cory Burleigh: no problem from me Green Fate: That and Nascar rock-nroll guitar riffs with the screaming gravel voiced announcer man telling you what windshield washer fluid to use. Cory Burleigh: excepte that my typing's gone to hell with the jetlag Cory Burleigh: Case in point _____________________ ---
Jeffrey Gomez Cubed™ Join date: 11 Jun 2004 Posts: 3,522	Part 2 11-04-2005 17:33 Jeffrey Gomez: A couple requests for logs that is, but questions: A few as well. Fractional Surface: I have a Q Cory Burleigh: SHoot Fractional Surface: I noticed you are serializing a story Cory Burleigh: Which, the novel on Salon or the podcast? Fractional Surface: Do you think there will be an increase in serialization now that there are syndication systems like RSS? Cory Burleigh: Oh! You mean the last novel that someone has turned into an RSS feed! Blue Martin: sorry, RSS? Jeffrey Gomez: RSS should come in IV form. Cory Burleigh: Someone explain RSS while I get the URL Fractional Surface: Well, more do you think that the existence of syndication will change how people create content Green Fate: dermapatch. Grey Heaney: Don't you have a USB port in your arm, Jeffrey? Fractional Surface: for example, the ability to do near instantaneous polling has allowed politicians to tune their stump speeches Jeffrey Gomez: RSS is basically a way to beam content quickly to people. Like the WeatherBug of real information. Cory Burleigh: http://craphound.com/someone/000539.html Fractional Surface: and infomercials to polish their pitch Fractional Surface: So, will we be seeing audience directed stories in the near future? Jeffrey Gomez: I'm actually not so much an RSS junkie. I'm a Wikipedia nut. Grey Heaney: I have a writing biz related question, Cory... Jeffrey Gomez: With the exception of most blogs on people. Cory Burleigh: It's funny you should mention this stuff about fine-tuning speeches. I've been working on Themepunks (the novel that Salon is serializing) and I've just been writing a passage with a voice/IM/voting section Jeffrey Gomez: Err. Entries* Cory Burleigh: Can I paste-bomb a couple paras into the chat, or will that break something? Fractional Surface: Where the audience's comments on the most recent part of a serial has the effect of steering the author? Grey Heaney: should work okay, Cory. Jeffrey Gomez: Aside from someone's pride, not much. Strife Onizuka: go right ahead (paste bomb control doesn't exist yet) Jeffrey Gomez: Is everyone okay with this log being posted? Cory Burleigh: While I find the text... Green Fate: yes Fractional Surface: In some ways, I am kinda fearful of that future Blue Martin: sure Zon Javelin: y Grey Heaney: fine by me, Jeffrey. Grey Heaney: Green Fate: everyone already knows I type like #&^$! (s + hit) anways. Jeffrey Gomez: Just have to be sure. The admins police these things. Cory Burleigh: I often revise what I'm writing pased on reader feedback, though the more negative the feedback or the less trusted the reader the less likely I am to trust tit Fractional Surface: as with politicians you have careful, crafted messages that reach for a lowest common denominator Cory Burleigh: The important thing, if you're going to open the door on your writing stufdio, is to have the strength of will to ignroe the people who are wrong Cory Burleigh: Anyway, here's the pastebomb Jeffrey Gomez: Far more Liberal, of course. Cory Burleigh: The conference channel was filling up. Perry checked off names as reps from all the rides came online. There was a lot of tight, tense chatter, jokes about the fuzz. "OK," Perry said. "Let's get it started. There's cops blockading every ride, right? Us Cory Burleigh: Hmmm Cory Burleigh: that didn't work Cory Burleigh: Hang on Green Fate: it truncates Jeffrey Gomez: Shoot for one or two sentences. Zon Javelin: The input speed on the paste must be too fast Grey Heaney: 128 characters? something like that. Jeffrey Gomez: Pastebombs are limited to 255 characters. Strife Onizuka: 255 Jeffrey Gomez: Oh. Hi Strife. Did I forget the TP? Green Fate: yesh Zon Javelin: Can it be put on a notecard? Green Fate: he got here in time Jeffrey Gomez: Or have I really been not looking. Strife Onizuka: ~_~ tis ok i found my way here Green Fate: he was killing spiders Green Fate: heheh Cory Burleigh: It's on the web: http://craphound.com/slchat1.txt Fractional Surface: Yeah, plop it on a notecard, make it copyable and plunk it down on the table Jeffrey Gomez: Right-Click, New Notecard. From a folder. Jeffrey Gomez: Hand it to me. I'll put it in distro form. Green Fate: the web page is probably faster. Jeffrey Gomez: True. Grey Heaney: got it Jeffrey? Zon Javelin: I've got the webpage up Cory Burleigh: Anyway -- that's one way that I think this stuff can turn into a fine-tunable real0-time collab Cory Burleigh: I'd LOVE to have an app like the one I described in this passage Shirley Meiji is online Fractional Surface: I wish they would hurry up and get Mozilla in here already Cory Burleigh: It could be even cooler in a MMO, of course -- instead of the page going pink when the group disagrees, the clouds could roll in and the thunder rumble Cory Burleigh: Anyway -- writing business question? Jeffrey Gomez: Simple general one since this is my first novel. Consistency. Jeffrey Gomez: I ramble on for about 2,000 words, then flip out when I realize something doesn't match. Any way to break that? Zon Javelin: sorry bout that, want to delete that thing Cory Burleigh: Fix it in post Cory Burleigh: It's critical to separate out the composition and the revision tasks Cory Burleigh: It's nearly impossible to revise and compose at the same time Fractional Surface: Looks at Douglas Adams Cory Burleigh: So just write it -- make a note in [sqbkts] if you'd like Grey Heaney: oh - sorry - ws reading the .txt yes, my question... typing. Cory Burleigh: But keep going Fractional Surface: When he died, he had like 10 different, irreconcileable revisions of his final book on his Mac's HDD Cory Burleigh: Journos use TK ("to come", as a placeholder for text that's due later Object: Unable to give inventory: No item named '' Jeffrey Gomez: Notecard added. Cory Burleigh: When I'm wiring formal papers, I often write something then add (fn TK) -- footnote to come -- which means, "look up a refernec efor this before you send it to the FCC" Jeffrey Gomez: Should get it when touched now. An object named Object owned by Jeffrey Gomez gave you Cory Notecard 1. Grey Heaney: TK? cool.. I'm wondering - approx how many professional level writers currently working in the SF field are able to cover their whole living expenses that way? Grey Heaney: not asking for names, of course. Cory Burleigh: Approx: 0 Cory Burleigh: I should explain Grey Heaney: REALLY? good to know.. ok.... Green Fate: the percentage able to live off it would be interesting aswell. Fractional Surface: First order approximation of the universe - It is empty Cory Burleigh: If you're in a position where royalties are amounting to enough dough to make your rent, chances are you're making much more money from related gigs: speaking engagements, film options, etc etc Cory Burleigh: I don't know any writers who are royalties-only writers Cory Burleigh: Though there must be some Green Fate: what about contract to write? Cory Burleigh: What about them? Grey Heaney: right - okay, that makes sense. it's the same with most fiction writers, I think. Well, except Tom Clancy and a few others, maybe. Green Fate: same question I guess. Cory Burleigh: Clancy undoubtably makes several order of magnitude more form film opitions than he does from royalties and advances Green Fate: yeah. Cory Burleigh: IOW: by the time royalties matter, they're irrelevant Fractional Surface: In a sense, an author almost has to be a "multimedia" person these days Cory Burleigh: There's a funny fiction in royalties and advances Fractional Surface: I have always like Neil Gaiman for his ability to work in so many different forms of media Cory Burleigh: Nomially, an advance is money that the publisher expects you to earn out in royalties, but many agents say things like "If a book earns out its advance then I havne't done my job" Fractional Surface: TV, Movies, Books, Graphic Novels, etc Cory Burleigh: IOW: an advance is really a lump sum payment Grey Heaney: oh, I see - but it's still derived from teh intellectual property he created in his fiction... I'm thinking that nowadays a way to look at a writing career is as an IP-content creator generally, fiction writer as primary outlet for that IP. Cory Burleigh: Fractional -- well, more to point: now as ever, most writers need day-jobs Zon Javelin: And isn't it that you don't make any money past the advance until the book sells a certain #? Cory Burleigh: Well, speaking gigs have a pretty dubious relationship with "IP" -- it's not that a lecture is "derived" from your writing; more like your writing has served as a calling card for your analytic skills Cory Burleigh: The way that an advance works is this: Jeffrey Gomez: Hey Falk. Cory Burleigh: Publisher: I will pay you 10% of the cover price for every book sold Falk Bergman: hey Cory Burleigh: and I will advance you $n in advance against those royalties Cory Burleigh: Hey, Flak! Cory Burleigh: Er Falk Cory Burleigh: Once the book has sold enough copies to pay back the advance, you start earning more royalties Grey Heaney: I see - yes that makes sense too. I hadn't thought about speaking as a huge percentage of a writers' income, but I suppose there are a lot of conventions and classes and so forth. Jeffrey Gomez: Publishers are animals I know quite well. They're the ones that make my money hand over fist, all the way through college. Eckhart Dillon is offline Cory Burleigh: But the advance is supopsed to represent just that -- an advance against royalties Jeffrey Gomez: My parents are both academics. I've played ear to several lovely stories of nonpayment. Blue Martin: i imagine ou would need a certain profile to get paid to speak at conferences etc Strife Onizuka: so if the book doesn't sell you have to give the advance back? Cory Burleigh: Oh, there's lots of that! Publishers often take 18 months or more to account for sales -- which means you can wait 1.5+ years to get the royalty ona book sold today Cory Burleigh: No, you never have to return an advance Grey Heaney: (unless you don't deliver the book) Jeffrey Gomez: Or have an excellent legal staff on hand. Jeffrey Gomez: I assume there are perks working at EFF. Cory Burleigh: The closest you can come to that is when advances are "tied" across a multi-book deal. Say you sell 2 novels for a $30,000 advance -- neither pays royalties until sales of both amount to royalties to cover the advance. Whereas if you'd done 2 $15k deals Cory Burleigh: and one book flopped, the other one would still pay new royalties Cory Burleigh: Yes, you do have to return the advance for nondelivery, most of the time Cory Burleigh: EFF lawyers are awesome, but the alw is largely unrelated to publishing deals Jeffrey Gomez: A question for the ignorant: What is considered a "good" percentage in the bookselling world? Cory Burleigh: Cotnracts are riddled with the unenforceable and legaly risible Cory Burleigh: that's why we use agents, not lawyers (even IP lawyers) to negotiate them Jeffrey Gomez: Sounds about right. A lawyer would tell you what's legally ethical. An agent would tell you what's realistically there. Cory Burleigh: Exactly Green Fate: what would be the most difficult part of publishing your work yourself? Cory Burleigh: A publisher is someone who "makes a book public" -- that is to say, someone who connects a book with its audience Cory Burleigh: that's a complicated process that combines marketing, etditorial, design, PR, etc Falk Bergman goes back to work Jeffrey Gomez: And sometimes, bribery. Cory Burleigh: Locating the correct audience for a work and then seeing to it that thye know of the work's existence is a deply professional art Cory Burleigh: And not one with much nexus with writing Grey Heaney: sorry: "nexus?" Jeffrey Gomez: The Babel of the bookseller's world. Strife Onizuka: (nexus = meeting point) Cory Burleigh: It's not something that you're good at necessarly, just because you're good at writing Grey Heaney: ah, thank you. Green Fate: Right. Jeffrey Gomez: I'm a jack of all trades, personally. I can't fathom marketing. Fractional Surface: That is more or less the same argument that the RIAA makes with music. That the promotional costs/talent needed to put out a record justifies its inordinate cost Jeffrey Gomez: Took a class in it. I'm glad I didn't take the professor's eye out with a sppn. Jeffrey Gomez: Spoon* Fractional Surface: Yet, there are plenty of self promoters that are making good money in the music industry Fractional Surface: Why not for authorship as well? Zon Javelin: Yeah, you gotta have someone to do marketing that knows it Cory Burleigh: Well, they RIAA does havea point - they have a good mechanism for connecting some artists with very large audiences Cory Burleigh: However, they totally suck balls at connecting artists with smaller audiences Zon Javelin: I have a friend that does that, the PR side of books. Green Fate: every once in a while I read or see an interview with some writer who pressed all their books in china, had them shipped and keeps them in a locker at some P-Storrage... trucks them around the country from store to store. Seems like a full time job - _____________________ ---
Jeffrey Gomez Cubed™ Join date: 11 Jun 2004 Posts: 3,522	Part 3 11-04-2005 17:33 Green Fate: after the fact. Jeffrey Gomez: Or connecting smaller artists, period. Cory Burleigh: Which emans that a very small fraction of all commercially viable artists can make a go of it thoruhg a label Zon Javelin: Nice to see what Podshow is doing for unsigned musical artists Jeffrey Gomez: I give Apple a lot of credit for what they've done to the music industry. Zon Javelin: Podcasting is leveling the playing field for music a bit Grey Heaney: so is self-publishing a viable option for budding SF writers with friends in lots of cities and a gas-efficient car to handle promotion? Fractional Surface: The best authors write what they know, does it not follow that they might know their audience better than a generic publisher? Zon Javelin: Away from Clear Channel Cory Burleigh: There's a lot of action there -- new, more efficient eays of making artists and audiences come together Jeffrey Gomez: Then there's Google - the great equalizer. Fractional Surface: For example, I think you have done a good job of leveraging Boing Boing to promote your works Cory Burleigh: I don't know that that's the case. Publishers sell book after book after book. They know from past experience how much repsonses they get from different forms of promotion and marketing, and so on Zon Javelin: So Cory, do you think we are going to see a shift from major websites from giving out content for free to paid subscriptions sometime? Cory Burleigh: Well, with Google we're full circle baack to Whuffie and power-laws -- Google gives more oportunities to accrue pagerank to sites that already have a lot of pageranks Zon Javelin: The WSJ did that from the start and seems to be doing well, though they do have a specific audience. Jeffrey Gomez: Just have to throw one thing in there for Zon: Free Registrations are the devil. Grey Heaney: a specific audience with a fair amount of disposable income, too. Zon Javelin: Salon either sells suscriptions or the mandatory ads. Cory Burleigh: (and historically, fo course, many authors are very wrong about how to market their material -- that's why we have editors and art directors -- jsut look at late Heinlein to see what that author thought should be published to reach his audience, PU!) Fractional Surface: Checkout "bug me not" solves that problem real quick Jeffrey Gomez: Oh, I am one with BugMeNot. Strife Onizuka: bugmenot = bye byt free reg Jeffrey Gomez: And, yes. Grey Heaney: LOL - point taken. Green Fate: heh Fractional Surface: Heinlein always cracks me up Fractional Surface: He was such a dirty old man, even when young Jeffrey Gomez: Power law is something I find that ranges from erksome to grotesque, if marvelously efficient at times. Green Fate: most are Fract. Jeffrey Gomez: Personally, I cannot mesh with most OSS coders for the egos that form around it. Green Fate agrees Jeffrey Gomez: I find in our culture there is an art to just being, well. Honest about one's integrity. Jeffrey Gomez: Did we lose you Cory? Fractional Surface: Asleep at the keyboard? Cory Burleigh: I'm here! Fractional Surface: He did say he was jetlagged Jeffrey Gomez: Phew. Jeffrey Gomez: Was afraid 1.7 claimed another victim. Fractional Surface: Cory Doctorow, found dead at his keyboard this morning.... Cory Burleigh: Sorry, I'm also doinga week's worth of printing and have to keep clearing jams Blue Martin: lol Green Fate: bed is shouting my name. Green Fate: Night, goot to see you. Strife Onizuka sings song by Queen Jeffrey Gomez: Take care man. Grey Heaney: shout back, Green Fate! Blue Martin: bye Zon Javelin: good nite Cory Burleigh: Well, it's been nearly 1h -- let's take one more q and wrape it up? Cory Burleigh: Night Fate! Strife Onizuka: resist the siron song of thy bed Cory Burleigh: God my typing is teh sux0r today Jeffrey Gomez hums "I want to ride my bicycle." Green Fate: yeah its 0423, I have to talk to a man about a house.. and be away for it when I do.. Fractional Surface: I heard a supposedly true story once about a man who had a heart attack while in IRC chat and was trying to convince the people in channel that he was having a heart attack and could they please call 911 Strife Onizuka: ?bicycle races are taking me away? Green Fate is offline Grey Heaney: OK Cory - whose going to write the first Post-Singularity SF novel: you or Charles Stross? Blue Martin: whoops sorry Blue Martin: didn't mean to whistle at you all Cory Burleigh: I think we'll both do it! Grey Heaney: sorry - I mean, the first one written AFTER the singularity really occurs. Fractional Surface: You mean whose upload is going to write the first post singularity novel, right? Grey Heaney: what, as a multimind? Cory Burleigh: We're finishing up the Huw stories -- JURY SERVICE, APPEALS COURT Cory Burleigh: for Tor Cory Burleigh: And we'll call the whole thing THE RAPTURE OF THE NERDS Grey Heaney: ))) Cory Burleigh: which is a nice phrasewe nicked off Ken MacLeon Fractional Surface: lol Fractional Surface: The chosen 2^16 of is? Fractional Surface: us Fractional Surface: So, when can we expect to see something more from you in dead tree edition? Cory Burleigh: Exactly -- in the Singularity, it's the religious nuts who stay home and refuse the rapture, while all the secular geeks ascend Strife Onizuka: 64k? Jeffrey Gomez: There are 10 people in the world. Those who know binary, and those who don't. Cory Burleigh: The next book is probably 10 months away Grey Heaney: groan! Jeffrey Gomez: It's old, I know. Cory Burleigh: And then 4-6 months to get into print Cory Burleigh: But there's the Salon serial Cory Burleigh: and lots of short fic Cory Burleigh: and I'm working on two nonfic books, one about blogging and the other about DRM Grey Heaney: and your Make magazine articles. Cory Burleigh: Those too! Jeffrey Gomez: DRM huh? Cory Burleigh: And I just sold an article to Wired Fractional Surface: I am going to talk to Philip Torrone this weekend Strife Onizuka: (why do computers think halloween and xmas are the same?) Cory Burleigh: Yup -- the DRM bok will be called SET TOP COP (I think), and I'llbe writing it in the new year Jeffrey Gomez: I've been rattling on about how Trusted Computing is the scariest shit since the advent of 1984. Strife Onizuka: (DEC 25 = OCT 31) Grey Heaney: (Am I the only girl present, btw?) Cory Burleigh: Cool! Give him my best! Phil is awesome Cory Burleigh: That's hilarious! OCT 31 Fractional Surface: He and I are talking at an emerging technology conference in Seattle called "Mind Camp" Jeffrey Gomez: Strife: Because they're both consumer holidays? Cory Burleigh: I adore the "camp" phenomenon Jeffrey Gomez: And this one time, at... nevermind. Fractional Surface: I have always considered myself a gadget freak, but I don't come close to phil Grey Heaney: lol Strife. took me a second Cory Burleigh: He's world class Fractional Surface: I am going to be talking about car computers, wearables and showing off a few robots Fractional Surface: I mentor a HS robotics club Cory Burleigh: Well, it's 12:30 here! I have to write a speech, get on a train and go to Oxford! Grey Heaney: Thanks for coming by, Cory! Strife Onizuka: trusts computing scares me too but we are arleady seeing it in the new macs Fractional Surface: The wearable is damn cool, uses a laser to draw on your retina Fractional Surface: Thanks for coming, Cory Jeffrey Gomez: Definitely Big thanks. Zon Javelin: yes, a please to meet Strife Onizuka nods Cory Burleigh: I'm really sorry that I wazs late and so rateful to you all for showing up! And for mercen4ry for pulling this together! Cory Burleigh: Thanks again! Cory Burleigh: Cory Blue Martin: Thanks for making the time and energy to come and share your thoughts Cory Burleigh: NP Cory Burleigh: night night Fractional Surface: Cya Grey Heaney: bye! Zon Javelin: g'nite Blue Martin: ciao Jeffrey Gomez: "Jeff" will suffice. The callsign is ackward here. Jeffrey Gomez: Take care. Cory Burleigh: Ha! OK Formatted and colorized with transcript. _____________________ ---
Thea Donovan talentless hack Join date: 20 May 2004 Posts: 67	11-05-2005 04:21 Thanks for posting this!
Hamlet Linden Linden Lab Employee Join date: 9 Apr 2003 Posts: 882	11-06-2005 15:37 > Cory also experienced some... uhhh.... technical difficulties. So he had to maintain the chat through an alt. I can confirm that, as Cory also sent me a frantic e-mail at 3am about his technical trubbles. _____________________ New World Notes

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Cory Doctorow Second Appearance Chatlog: 11/4/05