Can LL increase mainland sim populatoin limit?

i know that a sim only holds 40. My club pushes that limit and neighbors in the sim complain because they cannot access their parcels. What are the ethics about a situation like this and can LL do anything?

You know, MilosZ, I think just from the fact you used the word ethics, you already know the answer, but maybe would prefer not to admit it.

LL can't or won't do anything. If you wish to do so you have a free hand to ruin the experience of your neighbours, devalue their hardearned land by real significant US$ amounts they cannot afford to lose, and force them to go to the public sandboxes to build, like the penniless newbies they once were.

You can do it, many do.

But if you are concerned about ethics I would suggest some voluntary restraint, like this.

Never, never pay anyone to idle on your land whilst away from the console, unless the number of people in your sim is below ten. This adds insult to your neighbours injury.

Only allow more than ten people on your parcel for definite events lasting not more then three hours a day. Change the hours of day around a bit in case a neighbour can only get onj at fixed times. But make it a good event, and take the sim to max if they are willing to come. Have the occasional day when no such event occurs at all.

Actively advertise your club if you feel the need - Do not try to get into the "Popular Places" top twenty. Most people bribe their way in via camping chairs etc (at least at first) and any serious attempt to join them will almost certainly corrupt you.

Otherwise the rule is the same as for life. Develop the skill to empathise and put yourself in the position of the other. Impartially. Be it Palestinian, Israeli, or sim neighbor. If this shows you that you are wronging someone, maybe abusing a power you shouldn't have been given - Stop doing it.

A Mainland sim is limited to 40 avatars (or 30 in some cases). Private islands are limited to 40 by default but can be increased at the owner's discretion. As the covenant owner of the Mainland, Governor Linden would have to offer a higher limit to everyone.

Realistically a sim starts being in trouble at around 20 avatars depending on how close they are to one another. If your club doesn't take up the entire region, I'd bet it's already operating poorly in terms of end user frame rate. You are not alone, however, there are a couple of Popular Places locations (all with casinos) that aren't wholly-owned sims. Even without that many avatars you'll find casino locations cause tremedous lag.

Because Second Life doesn't restrict avatar prim attachments or scripts you really won't find a solution to performance, even though that is not the question you are asking. You might want to consider it, however, because what fun is there to be had when even something as simple as chatting becomes laggy (and it doesn with that many avatars in a small space)?

A firends land is in Meyon and an idiot casino owner has put camping chairs in the sim 40 of them at a high er rate and has made the sim virtually unusable for the other residents his casino spills over to the adjacent sim Gwail i assume he will be blocking that up to in the near future Greed is the watch word here, if u wanna get a bad in world name for yourself then continue what ur doing or u cud work with ur neighbours and create a decent enviroment

I hope LL allocates sim resources pro rata one day ie: U own quarter of a sim u can use a quarter of the resources ie 10 people in ur club, half sim 20 people etc, that will encourage club, casino owners to invest more into the game to run a club/casino

Just my 2pence worth

Peace

I used to have problems with camping chairs dragging my region down to about 2fps if I was lucky.

The solution? Ask a Linden to take a look at it, and suggest a region reset may clear the lag problem.

Those who were genuinely actively in the region doing stuff get a couple of minutes warning to finish what they were doing, and then can go back immediately after the region restarts, giving them perhaps a minute or two inconvenience for the benefit of everyone.

Those who were camping get logged out and stay out until they return to their computer. Frankly, who cares about those parasites anyway?

Lewis

Actually a sim can easily handle 40 users or more depending on a few variables. First off many many clubs are overly scripted or they have bought everything and alot of the bought things are lag inducing when put into proximity. Some Clubs like Club Republik for instance can take 37 people without many people having many people have problems and the sim stays pretty stable. Thats because we took the time to script stuff ourselves and dont have a ton of particles nor rotating light based objects or just many lag inducing things in general.

Scripting was kept to a method to cut down to keep script lag lower so people can actually enjoy themselves and can use like and ao or a mg without causing a big to do on the land itself. We also bought up about 2/3 of the sim and have one side controlled in an almsot park/garden like setting and our neighbor has an asian castle. We had some problems a little while ago with the sims being unstable for a little while as im sure alot of people had noticed in many sims across SL but that was about it. Again it depends on alot of variables.

And it would be nice to have more people available but at the same time it does pull resources. As their hardware at LL gets better we may see the # of people go up but i dont think it will drastically go up. Control of scripts is key to not causing lag and i agree this guy could find out when his neighbors are on more often or do some things to cut down on the amount of people there. Its a viable solution unless he is ready to buy a sim or buy and area where not many people are living and control msot of it which can get costly.

Furries and robots have probably the most trouble with this, seing that their entire avatar is mostly prims plus scripts if their tails move or eyes blink. :/

My only suggestion is one that has been deemed 'greedy' in that you might want to look at shifting the club over the border of two sims. If you aren't using camping chairs, this would cause the two servers to share the load and possibly free up some of the 'population limit' for your neighbors.

With all respect, Ellie, I think the fact that he's asking means he's concerned about finding a balance between having a successful club and being considerate to his neighbors, don't you? It doesn't have to be one or the other - or at least, it shouldn't.


Let's be over-dramatic


He killed the camping chairs already, but the club has remained crowded.


Milosz' club does not meet your usual club definition. They very rarely have real events (good lord, if he did he could bring down the grid). People show up, hang out and chat - and pair off for hanky panky if they want, but most just enjoy being somewhere that there aren't any raffle balls, no major particle/bling lag to speak of, and no pressure to do anything other than what they wish to do. Some dance, some chat, some make new friends, some pixel-bump, there's no formal structure. It's a pretty laid-back club.


Milosz hasn't 'wronged' anybody, he's only following his heart and head. I think he's already developed the skill to empathize or he wouldn't have posted this. He wants a place like this that lets people be themselves and have fun, not another "sexy av contest" club. Not another high-pressure event site. He doesn't even spam the members' group for events like so many do.

It's a successful formula, but it's too bad that SL's infrastructure won't handle heavy lifting. For all their talk about a million residents I thank the Bling Gods that we will never reach that number -- to get close to that would bring LL's precious asset server whimpering to its knees.

I feel for Milosz' neighbors, I really do - I've lived next to clubs that were much worse than this one, though. And it's been my experience that all things in SL are transitory. It may be successful now but in another month or two there will be another magnet drawing residents, and then it will be some other neighbors' problem. Meanwhile I'm not sure what he can do other than close his club down - and that contradicts the whole point of having a club at all, doesn't it?

I would suggest :
*1* if your place is *very* low lag, ask in the land management forum to have the sim's maximum agent limit boosted.
*2* if not, move your place so it sits over the borders of 2 or more sims, sharing out the agent load.

WARNING : you *will* want to check that #2 works before doing it! (I am not sure it will)

I know in the past it has been a problem to place builds so they straddle a sim border. Used to be that if you built in the 5M or so along the edge of the sim, that build tended to be unstable. It can be done, but you're dealing at best with two seperate parcels that can't be joined, and thus have different access lists and ban lists, and two seperate buildings that have to be lined up.

Also, a club straddling the border of two or more sims, and potentially attracting 2 sims worth of people in a small area, would likely cause far more lag in both sims than one club in each sim ever could. Can you imagine the lag if a sim-straddling club got 80 people attending their event at once? 40 in each sim?

Personally, I think the most 'ethical' thing to do, if you have a wildly popular club, is to buy a private island, position it at least one void sim away from any other sim, and use that as a dedicated place of business for the club. Then you won't adversely affect any other residents. Of course, to do that, you'd also have to make the club financially self-sustaining, which is almost impossible in the current SL economy.

If your club is even moderately successful, it might be worth looking into getting a private island to run it on.

Seriously - its not just better for your neighours, its probably a lot better for you too!

You have access to a LOT of space - an entire sims resources to run scripts in, you can scale up - or down - the amount of prims you can have there, the estate tools are MUCH better to handle griefers and banlists, and of course you can also scale how many avatars your sim can handle.

You get traffic for the entire sim as well - and traffic will reflect on your placing on search places.

Also the costs aren't THAT high for anyone running a moderately successful biz.. consider:

You can get around the 1k+ setup cost by buying an island off someone who either wants to get rid of one, or from someone who brokers them (schwanson leaps to mind).. thats what I did... took over my island from someone else and ended up saving a few hundred dollars.

Lets look at the $200 a month island cost... sure that figure looks a lil daunting - but really its not that much.... spread over 30 days thats only around 7 bucks a day.

7 bucks a day and saying 'well Lindex is around the 290 mark lately' - and you can see that 2150 L$ will give you $7.15.

So - if you can make around 2150L$ a day with your club - you can afford an island with 0 cost past setup.

Not a bad deal - and you'll be much better off.

Oh thank god. I actually stopped going when the chairs popped up.

I have posted a similar post here regarding population and *normal* traffic.

/130/ac/133387/1.html

If the club is that successful then doing an island is the way to go, since that is the only way to control population, lag and work with the neighbors. I mean if somebody on the sim has a party with 10 people and there are a few others on the sim, then you automatically limit your club to 30 or less people and on many mainland sims the lag potential with all of that is just horrendous.