Welcome to the Second Life Forums Archive

These forums are CLOSED. Please visit the new forums HERE

Digital Signatures

Hank Ramos
Lifetime Scripter
Join date: 15 Nov 2003
Posts: 2,328
07-02-2004 12:46
Any possibility of adding the ability digitally sign Objects, Scripts, Notecards? This is becoming more and more necessary for things like...

1. Validating scripts and approving them.
2. Signing Contracts
3. Making sure something is truly from a person

Once the object is modified, all of the digital signatures would become invalid, and would require that the object be resigned.
_____________________
Jon Morgan
Senior Member
Join date: 28 May 2004
Posts: 174
07-02-2004 13:22
Does not the System itself assign the keys of Creator and Owner to all objects?
Ace Cassidy
Resident Bohemian
Join date: 5 Apr 2004
Posts: 1,228
07-02-2004 13:26
While I'm not sure how valuable it is, since without any enforcement mechanism, a contract is barely worth the value of the object that represents it, signing a contract would be fairly straightforward.

You give me a "No Modify" notecard containing the contract you want me to sign. I put the notecard in a "No Modify" box created by me, and owned by me. I then give the object to you.

That object, with the notecard contract becomes my "signature" to you.

So long as you're sure that the object came from me (and wasn't given to you by someone else who happened to find a modifiable box created by me, and put your notecard in it, effectively forging my signature), you have my agreement to your contract.

Not sure how to address your other two signature issues, but contracts should be workable. But then... a contract ain't worth a helluva lot if you have no mechanism to ensure that it is enforced.

- Ace
Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
07-02-2004 14:37
While I dont know about signing contracts (Since as people say, they are all but unenforceable), I *can* think of one very good use for something like this.

I make a vehicle/item/etc, get it all set up and just before I load it into my vendor, I "sign" it. That way if anyone ever has a problem with it, I can check to see if its been tampered with.
Carnildo Greenacre
Flight Engineer
Join date: 15 Nov 2003
Posts: 1,044
07-02-2004 23:27
From: someone
Originally posted by Ace Cassidy
But then... a contract ain't worth a helluva lot if you have no mechanism to ensure that it is enforced.


A contract is a lot easier to enforce if a record of it actually exists than if it's just a verbal agreement.
_____________________
perl -le '$_ = 1; (1 x $_) !~ /^(11+)\1+$/ && print while $_++;'
Azelda Garcia
Azelda Garcia
Join date: 3 Nov 2003
Posts: 819
07-03-2004 02:44
What could be nice is: you sign your stuff, then you set an option so only things you signed can run on your land.

That way, you can stop people running undesirable scripts on your land - in a game, for example - but still allow some stuff to run, like attachments.

Azelda
Twist Zaius
Junior Member
Join date: 5 Mar 2004
Posts: 8
07-07-2004 16:04
From: someone
Originally posted by Jon Morgan
Does not the System itself assign the keys of Creator and Owner to all objects?


This can be changed easily, copying the script and pasting it into a new one can change the creator, and attaching another prim to a object you don't own changes the overall ownership when you link them.
_____________________
I'm everything thats wrong with the world
Apotheus Silverman
I write code.
Join date: 17 Nov 2003
Posts: 416
07-08-2004 06:42
Yes, yes, yes.

There are two different types of "digital signatures" I see people mentioning. The first is code/object/thingy signing so it is easy/possible to find out if something has been tampered with. The other is actual digital signatures enforceable in courts of law.

Object signing is an easy enough task to accomplish in-world, and I believe if LL implemented this, it would curb a LOT of developers' current problems regarding piracy and related issues.

On the other hand...

Having an in-world digital signature system for contracts requires that a clause regarding digital signatures exist in the TOS. In order for this to be useful for contracts, the signature system has to be absolutely rock solid in order to be legally binding.

A couple years ago I created a system which conforms to the FDA's 21 CFR Part 11 specification for digital signatures and let me tell you, what a pain in the butt! And expensive! It takes everything into account from software security to encryption to backups to physical access to the servers that hold the data.... all just to allow people to "sign" legal documents that do not exist in hard copy.

I don't think such a system in SL would have to be nearly as elaborate. The main requirements would include 1) Signatures cannot be forged, 2) Sufficient backups of signed items are made in case of subpoena (or allow us to download our own items to make our own backups), and 3) A clause exists in the TOS which explicitly states that digital signatures are valid as actual signed signatures in accordance with the Electronic Signatures in Global and National Commerce Act


As a personal note, I highly doubt that LL will implement digital signatures for legally binding contracts within SL anytime soon. If someone needs a legally binding contract right now, it can be handled with real documents outside SL. Object signing is much more likely to get implemented because it will fix a real problem that is a hot topic right now.
_____________________
Apotheus Silverman
Shop SL on the web - SLExchange.com

Visit Abbotts Aerodrome for gobs of flying fun.
Cashmere Falcone
Prim Manipulator
Join date: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 185
07-09-2004 03:27
I'm not sure I see the need for this, after all, it is a simulation, for entertainment purposes only. Whats next? Alimony, or even Palimony from the person you list as a partner in your profile if for any reason there is a parting of ways? It's my belief, you start talking about contracts and signatures is what essentially i a game, you are trodding on a slippery slope that can lead to no good.

I can see it now, the next new group in SL, LAWYERS OF SL, leading to a new television series "SL Law"...
_____________________
Jebus Linden for President! :p