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Please help me understand shields (esp the best one)

Fushichou Mfume
Registered User
Join date: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 182
09-15-2005 13:44
I'm still fuzzy on the various sheilds out there. I've seem some on other AVs, I've heard of ones like the Sion sheild, and I know generally what they do (protection from push weaps and some forms of attack by security scripts).

Can anyone explain the best shields, exactly what they protect against and don't protect against, etc. I've tried to research this myself but no sheilds seem to be sold on SL Exchange or SL Botique, and I can't find info in-game with the Find button.

I'm most interested, personally, in finding a sheild that will protect me from at least some of the undesireable effects of overzealous security scripts with 96-meter scan ranges and ridiculously unfriendly effects. I'm tired of trying to get from point A to point B without warning and getting squashed like a bug with no warning. I've heard that the Sion sheild, for example, can prevent some of this.

I'm also interested in sheilds that can protect you the best from a griefer idiot who is determined to hassle you with a push gun or a cager or the like.

Finally, I'm interested in which weapons can deal with a griefer who is himself (or herself) wearing a shield that prevent a typical security script from keeping them away from your property.

Thanks! Oh and please be specific about where to procure the shields or weapons you talk about here. An object name alone won't help me much.
Introvert Petunia
over 2 billion posts
Join date: 11 Sep 2004
Posts: 2,065
09-15-2005 14:46
What a curious posting. I was right with you until:
From: someone
Finally, I'm interested in which weapons can deal with a griefer who is himself (or herself) wearing a shield that prevent a typical security script from keeping them away from your property.
which struck me as wanting to be able to have your cake and eat it too.

For the first part of your question, most shields are based around the concept of detecting if a abnormally high force has been imparted to you and exerting an opposite force of (nearly) equal strength. These are good for avoiding overzealous "security systems" that at one point were considered by the Lindens to be a violation of the rules but which they don't seem to care much about any longer. Getting booted off world for having the poor taste to fly 100 meters above some nimrod's parcel on your way to something else is annoying as hell. I don't know anything about shield makers, sorry.

Now I have to ask, if you find annoying home defense system irritating, why are you also interested in anti-shield devices? Is it because you want to be more "impentrable" than you would like others to be? That hardly seems sporting ;) Futhermore, as everyone has equal access to the same scripting capabilites, this is an arms-race which does have an end (unlike real ones).

In fact, there is only one way to deal with griefers that doesn't risk you getting suspended from the game. It consists of: 1) ignore them 2) mute them 3) ban them using the land banning tools (not countermeasure scripts) 4) abuse report them 5) learn to let it roll off you. Griefers get their kicks from irritating you; deny them what they seek which makes it no fun for them. This may sound like a schoolyard approach to jerks, because it is.

Good luck in your quest.
Fushichou Mfume
Registered User
Join date: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 182
09-15-2005 16:01
Actually, I asked that last question because I also have a role as a bouncer at a club. If our Security System won't deal with a griefer, I need other ways to deal with them.
Eggy Lippmann
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 7,939
09-16-2005 02:25
Here's a great "shield":
Rez a prim.
Drop an "Animate on sit" script in it, and a standing animation.
Sit on it. The animation will play to make it look like you are standing.
For extra credit, drop a non-phys vehicle script in it, that also plays a walking animation, allowing you to still move.
No-one will be able to push you, not even by a millimeter, no matter how much force they apply to you, and you will be able to fire any sort of push weapon and fire all manner of physical objects without suffering any rebound.
Fushichou Mfume
Registered User
Join date: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 182
09-16-2005 07:17
Thanks Eggy, that's good info. It's a little awkward to use though. I'm still looking for anyone who can explain roughly how the more popular named sheilds work (Sion, Bergman, and others). I'm curious what else they protect from besides push weapon scripts, since I've heard some claims that don't make sense. I'm also curious why some weapons such as Winter Hatfield's "Shield Breaker" and others claim they can "punch through any sheild".

Is the whole shield idea "urban legend?" I'm surprised it's so hard to find them listed anywhere, yet I run into people fairly often who are wearing some type of shield. And they're not very forthcoming when I ask them about it, other than to say things like "it protects against every weapon except one", if they say anythign at all.
Eggy Lippmann
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 7,939
09-16-2005 07:33
Well, I don't know the products you mentioned, but the way most people go about countering llPushObject is with an attachment that gets your position and calls llMoveToTarget all the time, forcing your av to remain in place.
There are also anti-bullet shields that contain a shitload of sensors and attempt to llPushObject them out of the way.
When I was a noob I spent a lot of time in Jessie - I built the Bhodi Tree Gallery there, and provided Bhodi Silverman with free land for it, made her an "art will prevail" gun and random stuff like that.
There was also the Jessie subway project with Ryen Jade and Nicko Snow...
Fushichou Mfume
Registered User
Join date: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 182
09-16-2005 07:52
That helps, Eggy. See, even with the little bit I do know about the underpinnings of SL, I would generally choose to avoid using any device that is sensor-heavy because I know those degrade sim performance.

This might explain why the Framerate sometimes drops significantly when certain AVs who look like they're wearing shields have shown up at clubs I'm at (among other things like the hoochie hair and bling, etc.).
Mike Westerburg
Who, What, Where?
Join date: 2 May 2004
Posts: 317
09-16-2005 13:36
I would also like to point out that some of these sheilds use a few interesting script tactics such as the ability to make your av phantom (which I hear is going buh bye but I could be wrong) so certian weapons that are based upon pure physical contact will not work. As Eggy pointed out with the sit script and vehicle type motion, you can remain in place no matter what forces hit you. But there are weapons that perform the good ole llTeleportAgentHome function which there may be a blocker for now, without the blocker no sheild will stop it except we now hve the option of cancelling the teleport so it is a moot point. I have not figured out how some sheilds prevent hitpoints from being taken away in unsafe areas but those are far and few between and I think there are even countermeasures to those now too.

IMHO, the best sheild to have is not allowing the greifer to get to you and force you to play on their level. There are also instances where it may not be a greifing thing where they are actually in a place where these types of weapons are allowed but due to a client or sim issue they get knocked into a different area and happened to have the trigger pushed down during the transition which resulted in an unintended weapon discharge (it has happened to me, in combat sim in the middle of a firefight with the trigger down, get killed and tp'd home while in the mioddle of shooting only to find my weapon still firing the moment I rez out from the tp)

As for home security scripts, those are joke in themselves as items cannot be stolen, even if a car is stolen, more than likely it will just get autoreturned anyway. As for protecting items from getting moved, lock em up in the edit so no one can move them or drop a simple script in there that performs the block grab function and no one can move it no matter what. And why even try to protect those "special" pose balls? It isn't like there is the posibility of leaving ummm..... traces that they were used other than they may be in show mode.

I also crash my client more times than anyone greifing me has ever done, I think I have the physics engine mad at me and it is seeking revenge anyway. Word to the wise, do not greif the physics engine by trying to fly airplanes in manners that are not even remotely possible in SL, let alone RL. :D
"Life throws you a lemon, you make lemonade and then plant the seeds"
Websnake Nightshade
Registered User
Join date: 8 Oct 2004
Posts: 26
10-09-2005 06:48
Sorry to bring up this thread but I have to reply to this;

What you mentioned earlier about shields and being an urban legend is not true, they do exist and are seen often. However the whole technology is nowhere near supported by the Lindens and the technology itself is very advanced and cannot be widely distributed for certain reasons. Lets put it this way, they wouldnt be in such high demand if everyone knew how to do them right? I am currently working with a team of people to attempt to discover how to recreate the effects of these shields, that rez way before the projectile or agent even reaches its target. I have already attempted to rez at detectedpos but that is way too slow. Other attempts have been made to try to work with volumedetect, so far we have seen better results, but it doesn't block EVERY time and the whole setup is far too clunky to have on an avatar. If anyone can possibley contribute information to us, you can usually find us in sandboxes (Group is Con Vets). I would greatly appreciate it.
Malachi Petunia
Gentle Miscreant
Join date: 21 Sep 2003
Posts: 3,414
10-09-2005 07:05
Ooh, coolies, this is like discussing the best methods of whittling balsa wood into swords and bucklers! Enjoy! Oh except in this case, the balsa wood causes everyone in the world to slow down. Just get some C4 instead save yourself some effort (someone gave one to me, I rezzed it without recognizing the name, good thing the sim was empty but for me and the giver).