More useful allowed list (Scripted rental holy-grail)

Quite simply, allow us to add/remove allowed users to our parcels even when the option to only allow those users onto the land is enabled. This way we can always edit that list, though I don't think scripts are affected anyway.

In addition to this, add options to the access tab:
o Allowed users can always create objects
o Allowed users can always push
o Allowed users can always run scripts
o Allowed users object's are not auto-returned

These options essentially over-ride the main land options, and make allowed users vastly more flexible as a feature.

Why is this good? It allows us to easily rent out land using scripted system, as to give a user creation rights, you just allow anyone to create objects, and have a low auto-return time. If someone places trash, and isn't on the allowed list, then their stuff is auto-returned, otherwise it isn't.
This is more flexible than using a group, because it is individualised for the parcel, so ONLY people on the parcel allowed list can place objects without them being returned, while with a group anyone in the group (even if they are renting a different parcel) can do it. Plus it avoids the issue of scripts being unable to automatically add people to groups in order to facilitate group-based land-rental.

Simple rental script:
- User A pays rent for an open plot
- Script adds user A to allowed list using llAddToLandPassList()
- User A can now build without items being returned
- User B places items, they are returned
- User A adds User B to their scripted rent box
- Script adds user B to allowed list
- User B can now build without items being returned

View the feature voting proposal

NOTE: The current design uses frames which is horrible, as such that link will not give you the voting sidebar, you have to click here to get that back.

I hate bumping, but is there no love for this?
It's basically scripted invites to a land group, which I thought a lot of people would want, especially anyone with a rental system somewhere. Unlike the "password protected group" idea, it allows for fully automated addition/removal of access permission on a per-plot basis, and removes the potential for abuse from using a group.

Last bump. But really, am I the only person who still wanted group invites via script, because seriously, this is the easiest way to do 99% of what scripted group-invites would be used for in practical terms.
The only reason I can think of to use a group over this is to get newsletters, but this is handled easily by opt-in (free to join) groups. Or the ability to give a user access to multiple areas by using a group, but this could be worked around with script communications using this idea, the framework for which is already sitting in LSL right now.

I mean we have the functions, but I daresay they're rarely used if at all, I myself have only ever used the add to ban list function for my security scanner to black-list people if they keep trying to squat in my house. By making the allowed list more useful by giving them special land rights just like groups, we would have all we need to do scripted rentals, prim-management and so-on. With the prim detecting functions being added to 1.13 it's a perfect next-step!

It's nice but it s not useful if you own an island only for main land rentals. What you really want is to transfer all the land rights except subdiving and selling to the renter, no?

Eh? I'm talking about scripted rental systems, for example for vendor space, apartments or land if you need.

ie you divide up land into some parcels, each one you want to have 50 prims to build with. Someone pays X weeks of rent into the rent box and for that period they can put up to 50 prims onto the land. 1.13 will help nicely with this as it can now detected if someone goes over (ie you test if the land has more than 50 prims on it).
However, the issue is that of controlling who can have items on the land in the first place, you don't want renters complaining they get warnings because someone else littered their land 500m up. So you switch auto-return on right? But to do that you need to have the renters join a group, which a malicious user could do too, or the renter has to wait to be added to the group (hence the issue of scripted invites) which is no good.

So if you wanted to give out land on a private island, you wouldn't let them buy it directly, you'd get them to pay a rental system which would add them to the access list for that parcel, allowing them to build etc, while keeping track of prim usage. The land wouldn't allowed building except for people in the access list, thus keeping it clean. This way you can automatically track rent payments and remove a person's access if they don't pay (which causes auto-return to kick-in and clear up their stuff).

Then you make your parcels and you make a different group for each parcel. Though you are limited to 25 groups but it 's not a big problem.

Linden state problem with scripted group invites:
The data for which groups you can invite for is not persistent across the grid. It travels with you and objects have NO WAY to find out if they can invite to a group.

So what if I want to run 26 apartments? And as Draco points out, the issue isn't that you can't use groups with auto-return, it's that you can't dynamically add people to them. You either have to make the group open, which defeats the purpose of using a group for this purpose, or you have to make the renter wait till they are added. Neither of which is very attractive.
So you either have poor land-management, or you have good land-management with flaws or poor usability for the renters.
However, using the Allowed List for each parcel (which is free and which all parcels have TODAY), is a perfect solution, as they can also be scripted to add/remove users dynamically (e.g when someone starts renting).

I got this e-mail reply from Kelly Linden (my e-mail pointed to this thread with a few comments):



So the idea's merits are at least recognised I hope =)

Sorry to sound negative but I dont like it. Let's say I am the renter. I have my group with my officers and my employees. I don't want to follow your organisation and add my group to your land list. I just want this land deeded to my group with the correct permissions and all is fine. What if an officer leaves my group then he or she would have access to land building still until I ask you to remove their name?

You want to rent me the land and I want to rent from you. Now we want a "Rent Land" button under "Buy Land", you set a correct price and period, you can limit some of the access, like for example not let me edit land because you want to keep it flat and that's fine with me. You wont need a rental script or anything else, once I rent the land I'm given the right to deed it to my group if i see fit, to set autoreturn if i want, and so on. That's more or less already how it works with island sims except that you "buy" land for the first period and the renter have all the rights on land.

The new LSL commands comming in the next update will allow for much better script based rental systems since it allows a script to see how many prims an object has.

The rental system could also get a list of up to 100 users that have prims on the land and the count for each.

You still can't have the script return objects using llReturnObject(key id), but it is still usefull since the script can IM you when you have a bad renter.

I mustn't be explaining myself very well
I'll try and address these:

@Brigit - this isn't to replace handover of land to groups. That's a special case where the person wants to "fully" own the land, I don't expect to see scripted systems capable of this in the future.
I'll do this on the basis of what I would like to do:
- Imagine I have a simultator, it has a load of nice little houses connected by streets. Essentially a perfect residential area
- I want people to be able to rent a home, and place any items they want inside it, allow anyone they like inside etc.
- I don't want other people's objects littering the residential area.

Current solution would be something like:
- Each house is on its own plot but is owned by the same group (e.g Haravikk's Rentals)
- Each plot has auto-return enabled so non-group items are removed
- When a renter pays my scripted object to rent the house, they are told to join the above group
- Now they can place their items

This is not ideal however, as people who are not renting with me could join the group and drop garbage about, or people who stop renting will not have their items automatically returned, instead the house they were in would have to remain closed while waiting for someone from my rental group to come along and clean it up. Also is the issue that ANYONE in the group can place items on ANY parcel, meaning your neighbours could fire weapons on their land and leave your garden full of shell casings or whatever without them being cleaned up.
Alternatively I'd have to make the group invite-only, in which case renters would have to wait before they can start placing items.

With the Allowed List being used, the renter, and people of their choosing (via the rent script) can be allowed to place items by the script (it just adds them to the parcel's allowed/access list). This way they don't have to be invited into a group, or have the security hole of an open group. So the system would run like so:
- Each house is on its own plot and owned by the same group (Haravikk's Rentals)
- Each plot has auto-return enabled so non-group or allowed list items are removed
- Renters pay the rental script in order to purchase that house
- Rental script adds them to the Allowed List for that house's parcel
- Renter can now place items

Now any trash that is placed is removed unless the user is part of the management group, or is on the allowed list for that house/room/plot. Also, if the renter stops paying, or leaves, then the rent script just removes them from the allowed list, and their stuff is returned. It allows for the creation of a very tightly run rental system which prevents trash lying around at high altitudes sapping people's prim-count and such. It also allows people to be granted access to a house/room on a per house/room basis, similarly with creating items. So just because someone owns a house somewhere else on my island, doesn't mean they can litter in other houses.
Access to the house would of course still be up to the script in this example.

@Grumble - those new features are going to be great for managing scripted rentals. But they only really help a bit with managing objects themselves.
In essence this suggestion would allow for a kind of llReturnObject(key id) system. Instead of returning specific objects, you set-up auto-return, then via a script allow people to place objects, whether permanently or temporarily is up to you.

Yes I understood and it would work but why would you use a rental system when you could rent the land directly in Land options? The next renter would return the items you wouldn't even have to worry about it.