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intentional feature limitations
Khamon Fate
fategardens.net
Join date: 21 Nov 2003
Posts: 4,177
11-11-2004 10:31
people are telling me here /54/22/27027/1.html that ll sometimes don't implement features just because they might be used by griefers. i'm aghast. i don't believe it's even a theory. this isn't true is it?
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
11-11-2004 12:14
From: Khamon Fate
people are telling me here /54/22/27027/1.html that ll sometimes don't implement features just because they might be used by griefers. i'm aghast. i don't believe it's even a theory. this isn't true is it?


It's very true.

This is why many script functions have a built in delay, for example. This is why script functions ask permission. This is why you cant attach items to avatars other than the owner of the script trying to attach the item, even if the other person grants permission. This is why there isn't any way to truely ban an avatar from a section of the map. Etc. Etc.
Trimda Hedges
Creator of Useless Prims
Join date: 19 Nov 2003
Posts: 247
11-11-2004 12:28
Yup, LL limits many things to keep the griefing down. Just go and ask any senior LSL junkie out there.
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Jarod Godel
Utilitarian
Join date: 6 Nov 2003
Posts: 729
11-11-2004 14:49
Taken from Paul Graham's essay Five Questions about Language Design:
From: Paul Graham
3. Give the Programmer as Much Control as Possible.

Many languages (especially the ones designed for other people) have the attitude of a governess: they try to prevent you from doing things that they think aren't good for you. I like the opposite approach: give the programmer as much control as you can.

When I first learned Lisp, what I liked most about it was that it considered me an equal partner. In the other languages I had learned up till then, there was the language and there was my program, written in the language, and the two were very separate. But in Lisp the functions and macros I wrote were just like those that made up the language itself. I could rewrite the language if I wanted. It had the same appeal as open-source software.


Now, to answer my friend and yours, Khamon...
From: Khamon Fate
...ll sometimes don't implement features just because they might be used by griefers.

Ask Lindens why we don't have fully, working XML-RPC... Spam griefers.

Ask Lindens why they never automated the announcements to help UK and Australian events... Griefers.

Yes, Khamon, they limit our ability to create. No, they don't realize they could just kick people for TOS violations. Add those together: The Lindens hinder development of Second Life by keeping potential griefers around.
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Khamon Fate
fategardens.net
Join date: 21 Nov 2003
Posts: 4,177
11-13-2004 07:20
i have been talked to, by several people, about this and i finally understand. i feel like a third grader that just realized multiplication tables represent multiple addition. duh.

i retract all my previous posts, cheers, complaints, arguments and stammerings about the development life cycle of the secondlife software. i had it all wrong because my premise was flawed. i'm too old fashioned and simple to think beyond the best way to produce utterly flexible, broadly avialable software. perhaps i'll learn one day. i posted my musing about it here: http://www.livejournal.com/users/khamon/1618.html

i don't slam the community focused attitude just because i don't understand it. i can't imagine trying to build and market useful software in such an environment. kudos to the lindens for being so brave and basing their careers on such a new and innovative concept.
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Azelda Garcia
Azelda Garcia
Join date: 3 Nov 2003
Posts: 819
11-13-2004 07:54
Ok, so: none of us want to believe it, but - unless your dream is 3D Yahoo Messenger - at some point you have to trust in what you know deep down to be true rather than in what you really, really, really want to take for reality.

If you're serious about what you're saying - maybe you are, maybe it's an off-day - there are a few options around. Obviously I'm sorta quite pro-OSMP (http://metaverse.sourceforge.net , all developers welcome), but it's not the only fish out there (eg Muppets, http://muppets.rit.edu ).

Azelda
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Azelda Garcia
Azelda Garcia
Join date: 3 Nov 2003
Posts: 819
11-13-2004 08:09
Well, yeah, thats the way it is, but.. what I dont understand is why the forums have a least a few people on them complaining about SL/Linden, but ... no-one is putting any effort into improving OSMP. It's really not that hard, it's a lot easier than LSL.

(And me? Well, been heavily involved in an SL project since start of September, but that's going to be over from dev point of view really soon, and then... who knows)

Azelda