Help Stop Griefing! Vote for Prop 244

While admittedly, the ideas in prop 244 would have done little to stop the hijinks that ensued tonight....

I'd like to take this opportunity to remind everyone to check out Prop 244, and vote.

"Better Mainland Land-Parcel tools to help prevent grief before it happens"

Click the link in my signature.

I realy hope this get the press it should. Because if LL cares anything about the game they wil stop this kids from doing this to this great game. Otherwise we are going to lose more and more newbie and oldbie players.

fuck that noise, I have enough trouble trying to fly from one place to another as it is

typical politian taking advantage of a tragedy for a photo opportunity. WTG, you win at the innernets

Agreed here. If we're flying over your land, you shouldnt be able to damage our vehicles - hell, can you shoot down a passenger plane if it flys over your house in RL?
==Chris

Hrm... good point, and definately wasn't the intention behind the suggestion to disrupt flyover traffic.

However, in the proposal, I did ask for height limits, and for features to be able to be applied within a 3-dimensional bounding box.

Let me describe the in-world example for how this came up:

Crowd of people in a small area. Newbie decides to rez "Dodge Ram Pickup 2.0" - and runs as many people down as he can with it until he's ejected.

I would have preferred to *prevent* that behavior before it started. What if physics could be disabled within 5m of the ground? Short enough distance to not disrupt vehicles flying overhead - but not interrupt Avatars standing on the ground.

Thoughts?

Politician? I don't get it Heuvadoches. This is a plea to check out a Feature Request on the voting tool. Not get me elected to Teh Internet. Do you understand how the feature voting tool works?

When a global grief attack is going on, and there's a feature proposal out there that's intended to prevent grief.... I'd say that's a good time to bring it up.

Maybe someday you'll get griefed on your property, and try to use the existing tools to stop it. Good luck with that.

You got my vote.

As for the passenger plane analogy, no you can't shoot down a passenger plane that flies high over your RL land, but RL has laws to keep those planes miles overhead. Were the pilot to decide to land on your front lawn and he give you reason to believe he's a threat to you and your family, then you would be within your rights to shoot him. In RL, you don't get to own the sky any more than you do in SL, but in RL you do get to say who can do what on and over your land up to a reasonable altitude. We should have the same ability in SL. 30 meters is nowhere near enough for bans to be effective, and there's currently no way whatsoever to stop objects.

So voted.

- Tengu Yamabushi

You can never STOP grifers. They will only find another way, while attempts to stop them just restrict the rights of regular players.

You're right to a point, Hank. You can't eliminate grief 100%. But I do think there are steps we can take to be proactive against it, and not all those steps require us to restrict the rights of regular players.

For example, say we had a checkbox on our parcels that could disable all sound effects. Having that functionality alone would help stop grief at live music events, game shows, and other gatherings. There would be near zero infringement on the rights of other players there. If someone really wants to play the Badger song, they can go to another parcel.

Other items, such as blocking push physics, are more contentious - and you're absolutely right... it could restrict the rights of regular players if implemented poorly. Its critical that a balance be struck between what gives us the most freedom while still discouraging abuse. I'm uncertain where that balance should be, but today at least that balance seems to be tipped in favor of the griefer.

Broken down bit by bit as an administrator on two sims who regularly finds the land tools useless:


**Ability to stop all sound effects
A+. This is one of the biggest nuisances I encounter.

**Ability to stop objects from entering my parcel owned by a banned Avatar.
Just as good. Banned but still flying with this option = No unwanted C4s/Headcrab spam or retaliatory bombing.

**Ability to stop shouts/says/whispers from entering my parcel from the immediate area.
Probably impossible with the current system, but would be nice.

**More granularity in blocking outside scripts... such as...
Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

*****************blocking push scripts, from guns, bombs, etc.
YES. Especially if selective by "Block if Strength over X".

*****************blocking physics from vehicles, etc.
No. Would be covered by blocking objects. Why potentially infringe on normal users?

*****************blocking outside particle systems
Yes. No more annoying particle bombs.

**More granularity in blocking "build"on an AV by AV level, instead of everyone.
YES.

**Ability to *move* any object that is on my parcel, regardless of owner without returning. (Case in point: ghosts. Would have been nice if i could have dragged the ghost of that 20m giant monkey into the ground after the creator logged.)
No. Too much potential for abuse, and ghosts? Relog. Moving it wouldn't work anyways.

**Ability for landowner or delegator to right-click & TP home an avatar with warning
Yes. Having to do this with a security script is ludicrous.

**Ability to better delegate these permissions to individuals without using groups
No. Two words; Admin Staff.

**Ability to determine "who did what" easily without having to search for object beacons.
Likely impossible without correlating use-stats to inworld traces. A "Find all objects belonging to X" option would be nice, however, without having to highlight in the return menu.

**Ability to "silence" an AV while on my parcel (Temporarily to cool things down. 15 seconds is not enough.)
Global mute? Now we're leaving the realm of antigriefing and entering censorship. No.

**Allow a ban list to include groups rather than just individual AV's, and don't limit the length of that list to just 50.
Yes.

**Ability to define the range of effect of these tools in 3-dimensional bounding box
99.9% likely to be damn near impossible in the current system. Perhaps not with a llDefineLandFlag script function, however. Linden? Your call.

Although I believe people have the right to protect there land such a thing would ruin the fun for most, especially for me as I like to fly around and meet people.

Surely theres other methods of protection?

Can you post the link so I don't have to enable sigs just to click it?

Sorry about that, Vivianne... I should have thought of that.

The Link is here: Prop 244

Thanks. Sorry but I hate enabling sigs because some people get... large.