RL addresses of SL businesses

Why should those running large-scale businesses in SL be anonymous? If you're about to give £100 or more to, say, a land baron, surely you have the right to know the identity of the person you're doing business with?

Obviously, Linden Lab knows our RL addresses (except me, as I travel so much and gave them just the address of my credit card), but I believe that there should be far more transparency, and anyone selling land or items for over a certain amount (5,000 L$?) should have their RL details displayed inworld.

You wouldn't do business in RL with someone who called themselves Dave Avatar with no address, so why in SL?

Arghhhh Charlotte, no homework to do tonight hon? Maybe wash the dishes instead?

This is a terribly idea.

People like Anshe Chung or Hank Ramos establish their crediblity in the game just through sheer holding power. They offer services. They deliver. You can see what they deliver. You have repeatedly experiences and it works or doesn't and you make a judgement. It would not be fair to invade their privacy.

This is a game. Don't throw thousands of real life dollars away on it unless you are nuts. Don't spend even $4. Unless you know what you want out of it and can affor to take the awful risk.

There is no benefit from removing the virtual/free/fantasy aspect to SL merely to give someone's obsessive need to check everything a fix. You can't see amazon.com yet you may have spent hundreds on their books.

A dreadful analogy. Amazon.com publish their RL details in several places on their website, while Dave Avatar in SL shows his nowhere.

And you can see Amazon.co.uk, a vast warehouse visible from the M1 in Bedfordshire.

When I spend 5,000 or even more lindens, I've not spent a dime of real money. If I get hosed, that sucks, but I'll pick myself up and consider it a lesson learned. Same as if I get PvP-ganked in an MMORPG and loose a valuable sword, or something.

I'm not willing to trust people with my credit card information unless there is public information availible, of course. GOM, for example, has all that information public. I don't deal with them either, but I would have no real concerns over security to do so.

Two weeks and two topics we agree on Charlotte. This is incredible

I touched on what you discuss here in a thread that had little response.

/120/67/38791/1.html

My belief is that if you decide to take the plunge to mix rl and sl by offering business goods and/or services out of world then you should reveal yourself. People who shop on your website should know exactly what the entity is that they are dealing with. Without naming names, I know from major SL-based web sites who is named and who is not. Some of those who did not name themselves were easy enough to find while others remain little more than an avatar.

The overall point of my thread was that those who represent themselves only as an avatar would be faced with a dilemma if I or someone else decided to lift their site. Who would their attorneys say they represent when a cease and desist heads my way. Hmmm? At some point it'll get ugly around here when someone is seriously screwed over. Hopefully that will not happen but let's be real. It will at some point to some one.

If you have concerns with the credibility of someone you are dealing with, pay in $L.
Seems fairly simple to me. Am I missing something?

But L$ are bought with US$ - you're just indirectly paying them in real money.

you do not have the right at all.

you can ask, and maybe they will tell you. Or, you can not give them your business.

you have a choice who you work with, and who you choose to trust. If offering an RL business address (and then you have to do the work to confirm it is real) is a prerequisite for your business, then that is certainly your perogative but it is not a general right, rule or requirement, nor should it become one.



of course, we might start seeing RL business addresses like

9.75 Platform
King's Cross Station
London N11 W01

or

64 Brooklyn Bridge, Apt 999C
New York, NY 10001

Nobody says you have to buy L$ with US$... I've only done it once, in an emergency. And I've never had problems affording land or anything.

This only becomes a problem when you start thinking of the US$ and the L$ as the same thing, IMO.

I understand that. But for what reason do I need their RL address?

If I am buying land from someone, they set it for sale in $L, using SL's built in tools.
If I am buying an object, I do the same thing.
Both cases require that the land or item be set for sale at a specified price. This ensures that you get the product at the agreed upon price.

I am not trying to be argumentative, I am just not seeing the issue.

Well, hmmm....it must be hard for anyone, also SL, to know peoples "real" addresses.
Sometimes you just have to trust people, for worse or for bad. Same issues/problems/feeling with ebay.

JMHO.

I just want your phone number.

You may buy Lindens.....I don't

Um... Talen?

Do you have a premium account? If so, then you are buying 500L per week using real money....

If you only have a basic account, then I can't argue with you on that point.

Case closed.

----------------------

That being said, I still don't understand the original question of the thread?

Why would you need to know in RL who is selling you something in SL. By definition, you are buying nothing that exists other than as a a bunch of bits stored on a server somewhere at LL... Those bits are in no way guaranteed to exist an hour from now. In all likelyhood thay will be just fine, but...

Wether you trust someone or not has nothing to do with it. It's not like buying a car from a stranger in RL and it turns out to be a lemon. Then you have a problem if you don't know who sold it to you.

If you want to spend hundreds of dolars/euros/pounds/etc. in game that's great but I don't see why you would need a RL ID from the seller. If you are sure you want something, buy it. If you don't trust that it is a good 'product' don't buy it.

EG: I walk into a supermarket and buy stuff all the time that I have no idea where it came from, how it was processed, etc. and I don't care either. If the product meets or exceeds my expectations, I'll buy the same product/brand again next time. If it does not, I'll find a different brand or simply avoid that type of product altogether in the future.

Even though I _COULD_ trace a product back to a realworld person/corporation, I have no reason too unless it somehow injured someone or caused damage to someone.

If you can explain to me how buying anything in SL could possibly injure someone or do damage (other than perhaps a badly scripted item causing server crashes or lots of lagg) I'd be curious to know about it.

It's up to the maker of the product to see to it that it does what it's supposed to. If it doesn't then the maker generaly doesn't stay in buisness very long (unless the service happens to be government - the exception to the rule).

Racer P.

Not hardly.

A premium account's biggest feature is the ability to own land. The extra lindens are a nice bonus, but that's all.

How about you offer up your personal RL address (phone, too while you're at it) and a link to a nice map site. Then, maybe, I'll support your idea - but not likely.

If you're that concerned about doing business with shady people in SL do your homework. Instead of buying land from a 'baron', buy from the source or a friend. Don't try to force your will on everyone when you have other options.

I think any site that deals with financial accounts - credit cards and Paypal, absolutely need to have their details displayed publicly for dispute resolution. I would not do business with any site that did not provide this information. Sites dealing purely in L$ have no reason to reveal that information. Any SL sites not dealing in any financial information have no requirement of public disclosure. Under no circumstances does any in world business have any obligation to reveal any personal information - to do so is crazy. I learned a lesson just from having my phone number and address visible in the registration for sluniverse.com (which I have since changed). The potential for abuse far outweighs any benefit.

In SL, you don't have that "right". If you don't want to give £100 to an Avatar, then don't.

If you are dealing with a RL web site, like anshechung or hankramos, you can try to see if they will tell you who they are.

Buster

(Not my real name.)

Me (content creator) gives out RL address, etc. ... You (customer) remains anonymous.

HELL NO!!!!!

Either deal with me because I have a good SL reputation, or don't deal with me.

Anyone else had an SL stalker? A relatively easy thing to deal with, merely annoying... let's add RL info to that equation.

Getting drop boxes that look like

Suite 123423
San Francisco
94105 California

Are a dime a dozen. Real names and what not can trivially be done as smoke and mirrors.

Um, Amazon is a big company. Joe Schmo who works there doesn't publish his RL home address and cell phone! Let's understand the difference. Employees answering the phone at a company vs. an employee's private info which they don't put on the Internet.

Most of these SL "businesses" are jost mom and pop shops or self-employed people at home, it's their RL home, not a big company. They should not be exposed to harassment.

Paypal conducts business with me with my e-mail, my banking card, my phone, my address, etc. But when a customer buys or sells with me on PayPal, he doesn't get to have my RL address to come and harass me where I live.

1 The Mall
London
SW1A 1AA

0790 550 8787

www.streetmap.co.uk

Viewpoint, shmewpoint...

Yes, you get the ability to own 512m2 of land. So? It's not required of you to own land just because you have a premium account. Wether you own land or not with your premium account is 100% optional.

The only thing guaranteed by the premium fees is the extra 450 L per week more than a basic account gets (if they logged in that week).

You're paying for Lindens Reitsuki, wether you admit it or not. The option to own land is just that, an option. Even if you tier up and pay extra for more than 512m2 land, the account fee before additional tier fees are added will always still cover the base stipend you get each week.

Racer P.