**i Am Mr. Punching Bag!**

LOL maybe not quite Mr. Punching bag, but that sure is how I feel right now! Infact, for every person who includes "**PUNCH** in their response, I'll send you a free copy of my next release in SL, currently unanounced, but will be worth the 9 characters typed.

I feel like a punching bag, though! I used to play SL without any problems. I got a new PC fully capable of SL but running windows Vista back in September 2007. I was just coming back to SL after a year away, so I don't have that past year's perspective on how the game ran. all I remember was in late 2006 the game was flawless on my XP box.

Now I crash (basically freeze in game without ability to move) once every 10 to 30 minuites. at one time it was every 5 minutes, but that was traced to my ISP and resolved. If I use my XP box, the exact SAME box but rebuilt xp OS on it that I used before my upgrade, I crash but not as frequently.

I am wondering what is different now than when I played without trouble? my hardware is the same. same pc (my old xp box that used to run fine, and now doesn't after being rebuilt with the same copy of xp). and my new vista box, which crashes me every 10-30 minutes.

I've pretty much given up hope. I buitl a new pc for my girl, who lives in one state over( I live in PA, she lives in NJ) and she has no trouble whatsoever.

I'm wondering if it could be my ISP, or the something different that changed in the SL client to make it more ornery than a year ago? it used to like my netgear firewall, maybe now it no longer does?

Any advice would be appreciated!

-Alex Turner

Welcome back, Alex! A LOT has changed in the last year. First, can you share a few more facts with us? Ideally, post the machine specs from SL's Help/About dialog box. We'll be particularly interested in the video card(s) and amount of RAM.

If the vista box is running for 10-30 minutes, it isn't your firewall. Have you updated video drivers for either of these two machines recently? Keep in mind that your new machine (if you bought it retail), very likely has old drivers.

It could, of course, always be your ISP ... if you have Comcast, they have been limiting bandwidth for streaming applications during peak usage. Otherwise, you'd just have to monitor your actual bandwidth etc. to see if that's the issue.

There have been numerous threads from folks having troubles with Vista. Use the Advanced Search here in the forums, and search for threads with Vista in the title.

There are also a fair number of people saying that the most recent clients are plagued wih memory leaks. Have you tried Nicholaz's client? It is getting a little old now, but you can download it here: http://www.blueflash.cc/users/nicholaz/BleedingEdge/

Follow the installation instructions carefully. It is based on LL's open source client with bug fixes by Nick and others. As the instructions state, it requires that you first install the regular client, then install the matching version of Nicholaz's executable. It is the least memory-leaking option you have.

Good luck!

Oh, and **PUNCH**

thank you for responding, Nika! I'm guilty as charged when it comes to updating. I am lax on manual updates (video drivers) although windows update does itsown thing, as I'd forget to do it if I didn't leave it on auto update. I had this problem pretty close to the day I installed my new PC, and I put on all current drivers then. So I discounted drivers a bit prematurely, perhaps.

I decided to be a bit more proactive before continuing my whine here, as there are a few things I can do. I'm currently updating vista to SP1, and I plan on updating my video driver. I have a 7600gs. If after all that, I'll post again with specific information that you requested, as well as a rundown including all I am currently doing to bring my driver levels up to date.

Thanks again for the quick response, and you're registered as the first **PUNCH**! hehe.

I'll post back with an answer either way in a little bit. I have a feeling this vista sp1 is going to take a while to install.

-Alex

Ok! I have an update.

I did the following to my main PC, my vista box, in the following order:

1) went to windows update and updated to vista SP1
2) installed the latest driver for my video card from www.nvidia.com. I have a 7600gs, and updated to version 169.25
3) I reinstalled my driver for audio, as SP1 broke it.

my PC is an HP slimline S3100y. Its not a meaty PC, but with the video card I have installed it handles most things well. I'd like to note that the video card I have installed was specifically selected because it fit within the 25watt allowance for my power supply, and any problems I'm experiencing is most likely NOT because the video card is overdriving the PS. I don't have any problems in any other application or game, and I do quite a bit on this PC. EQ2, WOW, Tabula Rasa, perfect world, star wars galaxies, DAoC, as well as my 3d modeling apps (carrara 6, hexagon, poser 7, daz studio 2.0) work just fine.

Here's the snipped from SL's Help about:

Second Life 1.19.0 (5) Feb 28 2008 17:18:12 (Second Life Release)

You are at 0.0, 0.0, 0.0 in Sim_name located at sim4737.agni.lindenlab.com (63.210.159.133:13006)
Second Life Server 1.19.2.83236

CPU: Intel Core 2 Series Processor (1600 MHz)
Memory: 2046 MB
OS Version: Microsoft Windows Vista Service Pack 1 (Build 6001)
Graphics Card Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation
Graphics Card: GeForce 7600 GS/PCI/SSE2
OpenGL Version: 2.1.2
LLMozLib Version: 1.1.0 (Mozilla GRE:1.8.0.12_0000000000)
Packets Lost: 0/2519 (0.0%)
Viewer Digest: 6b1bac12-2a86-e1f2-aa5e-3108db5c8eeb

I manually zero'd out my sim name and coordinates. I realizeda fter I copied to clipboard and exited out that I was in my designing bunker. LOL. don't want visitors. I did leave the server url and address.


After everything I did, I'm still having the same problem. I will be in game, and basically I cannot move and when I hover over items, I get "retrieving name..." for owner when I crash. voice and video will still work, but all other interraction with the world will not.

I'm at my wit's end. any help is much appreciated.

-Alex Turner

Well, don't give up hope quite yet.

That PC is pretty feeble for SL running on Vista ... 1.6GHz, 2G RAM, pretty slow (but acceptable) video card. A couple of followup questions and then a couple of ideas:

> How much memory does the video card have?
> Before you crash, is your PC swapping a lot? That is, does the disk appear to be running continuously? That would indicate that you are actually running out of memory.

Now on to suggestions:

1. There was some noise about the 169.25 driver, particularly with the older nvidia cards. For example: /111/30/228610/2.html#post1901039

Others find 169.25 works OK, certainly with the newer (e.g. 8800) cards.

2. Do you have the options cranked way down? I'm not sure what client you're using, so don't want to get into describing buttons, but basically crank everything way down and see if you last longer. Particularly, turn VBO rendering off, run full-screen (as opposed to in a window), turn off 'friend notification' popups, and try setting your graphics card memory to SMALLER than it actually is. On my laptop with 512MB, XP, and integrated Intel graphics, SL will run for hours so long as I set the graphics memory to 32MB. *shrugs*

3. Be sure you don't have any other big programs running WHILE you run SL. E.g. memory hogs such as your 3D graphics programs, or even MS Word. Also, be aware that updater programs running silently ... such as windows update, java update, virus checker updates ... can sometimes steal enough cycles from a low-power processor such as yours to cause you to lose contact with SL's servers (crash).

Good luck!
.

.

Alex, You are correct, it IS your Netgear firewall!

I would bet it is an older model like the FVS318. That is what I have and I have the exact same trouble. If you set your Default DMZ Server to your computer's IP address the lockups should stop. This shows that the problem is in the firewall, but is not really an acceptable solution.

If you look in your security logs right after a freeze-up you should find a bunch of 'Suspicious UDP Data' entries that are not on SL ports. What I am thinking is the older Netgear firewalls are to slow to process a rash of security blocks and the massive online game traffic at the same time, confusing its little firewall brain.

I am hoping that a newer firewall with higher throughput will fix this situation. Possibly a Netgear FVS338. If you have found another solution please let me know. If Others have used this firewall with success then please tell me about it. If anyone has had trouble with the Netgear FVS338 running Second Life then I REALLY want to know before I spend $200!

**PUNCH**

What I find interesting is advice from Lagging Lab (a.k.a. Linden Lab or LL) to always use the latest driver, but then will read countless postings here in the forums where some latest driver does not work! I chalk that particular "which way is up?" to the obvious and continuing cluelessness of Lagging Lab. Why test when you can merely suggest?

Lagging Lab blindly and invariably offers that default knee-jerk response (i.e., most current driver) to most problems, but those of us who actually use SL outside of Lagging Lab in the real world of countless different computers and configurations use the drivers--current or previous--which *work*.

(And yes, the client does have memory leaks Lagging Lab seems unable--or unwilling--to fix. It's still there in the latest release and after all these years. )

Thank you all for your help.

Renouf: Thanks for the message in world. I forgot to check back here, as I've given up hope. I *DO* have a 318. hehe. all through 2005 to end of 2006 when I played SL, I had no trouble with it at all. so if it indeed is the trouble, something changed in the client/server architecture since then. I made the change you suggested to test (although I loathe the idea of leaving that on permanently, as it circumvents the concept of having a firewall completely. lol. Unfortunately, I made the change just now, and I have to go to work in about 30 minutes. so I"m leaving myself logged in up until the very last minute, as even a half hour without crashing would be a large feat. I will post back my results. and if it works, it looks like I'm either going on the warpath to get LL to fix whatever changed inthe past 2 years, or buy a new firewall as this one is kinda old.

Nika: thank you for the advice, but I can sum it all up with "been there, done that". hehe. I play with my options turned almost all the way up, and do so with very good results. The 7600gs and dual core 1.6ghz processor isn't as feeble as one may think. It does about the same or marginally better than my secondary system, a 3.1ghz HT P4 with 6800gt card. I did turn down my graphics, as well as disabled all major features like video, sound, and voice. I played with an infinite combination of slider positions for bandwidth, and nothing seemed to make a difference.

If the firewall trick didn't work, I'll post back. heck, I'll post back either way to let everyone know.

thanks again for all the help and comments!

-Alex

OOPS. Looks like I posted that reply last night while logged in as my other account. hehe. At any rate, I logged onto SL right when I got home from work this morning.

Sofar I've been on an hour and a half without a "freeze". That has happened before, but it is rare, especially in the sim I primarly have land in.

So it looks like at long last I figured out why I freeze.... Darn netgear firewall!

Thanks Renouf, for lending your expertise to my problem.

-Alex

I have seen a lot of people saying that this latest update caused them to have problems, kind of like stepping into the ring with Mike Tyson, it's like a **PUNCH** to the jaw.

P2