Will the market place ever progress?

This is not a thread about gerbils


I am not just referring to the value of the L$. I am referring to how business is done. As of right now we don't have a true economy. We have creators and buyers. Most people who create do all the different areas of business that a real life company has to think about.

They create a product, they package the product, they market the product, and they sell the product. For many reasons, main one being technology and permission issues, content creators are a one man/woman show. I know some groups work together in ways but for the most part the creator handles all aspects of running a business.

Here is one thing I have learned from real life though; no one is an expert in everything. That is why most companies have the manufacturing department, sales people, marketing executives, customer service reps, and financial geeks.

I am not trying to use this as a plug for my store, but let me give a short rundown of my RL background. I went to school for marketing. I know how to market. I am a firm believer that if you keep your product in front of consumer’s eyes long enough, they will try it. Along with that is knowing how to market it, what to say, how to display it, how you package it, basically making your product appealing to the masses. That is my constant goal. I think in a short time, I have taken my brand, and a large portion of the SL population recognizes it now. Yes, I needed a good product people would find interesting first, but really it is the marketing efforts I put in that got the bodies in my shops to discover the items I sell.

Will we ever see more service like marketing companies within our digital world? There are already avenues for marketing on billboards and such, so I think we are leaning in that direction. How about branding services? I know some are already doing graphics design and logo design, but I don’t see many creators heavily branding them selves. Most business in SL right now is done from word of mouth. Will there ever be a place in Second Life for the business services that real life companies have to turn to?

The reason I ask is because my experience is mainly in product branding. I am curious if there may be a market for me to extend my expertise into Second Life.

Excellent! observations Beau!

I've continued to think about that alot - and am interested in real promotions and quality marketing here in SL. I know from the SLEx experience that an unknown start-up businesses can make an impact in SL if you have the network, the expertise, courage and commitment...

I remain poised...

Well to state we dont have a true economy isnt exactly correct.

More correct would be to say we dont have a Modern Economy.

Before the industrial revolution, an economy of Artisan and consumer wouldnt be nearly so unusual for Luxury goods.

I would argue all goods in SL you pay for are luxury.

Considering SL is really the population of a small town, and the total needed commodities are fairly small. This might be the right way for business to run at the moment.

Right now its, Thats a nice outfit , where did you get it? -landmark is passed - the interested party flies to the botique. Shopkeepers are uneccesary as the shopping is automated. The item is purchased. And its over.

If the sales become so brisk that the artist needs a partner, they would have to find someone they trust to help.

What would be interesting to know is how some of the Busier/ More popular merchants right now feel about potential lost sales due to a lack of a sales staff.

Beau,

A problem us business owner/operators frequently fall into is operational myopia. I'm definately guilty of it - as I'm sure others are. When one person is so involved in all aspects of business operations, it becomes hard to see "outside of the box" and makes it difficult to position the business in the way the consumer WANTS it, as opposed to the way you feel it should be.

As such, perhaps a consulting company that offers a business analysis (market research) report would be a good enterprise. I know that I'd certainly hire a reputable firm to examine my store, its products, pricing, marketing initiatives, etc etc and benchmark them against others in the industry.

I'd certainly be happy to be a part of this consulting group - and I would wish to engage it for various projects.

What say you, the general population? Is a consulting firm a good idea?

Merwan you are an example of good branding, I think everyone knows who made SLEx such a known product.

Colette, I do not 100% agree with you. People do go on shopping sprees in SL. The population is growing and the number of people going on these sprees are growing. It's getting those people into your shop that could make all the difference. Again, you do need a good product to go along with it.

Jamie, you are right. Not many do think outside the box. Business analysis is exactly the type of service I am refering to. I am not saying we are at that point now, but are we heading there?

This thread is now about....

Are we headed there? I guess that depends. Institutionally speaking, probably not. The Lindens have made no mention that they envision us moving to this type of model.

Institution aside, perhaps. If this type of service catches on and generates value, those enterprises who use the service will begin to win out, necessitating general implementation of the service.

I guess we are headed there if someone leaps into the market and makes a go of it.

The Lindens? They would have nothing to do with this, SL is just the platform we all exist on. This is a question and business model that only the FIC could answer I guess

I admit I have gone window shopping for fun, and did a lot of impulse buying. Some of my friends are really shopping addicts and never can seem to save any money. Luckily Ive been playing MMOGs for so long im a bit jaded when it comes to the buy buy buy and online.

The point you make is an interesting one, IF you are correct , it should be possible to start up a modern corporation with all those things you mentioned, and steal market share from the Artists/proprietors.

However that should be up to some group of people to do. I dont see whats stopping any of the things you mentioned from happening.

I think the world is still too immature for the more evolved forms of commerce you are describing.

Actually I have been waiting for some of the larger shop owners to see the benefits of having a clerk in their stores. I hear one bitch from clothing shoppers over and over - "We want to see the items before we buy." The solutions that are being asked for seem to be either 3D mannequins or try-before-you-by.

Unskilled players (those that don't feel they have a good hand at building, texturing, scripting and the like) are constantly asking for ways to make Lindens. Many of them simply don't want to become part of the club employment area - host, escort, dancer, pimp, whore, etc.

So you hire a clerk. They can show off your products (instant 3D mannequin), give advice, answer questions, facilitate in solving problems, and the owner gets happier customers and much better feed back. There are many more reasons to have a clerk than to just exchange monies.

Until we have a permission set that allows multi-contributors and still exerts control of ownership (i.e., I own this item, set you as being allowed to place a script into it, place someone else as allowed to put a texture on it, place yet someone else as allowed to combine a number of my items into some bigger result), there really isn't any way to move toward a more modern economy -- the issue of trust and the reality of human nature get in the way.

Additionally, the 'clever hook' Linden Labs has in place countermands the natural progression of economy. Simply put, if you don't have a large or unlimited prim count, it is hard going to be a regular creator of content in the world.

Yes, I know, you can build in any sandbox.... but when was the last time you actually were allowed to concentrate in a sandbox? Trust me, between bombers, new hoochies begging for lindens or items, or the darn thing crashing just as you finish making something (Has happened to me five times now, and each time when I return, the item I've made is GONE. Not in 'Lost and Found', not in 'Objects', just gone), there isn't much peace for the content creator in the sandbox.

Beyond this, success in business in Second Life mandates certain skills that are not a high constant in the over-all population -- so there is a general maintenance of the status quo without a lot of room for progression beyond it. For example, I can learn Photoshop, I can learn Poser, I can learn LSL -- but I cannot draw and I am dyslexic. So my potential for being highly competitive in any of them is limited.

Do I blame Linden Labs for my lack of artistic skill? No. Of course not.

Do I blame Linden Labs for not taking dyslexics into account when building their game? No. You can't build for more than the lowest common denominator if you want to attract more of the market.

I think if Linden Labs were to code in more flexibility in content creation (e.g., segmented permissions to allow multiple contributors, more support for helping players find content creation work in the world, more reward to content creators who HIRE other content creators and thus, contribute to a cycle that would create a more modern economy) it would go a long way toward creating the kind of 'we can all do it' atmosphere that seems to be desired.

Demonstrating product is certainly a useful thing. With auto-logout disabled I often idle beside my shop and demonstrate my product when someone comes by. I've also got a referral commission system set up that would end up paying a dedicated person as much as L$1000, though I've yet to see anyone become a salesman for the product in the hopes of securing that much dough.

I was going to say exactly this. Less-developed economies have much simpler structures and thus much simpler business arrangements.

With that said, there are plenty of collaborative product arrangements I've seen in Second Life. The excellent Luskwood Creatures vendors sell animal costumes made by (I believe) Arito Cotton and Liam Roark, with eltee Statosky providing customer service and Arito doing amazing branding.

As for being a consultant for branding in-world, I think that certainly has its place, too. The trick will be finding an appropriate balance for money charged and time spent that the market can accomodate. As the complexity of Second Life increases, we'll see more and more diversity in our business structures, I am certain.

Shop keepers is definetly a job that I could see people paying for someday. My sales on nights I am online definetly increase. I am there to answer questions, offer help and point people in the right direction if they are looking for something specific. Again though, I am both the creaotr and store clerk.

I would be willing to pay someone to stand around in my shop(s) and wait there to sell/answer questions. I would see many benefits in this. Maybe start with someone during prime hours in the evening. If it works out hire a whole staff.

i suspect that ll is waiting for someone to do this themselves, as this is something the residents could do. though i think better tools for cooperative work would help this process along.

You really should include that as a notecard in your product. That way, when you give them to some unsuspecting person, they read it and the light bulb goes off and they say, "I'mma sell these damn things until every avatar in SL has one!"

Or something like that.

(Relevent aside -- paid salesmen, clerks, and marketing peeps do work. Most in SL either cannot afford to hire them, or do not understand the value they bring. Has no one ever wondered why it is that clubs will pay people to stand around and talk to people, but store owners will not? There's a bottleneck there, to be sure.)

That's because Collette is correct. The SL economy is not modern, it's medieval market-town proto-capitalism, dependent on individual artisans and small, temporary, guild-like organizations based on social relationships. It doesn't have features such as contract law, capital generation and investment networks, corporate culture, and mass production.



The other consideration is that SL is frontier-like. It may be a medieval market town, but as Beau pointed out, it's growing relatively fast. It's becoming urban and diversified in both attitudes and and values. If you want to follow the historical analogy, European middle ages to the Renaissance, you'd expect to see the development of crude financial institutions that serve to collect and redistribute capital. GOM and IGE, maybe. And you'd expect to see the rise of "merchant princes" - individuals who amass comparatively great wealth and/or power by controlling increasingly critical commodities. Land (which means prims) and Anshe Chung, perhaps.

Beyond that, the comparison breaks down. There's no perceived need in SL for a modern government to establish order and law to encourage economic growth. So no revolutions like the religious and political ones that occurred in 1517, 1776, 1789, or 1848, and no favorable economic climate as a result. And the need that compels people to tolerate corporate organizations, merely-partial compensation for the value of your labor (wages), and the discipline of mass production doesn't exist in SL: quitting doesn't mean you starve, can't pay your bills, and go to debtor's prison. Yet, anyway.

And I tend to agree with Colette: while there may be a much larger future market in SL that requires economic law, corporate organization, and mass production, I don't see it right now.

I'm not sure if "traditional corporations" in SL are possible. They could be, but only if the incentives were very, very high for non-owners who were hired. High incentives would impact on overhead and profit. So perhaps what's needed, for the present, is an updated guild arrangement.

Random thoughts.

Somebody do a "would you shop more at a place that had a shopkeeper/clerk on duty" poll. I am way to lazy and my lasanga is about to come out of the oven.

*wanders off to make garlic bread*

I tried and goofed. Sorry

While I agree the sandboxes are not the ideal place to build, I've spent much time in them, and never once had this happen.

Are you sure you didn't caught by the twice-a-day 3:00 deletion?

- Jon

I could see where you could possibly start a corporation

Lets say you make Jeans ..

You do not have the time and inclination to check your vendors, meet with customers, handle custom requests, etc.

So you form a corporation with 3 other people. By necessity two of these would have to be trusted friends.

To one person you give literally half your product line with full rights. To another you give the other half. These would be your retailers. The would set up the vendors and becuase their name is on the clothes , would get the IM's with questions. Income earned from Sales would , minus their commission, go back to you the majority owner and artist.

The third person you place on payroll and pay a salary and give a budget. This is your marketing person, and they handle advertizing and promotions.

Thus you would now have a simple corporation going.

However , would this be more efficent than a single artist? It would really be based on how much work there was to be done. And how much that work cost compared to Sales.


The way rights are handled right now either means the creator or someone they trust with their money, has the rights to sell the items.