Oversize prims

This came up in the builders forum.

My idea is that normal (up to 10m) prims remain as they are. oversize (up to 100m) prims should be possible, but with the following restrictions:

1) They cannot be worn.
2) They cannot contain a vehicle script or respond to any script that would make them mobile. If this is too hard to single out, I'd happily consider a total exclusion on containing or responding to scripts.
3) They cannot be moved under the physics engine.
4) Any time they are rezzed, edited, or moved, a check is made, and the operation fails if that check would result in any part of that prim being outside the same plot of land as the centre of that prim.

I believe those conditions would prevent any possible abuse of oversized prims.

Any support for this?

I don't know about 100m, that's just too big. I mean it's almost half a sim. However I'm all for the restrictions placed on it except for the lack of script support. Removing physics from it I heartily agree with. It would be too heavy (a compounded set of 10m blocks making a 20m^3 box is extremely heavy) for normal vehicle scripts to move anyways, and it might just fall off world with the crappy collision detection on something that moves fast enough due to gravity.

I'm all for a 30m or 40m sized prim though, that's much more managable without the potential for griefing due to huge prims. And having it not rezzable unless it's all on the same parcel doesn't help either, because some sims are all one giant parcel (case in point; the Forest, TeaZer Lagoon, and a few places in FurNation. Not to mention just about every sandbox in SL).

The problem with large prims is that the "Viewable list" is based on the objects center.
This means that if a prim was 100m in size and you set the "draw distance limit" to 64m, the block would disapear when it was 14m away from you.

I don't think 100m x 100m is half a sim. It would fit on a square 1024.

The largest thing I ever has built was the Doyle Pool.. it was 8 * 5 - 10*10 prims in a row Plus!!! - and the bottom and all water ones...

Not able to link them.. having problem to have an overlook at the work.. flying around al the time..

But for sure.. ONE prim measuring that size had been great... but dont forget the texture work on such a large one.. he he..

/Tina- sometimes I build to... ))

Well. I've seen 100ft prims in action before, way back, due to a bit of a bug. Fact is, the physics system for the surface alone (like, collisions) was horribly broken. Would be really nice. REALLY nice. But...


Consider for a moment the fact we pay tier based on the number of prims on land. Also consider this allotment is based on the center of the prim, as opposed to volume. This would offer vast griefing potential with the current system and, furthermore, would mess with all those crazy graphs and charts pegging tier to prim "incentive."

Again, would be nice. It's that nagging "but" that doesn't make it happen, though.

Elementary school maths courses are easily available online.

ok, maybe 100m was a little ott, and I admit I didn't think about sandboxes when designing those limits.

To respond to some of the criticisms on the proposal:

Scripting support: The only actual restriction I want regarding scripting for oversize prims would be that any script that would cause the oversize prim to physically move in the game world shoudl fail. However, i have no idea how difficult technically that would be to implement, not being a member of Linden Lab's programming team. A blanket block on all scripts on them would be an easier to implement compromise that still prevents script-based abuse of such prims, although that is NOT my first choice. In any case, you could still retain full support for scripts by using standard sized prims.

100m is too big: yeah, that is plenty big. A sim is 256m by 256m, making one such prim potentially just under 16% of the total area. the restrictions I decribed made it so the entire prim would have to remain at all times within the same parcel of land. That woudl prevent all the basic 'bad neighbour' abuse.

I hadn't thought about abuse within sandboxes or group-owned land. For group owned land, I'm not sure it's a real problem. Misbehaving members of a group that abuse such prims can easily be kicked from the group by the group's leaders. Land owned by groups can be parcelled up, effectively breaking up the potential for oversize prim abuse (any oversize prim on land that is parcelled up would be automatically returned to the owner of the prim).

Sandboxes are a different issue. Perhaps sandbox owners (and land parcel owners in general) should be able to specify a limit on the prim size, in a simialr fashion to how land owners can set streaming audio or video in their land. Most public sandboxes might then have the max prim size set to 10 metres (effectively as it is now). Managed right, this might make a real incentive for owning your own land, which should boost the economy.

Draw distance limits: Another issue I hadn't thought too hard about. I had originally chosen 100m not so people would create football fields, but so very gentle curves could still be accomodated by the prim structures. Given how huge 100m really is, maybe that was an excessive figure anyway. There are two possible solutions to this issue:

1) reduce the maximum size globally for these oversize prims, but otherwise keep the restrictions on them as outlined above.

2) Make a separate and larger draw distance limit for oversize prims. Given that they should still generally be quite rare, this should not slow down most computers (it may be farther, but it's still only a single object to calculate). This would be my preferrred solution to this technical issue.

It'll ruin the economy: yes, people buy more land to get a bigger prim allowance, and this demand might be reduced. On the other hand, this change would stimulate more people into becoming land owners, and stimulate new more creative building projects. the two effects are impssible to calculate, but it's unreasonable to act like you know it will be bad for the economy.

I'd like to see big prims too. I don't think we'll see them any time soon though, since it would require major changes to SL to make them work well, and the issues that Jeffrey mentioned will have to be addressed.