wrong thread

wrong thread
saw-wie

No, i'm pretty sure this is the right thread. Check again.

Yup, works for me!

(Here's a benign hijack to keep it from getting nuked: whatever system of government or rules we propose in this forums, posters legitimately react with suspicion. We distrust the political types seen in RL, and don't want to be a cog in the wannabe empire of an SL equivalent. A 'political type' person is more likely to want CONTROL over you and I for its own sake. More likely to say, "It's all about me", but not in public! And these characteristics are masked by a veneer of self-promoting PR. So I support direct democracy in SL, like the feature voting system.)

Ugh. "Direct democracy" by the technocrats *is* a form of government and you're just slipping it in disguised as "not a form of government" with a sleight of hand!

Non pasaran!

If we're going to oppose forms of government in SL, we have to oppose forms of government, full stop. Don't try to get *your own* form slipped in under the guise of it being "enlightened" and "technocratic" bleh and packing your statements with rhetoric about *everyone else* being "selfish" and "self-promotional" and "out to take control". That's just using Bolshevik-style propaganda methods, they surely can't fly here.

We've seen significant opposition to "direct democracy" via the very flawed voting tools here -- I've cited numerous reasons why this can't fly, given the propensity for stupidity, coercion, poor communication tools, etc. in this "system".

You do not have an informed electorate and you cannot get an informed and participating electorate when you do not have a system of representative democracy and you do not have an in-game, unfettered free press and communications system accessible to all.

Ugh, ugh, ugh. I'm afraid I have to express really firm, fast, and frequent opposition to any effort to slip in player government under the form of "impersonal technology" which is "run by the Lindens".

And really, I think it's low, trying to distract from that maneuver by saying that anyone who questions technocracy or "direct democracy run by the illuminati" has only selfish "control-mongering" in mind, or is "in it only for me" or is a "PR kinda person"

There's certainly cultural biases here, as sometimes people who are outspoken and accepted in one culture as merely outspoken are viewed in another cultural context as being power-mongerers. It can be an erroneous judgement and it is good to take a second look at it.

P.S. So I think before these judgements are passed off so lightly, we need to agree what it means to be "taking over" or "wishing to take over" or "to put one over" or to "overthrow" the "community". I think vocal critics or colourful PR personas are not proof positive of some nefarious desire to "take over" and I'd challenge any characterization of that nature.

I have always felt that the system of government we have in SL is a benelovent-anarchist Dictatorship. The Lindens, for better or worse, rule over SL with some benelovence while still maintaining their anarchist dictatorship. Its basically a free for all until the heavy hand of the dictatorship has to be brought down on those who take the anarchy just a bit to far (violate the TOS). There is no recourse. There is no appeal. It is in the hands of the benelovent-anarchist dictators, known as the Lindens.

This is just an opinion and should not be taken as an insult against the Lindens. I actually support this form of government within SL as it does allow more freedom than if it were resident run. We have all seen in the United States what the tyranny of the majority can do.

Timmy, I tend to agree. IN our very distorted and contorted context called 'a MMORPG wanting to become a metaverse" the Linden TOS-ocracy (benign dictatorship? company town? state capitalism? whatever/) is "the worst form of government...except for all the others" -- like democracy.

Where I'd differ is if the TOSocracy then slips in a player-run government by slipping in something called "direct democracy" which, as they used to say about the Soviet Union, is "two lies in two words."

There's nothing so direct about something in which only a few take part, and only a few informed. There's nothing democratic about something in which only a few take part and in which a few can't become informed without representative government mediating and without a free press.

I'm not for installing that representative government because I think it would be hell on wheels and better left alone. I'm for trying to keep the free press going as long as possible, however.

This is the wrong thread.